589 replies to this topic

[bira]

I think in life, as a rule, you need to argue the things that actually bother you, and not be argumentative for the sake of argument. It weakens how seriously you are taken, if you complain just for the sake of complaining.

With all due respect, le chat noir (love the username btw), you are doing just that right now.

I can't think of many websites - including subscription websites - that have as little ads, and as little obstrusive ads, as autosport.com does.

More to your point, though, Page & Moy could not be considered an ad. They are our partners, their help and support allows us to provide the F1 coverage that we provide. And for you to complain about their logo - hardly the size of 15 pixels high (that's less than the space your nickname) - appearing on the F1 news pages and outside of the actual report, without blocking ANY text at all (there was a blank space there when the logo wasn't on), is really, really, really petty of you.

I refuse to believe that this actually bothers you. Absolutely don't buy that.

What's more, there is no change of policy here. We've had throughout 2005 an identical situation in the WRC news pagers, with Ford RS. In fact, the logo was slightly bigger than Page & Moy's.

One thing I would suggest you bear in mind: the autosport.com subscription is one of the cheapest to be found online or offline.

For comparison's sake, take a look at the F1-Live prices. They're at least twice more than autosport.com - and I think there can be no arguing that autosport.com has much more original material, much more exclusive and breaking news, etc.

We have maintained low prices to a large extent because we also sell advertising or do sponsorship deals.

I am extremely proud - not just as an editor, but as a web user myself - that we offer a clean and unobtrusive service, which constantly takes into account the users and not only our commercial bottom line.

We have invested a lot of money in making this website extremely fast - I don't think anyone can deny neither Atlas F1 nor Autosport.com nor Autosport-Atlas have ever been as fast as our service is now; we have invested and continue to invest money, efforts and time into improving our content - and the launch and testing coverage of the last couple of weeks should prove that to you.

So now let's start again: what is it exactly that is actually and really bothering you? What is it exactly that you are complaining about, and are you sure you have a reason to complain?

[le chat noir]

Ok.
Firstly, I love Autosport, especially the website. I love it.
In fact I was very nearly working beside you, and it is to my eternal frustration that I am not. (I was interviewed by Damien Smith way back in 2001, I believe. It was my first ever job interview, and did go rather well I think. However, the role was in conjunction with a WRC website, now deceased, and my knowledge there is not so strong - hence I didn't spot last years ads on those pages.
Anyway, I digress, but I just want to be clear that I love the site and care about it.

Given that, I was not raising the subject just for the sake of it, I have too much respect for the site for that. Further I have often wanted to praise the site for numerous things but had not, until yesterday, discovered the Atlas F1 forum (bit dim of me, granted, seeing as I click Racing Comments several times a day. For the record, it was the ridiculous moved thread on Autosport descending into tabloidness that brought me to it. Because I had to defend you).

I spotted the ad straight away this morning. When it followed into the news pages, I was actually shocked. I know you like to keep the site ad free, I know you pride yourselves on that. I had a long conversation about that with Damien. I was perturbed not too long ago by the use of pop-ups on my beloved site, but knew not where to address them, but relieved by your stance on the fact you keep them out of the members areas. I have a lot of admiration for that.

So, I was not complaining for the sake of complaining and I'm slightly hurt by that. Its not neccessary to say. Though, I admit, my second post was less formal, and exagerating the situation, but that is the best way to stress an argument. Its a trait from my philosophy degree. Take an argument/theory/stance to the extreme and you see it for what it is. (And they don't all fail it.)

Now, I knew not that Page & Moy were your partners. (Nice use of Ronspeak, though I realise they are more than (itv-f1) sponsors) (Again, slightly dim of me, perhaps, but that was all I needed to know really, from you. That you were increasing thier recognition in your business).

Given that, I think it totally acceptable that they appear on your site and in the news stories. But why aren't all the stories in association with them? (Thats not a complaint, but I am saying it just for the sake of it, and now I would actually like you to say that you intend to roll them out everywhere, it would only seem fair!)

I know not of other websites, either. I don't see the need. Yours is the best, the industry standard. I'm somtimes taken to them through the forum, but they're all so ugly I don't know how they survive.

I do recall, though, that you did state that there were no ads once inside, and while I now accept the Page & Moy reference, I do struggle to understand how the Ford RS ad was allowed given that, they're not partners are they? Which is your reasoning with Page & Moy. Obviously, though, its your site, and you can do what you like with it, so I am arguing now just for the sake of it, and don't need a response here.

