2890 replies to this topic

[MrSlow]

================================================================

Point System


Speed: 0-3p
Measured by taking the average of the 20 fastest lap in the race for each driver
<0.05 difference = 0 points
0.05-0.24 = 1 p
0.25-0.59 = 2 p
>0.60 = 3 p


Ex:

Malaysia
Kimi 1:36.63
JPM 1:37.14

Diff 0.51 = Kimi 2 points

Classification (yes, I do think it have importance) : 2p

Fastest lap: 1p

AtlasBB judgement: 0-1 point (will usually be zero I guess, but in some cases a point can be rewarded)
Edit: The result in the Voting Championship in RC Bets and Games will be used for this

Qualification:
Q1: 0.5p
Q2: 0.5p (unless fuel levels are very different)
Edit: After qualifying format, only position is counted
Q position: 1p (unless fuel levels are very different)

================================================================

Race by Race

Australia
[summary]
I give Melbourne qualifying to JPM. Iceman did not look cool at all, rather it looks like "I will show who's da'man!" and he went out too hot and sloppy. Race was also JPM's after Kimi's stall at the line.

Kimi is faster in the race, but he makes a serious mistake when he stalls the eninge. Race point to JPM

Malaysia
Kimi was slightly faster than JPM in FP.
Q1 equal conditions, Kimi out first.
Q2, both drivers seemed heavy. Kimi faster

Race: Kimi was a lot faster than JPM the whole race. A broken tyre valve ended Kimi's chances to a podium. 2 speed points to Kimi (1:36.63 vs 1:37.14) , Classification for JPM

Bahrain
Montoya injured, no points

Imola
Montoya injured, no points.

Spain
Edit: New multipart point system introduced
Not much to say, Kimi was brilliant and won from pole in a very dominant fashion.
JPM had a problem with teh fuel rig and had to pit an extra time, but he also spun in the race and he never looked close to Kimi that weekend.
JPM had the faster lap but that was when Kimi had since long started to conserve his engine for Monaco. Kimis "20 best laps average" was 1:16.37 and JPM had 1:16.93. Huge difference.

Monaco
Again Kimi was dominating in qual. In Q1 he beat JPM with more than a second, but the second run was not to be for JPM since he was penalized for an accident he caused in FP4.
So there is no points for Q2. I am not giving any speed points either since JPM drove most of his race in traffic.

Europe/Nurburgring
Note: New Qual format
After being fastest in practice 1-3, JPM fell behind Kimi slightly in P4.
In the qualification Kimi beat JPM with 6 tenths. Maybe different strategies?
Qual point to Kimi.
Classification points to JPM (7th, Kimi 10th) while fastest lap goes
to Kimi (1:30.94 vs 1:31.81). Kimi also get full speed points (3) with an best 20 lap average of 1:31.48 against JPM's 1:32.58.
Finally, Atlas Voting Championship point goes to Kimi (3

vs 11)

Canada
Qualifying, JPM 5th, Kimi 7th, point to JPM.
JPM had the race for a while but was unfortunately DQ´d. Kimi won.
Both showed very similar speed, but JPM was a tad quicker, 1:15.14 against 1:15.18. One speed point for JPM altough Kimi posted 1:14.38, exactly 2 tenths better than Montoyasfastest lap.
The forumers gave their point to Kimi.

USA
We all remember that race, or rather the race that did not happen.
They did qualify though: Kimi second and JPM 11th.

France
Kimi was again ahead of Montoya in qualifying, third spot agains Juans 11th. Montoya never saw the chequered flag, so Kimi's second place awards him the two classification points. Kimi also had the best overall speed, altough it might have looked different if Juan had completed the race. 20 lap average 1:17.02 for Kimi and 1:17.57 for JPM. Only one point though since Juan missed 24 opportunities to make better laps. Fastest lap was 1:16.42 for Kim and 1:16.66 for Juan Pablo. The Voting Championship had Kimi as #1

Then on to:
Great Britain

Qualifying: Kimi 2nd, Juan 4th.
Classification: JPM 1, Kimi 3
Speed: Kimi 1:21.51, Montoya 1:21.63
Fastest lap: Kimi 1:20.50 (JPM 1:20.70)
Voting Championship: Juan #1, Kimi #2


Germany

Qualifying: Kimi pole, JPM spins out.
Classification: JPM 2nd, Kimi DNF
Speed: Kimi 1:15.61, Montoya 1:16.27 (0.66 s = 3 points)
Fastest lap: Kimi 1:14.87 (JPM 1:15.88)
Voting Championship: Not in yet

Hungary

Qualifying: Juan 2nd, Kimi 4th
Classification: Kimi 1th, Juan DNF
Speed: Kimi 1:21.75, JPM 1:21.99
Fastest lap: Kimi Raikkonen, 1:21.219 (Montoya 1:21.237)
Voting Championship: Data not available yet


Turkey

Qualifying: Kimi 1th, Juan 4th. Great q from both, maybe Montoya did even better than Kimi considering he had a green track.
Classification: Kimi 1th, Juan 3rd.
Montoya was run hit from behind by Monteiro which caused him to spin. Later when Alonso cclosed up, JPM drifted wide in T8 and lost the second position. Could have been because of a damaged diffuser from the Monteiro incident.
Speed: Kimi 1:25.70, JPM 1:25.78
Fastest lap: JPM 1:24.77 (Kimi 1:25.03)
Voting Championship: Data not available yet


Italy

Qualifying: Kimi 1th, Juan 2nd. Fantastic qualifying lap rom Kimi with 5 laps more fuel than JPM
Kimi 1 point

Classification: Juan 1th, Kimi 4th.
Montoya did what he should. Kimi as well, but a delaminated tyre and extra pitstop ruined any chances of a podium. The fact that he spun trying to (and almost managed) make up for the etra pitstop did not help him either.
JPM 2 points

Speed: Best 20 laps: Kimi 1:22.24, JPM 1:22.58
Diff 0.34 = Kimi 2 points
Fastest lap: Kimi 1:21.504 (JPM 1:21.828)
Kimi 1p

Voting Championship: Data not available yet


Belgium

Qualifying: JPM 1th, Kimi 2nd.
Montoya 1 point

Classification: Kimi 1th, JPM DNF.
Again Montoya tangled with a backmarker in the dying phase of the race.
Kimi 2 points

Speed: Best 20 laps: Kimi 1:56.56, JPM 1:56.94
Diff 0.38 = Kimi 2 points
Fastest lap: Kimi 1:53.81 (JPM 1:55.99)
Kimi 1p

Voting Championship: Data not available yet



Brazil

Qualifying: JPM 2nd, Kimi 5th.
Montoya 1 point

Classification: Montoya 1th, Kimi 2nd.

Montoya 2 points

Speed: Best 20 laps: Kimi Kimi Raikkonen 1:12.82, JPM 1:12.95
Diff 0.13 = Kimi 1 points
Fastest lap: Kimi 1:12.27 (JPM 1:12.65)
Kimi 1p

Voting Championship: Data not available yet


Japan

Qualifying: Rained away
No points

Classification: Kimi 1th, JPM DNF.

Kimi 2 points

Speed: Best 20 laps: JPM did not do enough laps to make a comparison
Fastest lap: See above
Voting Championship: Data not available yet

China

Qualifying: Kimi 3rd, Monotoya 5th
Kimi 1p

Classification: Kimi 1th, JPM DNF.

Kimi 2 points

Speed: Best 20 laps: The drove together as long as JPM was there, no points
Fastest lap: See above
Voting Championship: Data not available yet


================================================================

Score

[b]Qualifying[/b]

Kimi	   Q1  Q2  QT | JPM   Q1   Q2  T		

Melbourne  0  0.5   0 |	  0,5   0   1

Malaysia  0.5 0.5   1 |		0   0   0 

Bahrain	-		  |		-  

Imola	  -		  |		-  

Spain	 0.5 0.5   1 |		0   0   0

Monaco	0.5  -	1 |		0   -   0	

Europe			  1 |				0

Canada			  0 |				1

USA				 1 |				0  

France			  1 |				0  

GBR				 1 |				0  

Germany			 1 |				0 

Hungary			 0 |				1 

Turkey			  1 |				0 

Italy			   1 |				0

Belgium			 0 |				1

Brazil			  0 |				1

Japan			   0 |				0

China			   1 |				0

----------------------|---------------------

Total			 14.0				 5,5

 





[b]Classification[/b]