I used to be given free access to the site, it lasted over a year. This was when you first began the subscription to the site. So I was annoyed that the policy that allowed me that was revoked. Now as a proper customer I take more care in understanding the way the site was run. I do understand how the site is paid for, I am still a working journalist and regardless am blessed with common sense.

Basically, what I'm saying here is that I am as proud as you in its clean and unobtrusive service. I would hold it up as the best site on the net. Given that, I think it useful to you that I raised this issue. Perhaps it would have been better if I'd spotted the Ford RS at the time, but better late than never. The point is that because of the pride that I share with you I thought it important that I raised my displeasure. Not knowing about your partnership, it could have been a Coke ad, you see. And I think that you too would have agreed with me in my original post if that had been the case. If not to reverse the situation, because I know that would never happen, but to strenghten the feeling that your unobtrusive ad stance is the right one. It is, in fact, a back-handed compliment.

I am extremely pleased with the way the merger with Atlas has worked. Not having known of the site before hand, I was concerned by it, but it has improved the service no end. (I would like it if the forums, which are the best I've found btw, could be turned to an autosport colour scheme)

I hope thats clearer. I did not mean to offend, just needed to know about the partnership thingy, and that its not a trend of more ads being placed inside the site (other sponsorships like this one are fine, the standard is now set).

The colour of the ad I found distracting, perhaps as its knew, and thats what bothered me to make that point. I'll get used to it though, and it'll fall into the background - please don't make it flash! Thats a joke.

So complaint resolved.
Congratulations on being the editor of the worlds best website. I mean that with the utmost sincerity.
Thanks for the props on the username. Any chance of being contacted when a new position in your tutelage arises?

Best
lcn

[bira]

Originally posted by le chat noir
I spotted the ad straight away this morning. When it followed into the news pages, I was actually shocked.

Funny that. We've had it on all F1 news pages since the start of the year. So for three weeks you didn't even notice it

I think there's not much more to say. Only a reminder what it is we're talking about....



Like killing a fly with a shotgun

[le chat noir]

It was still the first thing I saw this morning. And my point still stands. More telling, to my mind, that things can't be addressed in a proper fashion.

[bnlflo]

on topic (i.e. suggestions):

Would you please please please (with sugar on top) use Sutton images again? They are way better than the XPB stuff, IMO.

[Al.]

Just a thought, but is it possible to add to the 'Launch Dates' section when it is thought the new cars will run. For example there's no date for the McLaren lanch, yet the MP4-21 is running round with pictures for us all to see

The reason I ask is that I was curious as to the first running date for STR with their new car, and it would be easier to see the date there in the 'launch dates' (which is the same as Red Bull who already have the RB2 running round) rather than scouer the news items for when it might be.

Edit: You should probably add Super Aguri to that list as well.

[Al.]

I did a quick search and saw that this had been touched on post 516 but I couldn't see whether the query was resolved.

Thus:
I see that the news filter obviously attaches something to the cookie to remember your settings. However that seems at odds with the links under the F1 news and the motorport news on the home page.

I have the news filter set to 'all', at the moment if I click the link 'View all F1 headlines' on the front page the result is all the headlines (not all the F1 headlines) appear. If I then filter the headlines to be only F1 and on my next visit to the home page click 'view all motorsport headlines' I get only F1 headlines.

Once in the news the filter is useful, but I'd have thought the link 'view all F1 headlines' should link to F1 headlines and 'view all motorsport headlines' should link to all motorsport headlines regardless of what the filter is set to.

[Costaz]

Can we ask for a technical analysis of the Mp4-21? I just checked the past issues of the journal and I don't think we had one..

Cheers,
C.

[bira]

You will have a technical analysis of ALL cars, so the MP4-21 is no exception.

[Red ITC]

Thanks very much for adding the audio Bira, it works great and the Audience with Flavio had me laughing out loud. Bravo.

[Sir Frank]

Im using my.autosport mostly. The main value of this service is that an individual user can select the content for himself. This is a service I value a lot. It saves me time and gives me exactly what I need. However with AS taking over new, non F1 pictures have arrived, which is fine but I dont really want them on my.autosport page. Is there any chance that non F1 pictures could be filtered out?