			Kimi	 JPM

Melbourne	 0	   2

Malaysia	  0	   2

Bahrain	   -	   -

Imola		 -	   -  

Spain		 2	   0

Monaco		2	   0  

Europe		0	   2

Canada		2	   0 

USA		   -	   -  

France		2	   0 

GBR		   0	   2 

Germany	   0	   2 

Hungary	   2	   0 

Turkey		2	   0

Italy		 0	   2

Belgium	   2	   0

Brazil		0	   2

Japan		 2	   0

China		 2	   0

------------------------------

Total		18	   14





[b]Fastest Lap[/b]



			Kimi	 JPM

Melbourne	 1	   0

Malaysia	  1	   0

Bahrain	   -	   -

Imola		 -	   -  

Spain		 0	   1

Monaco		1	   0 

Europe		1	   0

Canada		1	   0

USA		   -	   -   

France		1	   0

GBR		   1	   0 

Germany	   1	   0 

Hungary	   1	   0 

Turkey		0	   1

Italy		 1	   0

Belgium	   1	   0

Brazil		1	   0

Japan		 0	   0

China		 0	   0

------------------------------

Total		 12	   2





[b]Speed[/b]



			Kimi	 JPM

Melbourne	 1	   0

Malaysia	  2	   0

Bahrain	   -	   -

Imola		 -	   -  

Spain		 2	   0

Monaco		-	   - 

Europe		3	   0

Canada		0	   1 

USA		   -	   -  

France		1	   0

GBR		   1	   0 

Germany	   3	   0 

Hungary	   1	   0

Turkey		1	   0 

Italy		 2	   0

Belgium	   2	   0

Brazil		1	   0

Japan		 0	   0

China		 0	   0

------------------------------

Total		20	   1







[b]AtlasBB judgement[/b]



			Kimi	 JPM

Melbourne	 1	   0

Malaysia	  [URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77768]1[/URL]	   0

Bahrain	   -	   -

Imola		 -	   -  

Spain		 [URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=79120]1[/url]	   0

Monaco		[URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=79606]1[/url]	   -

Europe		1	   0

Canada		1	   0 

USA		   -	   -  

France		1	   0

GBR		   0	   1 

Germany	   [URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=81500]1[/url]	   0

Hungary	   [URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=81635]1[/url]	   0

Turkey		[URL=http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82125]1[/url]		0

Italy		 vote

Belgium	   vote

Brazil		vote

Japan		 vote

China		 vote

------------------------------

Total		 10	   1

Current standing:

Kimi - JPM 74 - 23.5

[MortenF1]

Yeah, JPM came out on top in the sheets, but Räikkönen has already given signs that he's quicker. I'd say. Shall be interesting to see a clearer trend after a while.

[Dragonfly]

I've aleways wondered how some people are able to make general conclusions from as unreliable results as friday practice can give. Especially with the current qualification and rules. I am no fan of either of the two but hey, have some sense of reality.

[MortenF1]

You were the first to bring up free practice.....!

[karlth]

I think it is unrealistic to expect Montoya to be immediately competitive with Raikkonen at McLaren, a new race team and a new race engineer should take some time to get used too. Montoya is though doing better against Kimi than I thought he would be.

[Deeq]

Originally posted by race addicted
You were the first to bring up free practice.....!

hmn. Look closely here

Qualifying

-------- Kimi Juan Palo
Melbourne 0 1
Malaysia 0 1

So Dragonfly has apoint unless it was a genuin mistake of Mrslow to hand scores in Malaysia after the friday practices.

[d_view7]

Originally posted by karlth
I think it is unrealistic to expect Montoya to be immediately competitive with Raikkonen at McLaren, a new race team and a new race engineer should take some time to get used too. Montoya is though doing better against Kimi than I thought he would be.

No excuses please. Fisichella for example didnt do that bad against Alonso in Melbourne would you say? Coulthard didnt do bad against Klien either. A good driver will adapt fast. Montoya has had plenty of KM's in the new McLaren.

[Double Apex]

Originally posted by d_view7



No excuses please. Fisichella for example didnt do that bad against Alonso in Melbourne would you say? Coulthard didnt do bad against Klien either. A good driver will adapt fast. Montoya has had plenty of KM's in the new McLaren.

exactly

[Shiftin]

Originally posted by MrSlow


(how to format text in tables???)