[ttgh]

Originally posted by bira


Funny that. We've had it on all F1 news pages since the start of the year. So for three weeks you didn't even notice it

I think there's not much more to say. Only a reminder what it is we're talking about....



Like killing a fly with a shotgun

I've grown accustomed to, and now enjoy the site having not liked it at first. However, I think that I might agree with Le Chat Noir: This is a graphic advert on a subscriber page. You still say

FACT: autosport.com has no graphic ads at all in subscribers-only pages

on the sales blurb for non-subscribers. It doesn't matter that it's small, or that the content of the site is great - it's the fact that graphic ads are creeping in where we were told (and potential new customers are told) there wouldn't be. This raises concerns that other things will change that we were told wouldn't be.

It's still the only place I get my F1 news and personal views - the forums - from (other than rasf1), and I don't see that changing.

Cheers
Graham

[baddog]

Originally posted by ttgh
This is a graphic advert on a subscriber page.

Thats funny it looks like a text ad to me. I see letters in two fonts, but graphics I see none.

Shaun

[ttgh]

Originally posted by baddog


Thats funny it looks like a text ad to me. I see letters in two fonts, but graphics I see none.

Shaun

That's funny, the HTML looks like it's an image to me. I see an IMG tag and an ALT tag, but plain text I see none.

http://www.autosport...ges/pam_sm.gif" width="240" height="21" border="0" alt="Page & Moy">

If it's just text they want to show, then why not have just text?

Cheers
Graham

[bira]

"If it's just text they want to show, then why not have just text?" We did have just text - the exact same text - initially. But the change in colour didn't look good, and leaving it the same as the "F1 News" actually looked confusing. We thought it would be clearer and cleaner if we used an image for the text. It does not change the fact that it's just that - text.

Anyway, why are you wasting your time (and mine, but that's beside the point) on this?

I'm quite ashamed that this is the topic you find a need to post about, where there are probably a hundred other much more important and constructive matters you could have demanded as a client.

What does it say about our business that are bickering about this? I guess we're just too perfect.

[ttgh]

Originally posted by bira
"If it's just text they want to show, then why not have just text?" We did have just text - the exact same text - initially. But the change in colour didn't look good, and leaving it the same as the "F1 News" actually looked confusing. We thought it would be clearer and cleaner if we used an image for the text. It does not change the fact that it's just that - text.

Anyway, why are you wasting your time (and mine, but that's beside the point) on this?

I'm quite ashamed that this is the topic you find a need to post about, where there are probably a hundred other much more important and constructive matters you could have demanded as a client.

What does it say about our business that are bickering about this? I guess we're just too perfect.

It's not a big issue, it's just something that I find a bit annoying - we're told one thing about something that is an annoyance to many people, and we've got the opposite. No biggie, but if 2 people have complained about it, perhaps many more who would never post feel the same? As a client I'm overall pretty happy with what I get for my money - this is the only website I pay a subscription to - but that doesn't mean that I think it can't be improved upon, and I'm sure you feel the same - just about different areas. Different folks, different strokes.

Perhaps it is because we've come to expect perfection?

Cheers
Graham

[kNt]

When there are Fotographs added in more than one Gallery/Category the titles should all be displayed or atleast the more important ones such as the Midland presentation today should get priority. Maybe you could leave of one row of thumbnails if there are that many fotographs.

[Ross Stonefeld]

There will be changes to the gallery very soon on the interface to address that issue. I admit the way things are this weekend is a bit cluttered (im getting lost sometimes in the administration) but its a temporary situation.

[bnlflo]

since you are working on the photo gallery, may I add another suggestion?
By clicking on "1X", "2X", "3X", the image opens in a popup. That's great - keep it that way.

I'm using Firefox (maybe it is the same with other browsers - I don't know) and the page has to be loaded completely (i.e. ALL the thumbnails) before the Javascript works and the picture would pop up.
So here is my question / suggestion:
If possible (and if it is not too much work) could you change the link into a "normal" link to the picture and use the "onclick" option in the href-Tag for the popup?

Example:

<a href="http://www.autosport.com" target="_blank" onClick="OpenNewWindow('http://www.autosport.com', '1X41229', '518', '675');return false;">Autosport</a>

Thanks


ETA:
sorry for the scrollbar

[babbel]

Originally posted by bnlflo
since you are working on the photo gallery, may I add another suggestion?
By clicking on "1X", "2X", "3X", the image opens in a popup. That's great - keep it that way.

I'm using Firefox (maybe it is the same with other browsers - I don't know) and the page has to be loaded completely (i.e. ALL the thumbnails) before the Javascript works and the picture would pop up.
So here is my question / suggestion:
If possible (and if it is not too much work) could you change the link into a "normal" link to the picture and use the "onclick" option in the href-Tag for the popup?

Example:

<a href="http://www.autosport.com" target="_blank" onClick="OpenNewWindow('http://www.autosport.com', '1X41229', '518', '675');return false;">Autosport</a>

Thanks


ETA:
sorry for the scrollbar

target="_blank" has been deprecated and should not be used anymore.

[bnlflo]

Originally posted by babbel


target="_blank" has been deprecated and should not be used anymore.

in this case, I would recommend it, though.
But how would you handle it?

[babbel]

Originally posted by bnlflo

in this case, I would recommend it, though.
But how would you handle it?

I would do just the onclick, if someone has javascript disabled it's too bad for him.

[bnlflo]

Originally posted by babbel


I would do just the onclick, if someone has javascript disabled it's too bad for him.

no offense, but did you actually read my suggestion?

[babbel]

Originally posted by bnlflo

no offense, but did you actually read my suggestion?

I did and I fully understand what you mean!
I was just pointing out that in the light of new webstandards it shouldn't be used anymore ;)

but ultimately it's not up to me to implement this feature, I was just giving my opinion

[novocaine]

hrm, there seem to be ugly google sidebar ads in the journal section now - and theyre off topic too. this is really tacky.

[babbel]

Originally posted by novocaine
hrm, there seem to be ugly google sidebar ads in the journal section now - and theyre off topic too. this is really tacky.

are you sure you're not infected by any sort of spyware / adware or a nasty form of a toolbar?

[bira]

Originally posted by novocaine
hrm, there seem to be ugly google sidebar ads in the journal section now - and theyre off topic too. this is really tacky.

There are NO NEW ADS anywhere on the website since we relaunched on October 2005. Furthermore, there are no sidebar or frontbar or highbar or lowbar ads - google or otherwise - in the journal articles.

Ads on the frontpages - homepage, f1 homepage, news index, gallery index and journal index, along every other public page - have carried specific location of ads since they were launched.

The journal's index, which is what I assume you are talking about, has a vertical right-side column for ads. These can appear as a 120x600 graphic ad, or a 120x600 text ads box.

Now, unless you have an actual complaint about a specific ad - whether it is obtrusive or problematic, technically or content wise - I do not want to hear any more from anyone about their opinion about this ad or that ad. It is becoming the most irrelevant and most counter-productive "feedback" I've ever witnessed here.

And the fact that you are now complaining about text ads appearing on a public page - and giving your opinion on whether they are tacky or not - crosses every possible line of what you have a right to do here.

[novocaine]

firstly, im not under any illusions about my "rights" on an internet message board. the only reason the feedback is "counter-productive" is because you have no intention of changing the policy - still, it remains valid feedback because people do in fact find the ads distasteful.

i would not be bothering to post if it were obviously the case that autosport.com required the revenue generated by the specified ads to continue. if that were the case, i would be tolerant of the ads. i havent complained about the animated ads on the front page because i can see how they indeed generate a decent amount of money, but its a fair bet that you aren't making much of a profit off click-thrus from flight advertising (??) on the journal page. it seems like they lead a pointless existance, which is why i thought i might have a fair chance of them being removed.

[bira]

It is absolutely none of your business how much we get paid for one ad or another, and this the end of this discussion. I will have no more of this.

[babbel]

Originally posted by bnlflo
since you are working on the photo gallery, may I add another suggestion?
By clicking on "1X", "2X", "3X", the image opens in a popup. That's great - keep it that way.

I'm using Firefox (maybe it is the same with other browsers - I don't know) and the page has to be loaded completely (i.e. ALL the thumbnails) before the Javascript works and the picture would pop up.
So here is my question / suggestion:
If possible (and if it is not too much work) could you change the link into a "normal" link to the picture and use the "onclick" option in the href-Tag for the popup?

Example:

<a href="http://www.autosport.com" target="_blank" onClick="OpenNewWindow('http://www.autosport.com', '1X41229', '518', '675');return false;">Autosport</a>

Thanks


ETA:
sorry for the scrollbar

The links have been changed to a normal url but we didn't include the _blank ;) If you want it to open in a new window do a shift click which will open it in a new window.