Use [ code] text [/code] without spaces

gives

Melbourne 0 1

Malaysia  0 1

[rfus]

Has anyone here been to the site F1-Facts before ? It has an interesting way of comparing drivers with their teammates over the course of their career. There is obviously no real way to do this (stats are stats, and as has been said around here before tend to hide the true story ), but the results are still interesting. At the moment Kimi is -2 vs Montoya and +31 for his whole career and Monty +2 vs Kimi and +23 for his whole career. I recommend people have a look at the database just for some fun

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by Deeq


hmn. Look closely here


So Dragonfly has apoint unless it was a genuin mistake of Mrslow to hand scores in Malaysia after the friday practices.

Sorry, it was a cut paste error when I tried to format the damn thing, I will edit it

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by Shiftin


Use [ code] text [/code] without spaces

gives

Melbourne 0 1

Malaysia  0 1

Thanks!

[karlth]

Originally posted by d_view7
No excuses please. Fisichella for example didnt do that bad against Alonso in Melbourne would you say? Coulthard didnt do bad against Klien either. A good driver will adapt fast. Montoya has had plenty of KM's in the new McLaren.

Excuses are valid if logical. For some reason an excuse has become a dirty word on this BB.

There is no comparison of Fisi and Alonso yet as unlike the McLaren drivers they never drove in similar circumstances in Melbourne. Giancarlo seems though to have adapted very well to the team, but then again he drove for it a few years ago with most of the same personel.

Regarding Klien and Coulthard there is no comparison because the Austrian is too slow.

[Deeq]

Originally posted by MrSlow


Sorry, it was a cut paste error when I tried to format the damn thing, I will edit it

OK

[Dragonfly]

That's another thing. I mean the table.

[Frogman]

Originally posted by rfus
Has anyone here been to the site F1-Facts before ? It has an interesting way of comparing drivers with their teammates over the course of their career. There is obviously no real way to do this (stats are stats, and as has been said around here before tend to hide the true story ), but the results are still interesting. At the moment Kimi is -2 vs Montoya and +31 for his whole career and Monty +2 vs Kimi and +23 for his whole career. I recommend people have a look at the database just for some fun

From that site:

Jan Albers

Other than that, looks interesting. I'll have a closer look when I can find the time.

[jcbc3]

Originally posted by Frogman

From that site:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jan Albers
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------






Other than that, looks interesting. I'll have a closer look when I can find the time.

As in the exclamation:

"Crist, Jan Albers. You signed for whom??!?"




(disregarding an h, but what do Dutchies know anyway)

[MrSlow]

At F1 Facts, the "walk around the track" with incidents/overtaking data in each corner is very interesting
Examples:
http://www.f1-facts....ck/section/3186
http://www.f1-facts....ck/section/3077

But maybe the site in itself can be discussed in more detail elsewhere.

[Taxi]

Originally posted by Frogman

From that site:



Other than that, looks interesting. I'll have a closer look when I can find the time.

Very interesting. so, piquet is the second best driver in history! teh only one to have defeated Schumacher!

[rfus]

Originally posted by MrSlow

But maybe the site in itself can be discussed in more detail elsewhere.

Done: Interesting Formula 1 stats website, and my first thread

[Arrow]

There is no need for excuses from the montoya camp because hes doing a better job than kimi so far. I could be faster than kimi or montoya if i was allowed to bounce off walls. Kimi needs to find a speed to set good lap times not sector times.
Saying all that, its way too early to really make any worthwhile comparisons yet.

Btw this is going to be a long long thread!

[911]

Originally posted by karlth
I think it is unrealistic to expect Montoya to be immediately competitive with Raikkonen at McLaren, a new race team and a new race engineer should take some time to get used too. Montoya is though doing better against Kimi than I thought he would be.

I agree.. Even JPM said he'd probably be .5ths off Kimi's qualifying pace for the first half of the season.

[madmac]

Originally posted by Arrow
There is no need for excuses from the montoya camp because hes doing a better job than kimi so far. I could be faster than kimi or montoya if i was allowed to bounce off walls. Kimi needs to find a speed to set good lap times not sector times.
Saying all that, its way too early to really make any worthwhile comparisons yet.

Btw this is going to be a long long thread!