This also fixed the issue of the gallery refusing to load the other pics after a click on a photo while not all the pics have been downloaded.

[int2str]

Sorry if this has been covered already:

Why are there pictures of NASCAR on my.autosport.com (in the Picture of the Day section) ???
I don't want NASCAR, IRL, Rally or any other pictures there - only F1!

Is there a way to configure this per user?

Thanks,
Andre

[bira]

Not in My Atlas. I have no time to develop My Atlas at the moment; the main website takes a bigger priority.

In the Photo Gallery itself, though, you can separate F1 and Motorsport.

[Ross Stonefeld]

eat your vegetables too!

[TT6]

In the good ol' days there was always a news items called "Selected quotes" during race weekends in which there was all the statements team by team and driver by driver in a single story.

I think it was quite handy to read the piece without having to browse thru them in separate selected quotes.

[pongkai]

I'd like to request a way to override the vertical axis on the (horizontal) laptimes chart. Most of the time you can play with what laps to display to eliminate SC periods, but when you got a race chopped into chunks like OZ, then it becomes difficult. (Also, when you do chop up the laps, it can make the scale way too fine, if you know what I mean.) Thoughts?

[pongkai]

TT6, I think they said that they are just posting the team quotes as they trickle in, instead of waiting for everyone. That's why you have them piecewise now. However, it would be nice to still compile them together once they are all submitted, in addition to posting them individually as they arrive. It is beneficial to have them all in one article at the end of the day, I think.

[TT6]

Originally posted by pongkai
TT6, I think they said that they are just posting the team quotes as they trickle in, instead of waiting for everyone. That's why you have them piecewise now. However, it would be nice to still compile them together once they are all submitted, in addition to posting them individually as they arrive. It is beneficial to have them all in one article at the end of the day, I think.

I thought they used to edit the single news item as the new quotes arrived. There were separate articles too.

Well, maybe the site statistics show more hits when people have to click 'em all.

[Slick]

Would it be possible to add previous - next links to the bottom of season strokes so it is easy to browser previous editions of the cartoons.

[Thanatos]

Downloadable / Viewable version of the Printed Autosport magazine?

Bira, I remember when the whole AtlasF1/Autosport thing happened and there was talk back in the day of perhaps viewing the printed magazine online.

I know other weekly publications have made the switch to digital copies (Computing / Computer Weekly etc sort of magazines)

I haven't really noticed this before until today but when I went to read the interview with Ross Brawn 'Brawn still undecided on future' I noticed the Anthony Rowlinson's in-depth interview with Ross Brawn appears in this week's issue of Autosport magazine. And no doubt its been on *loads* of others, but perhaps it being of interest to me I wanted to read more!

I presume we got the 'meat' of the interview on Atlas but do you think we will ever get to read the mag online? I'm not in the UK anymore so I couldn't even get a copy if I wanted, or if I did I would be reading it after the Brazilian GP!

Perhaps if its cost issue, have another tier membership? What we have now, plus another level for AtlasF1/Autosport + Electronic Autosport Magazine? (same price as the subscription to the mag?)

After re-reading most of the previous 17 pages of comments, you say roughly 50% of your subscribers are euro based - perhaps it would benefit more people than imagined?

Keep up the good/great/super work!

[Rraman]

I didn't find this posted anywhere before, but apologies if my search simply missed it:

Would it be possible for A-A to do one or a series or articles on the behind-the-scenes at Autosport-Atlas? I keep getting these tantalizing glimpses into the life of a journalist via several of the excellent articles written by your contributors in the past, but am a little hazy on how a GP weekend is really covered by A-A... logistics, how many people to cover a GP, how many actually travel to each track vs covering it from armchairs at home, what accesses does being a journalist get you that's denied to us plebs, how you get interviews lined up, how exclusives/scoops happen, how the articles are written up, what goes into the race coverage, where you obtain data from, what goes into putting together the weekly journal, what kind of development team is required back at A-A office to get the print and online versions updated/maintained, etc.
Sure some of it may be "classified" info, but i'm sure there is enough information there to form a pretty meaty journal article. Maybe during the off-season?

I'm not sure about other readers, but I for sure would devour every line of that article, as i am ABSOLUTELY FASCINATED by your lifestyle (which is pretty glamorous from the outside looking in). Looking forward to it!

Thanks!