Gotta agree, while RD say's Kimi has given signs that he looked faster (& I agree to certain extent) this thread is about stats & on the initial stats from Aus JPM is up. Of course that said it could all change in the next 48 hrs. I don't really think an accurate comparision could/should be made for another couple of races. This looks to be a season long thread.

[lmfdabo]

Kimi did a faster lap in Melbourne than JPM. His qualifying wasn't that good though. But he admited to that he did one misstake during the second qual.

In Malaysia we can't say anything yet. In the last sesion before qual one we can maybe se what is giong to happen. And after qualifying we will know more. But I think that we have to wait until we are back in Europe, maybe in Spain, before we can make any judgment.

So until then, just sit back and enjoy the ride.

[Uxoros]

Really the lap of Kimi in the first qualifying, nobody noticed it ? Nobody remembers ? That was an absolute brilliant lap on the wet. He did before Juan and I remember he had quite some water more between the last two corners. Kimi was excellent on this lap. Still everyone forgot it and just stays on this mistake (which was one !) in Q2. In the race, if he had not stalled, he would have walked away from Montoya. Just let come the race in Sepang and you'll see the difference.

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by Uxoros
Really the lap of Kimi in the first qualifying, nobody noticed it ? Nobody remembers ? That was an absolute brilliant lap on the wet. He did before Juan and I remember he had quite some water more between the last two corners. Kimi was excellent on this lap. Still everyone forgot it and just stays on this mistake (which was one !) in Q2. In the race, if he had not stalled, he would have walked away from Montoya. Just let come the race in Sepang and you'll see the difference.

I noticed, he was really on the limit. But I also had the feeling he was a bit too hot. A gentler approach might have given a better laptime. We can not know those things. But it is impossible to give the qual to Kimi since he in fact did a big mistake in Q2 that made him lose out to JPM. JPM made his own mistakes (as many as Kimi in total I believe), but not as severe.
I have edited the initial post to contain: "Own mistakes are never an extenuating circumstance"
It includes all off's that are not caused by the loss of a wheel (or steering wheel ;) ) or other mechanical failures, a clear mistake by another driver (penalised mistake by other driver might be a good reference?), wild animals and Celtic priests.

[Arrow]

Originally posted by Uxoros
Really the lap of Kimi in the first qualifying, nobody noticed it ? Nobody remembers ? That was an absolute brilliant lap on the wet. He did before Juan and I remember he had quite some water more between the last two corners. Kimi was excellent on this lap. Still everyone forgot it and just stays on this mistake .

I remember montoya being quicker in sectors 2 and 3 of his lap.

[Piif]

Originally posted by Arrow

I remember montoya being quicker in sectors 2 and 3 of his lap.

Was it not you who just a couple of messages ago said that Kimi needs to drive a fast lap, not fast sector times? How is this different with Montoya?

Your bias is so obvious....

[crackr]

With the new qualifying rules (which suck), teammate differences in Q are meaningless... They´re worrying about fuel, tires, engine... This season, qualy differences can be attributed to a number of factors, not just raw speed...

I think real difference this year can only be measured in racing.

I also agree that we were all expecting Montoya to be behind Kimi in terms of pace, which hasn´t been the case so far.

Cheers.

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by crackr
With the new qualifying rules (which suck), teammate differences in Q are meaningless... They´re worrying about fuel, tires, engine... This season, qualy differences can be attributed to a number of factors, not just raw speed...

There will be weekends where qualifying is more luck then skill, but there will also be some where they are on reasonably equal terms. I doubt we will see many occasions where JPM and Kimi are on different strategies. I doubt that we at the end of the season can say that Driver A is better than Driver B, but it is a long time since we had so much interesting in-team competition.
I expect to see threads like this also for Alonso-Fisi, Nick-Mark and Ralf-Jarno, but personally I believe that the JPM and Kimi battle will be most interesting. Closely followed by Fisi-Alonso.

[Bluesmoke]

Originally posted by d_view7



No excuses please. Fisichella for example didnt do that bad against Alonso in Melbourne would you say? Coulthard didnt do bad against Klien either. A good driver will adapt fast. Montoya has had plenty of KM's in the new McLaren.

And he's kicking Kimi's ass at the moment which I think not many expected. I certainly didn't.

[Menace]

I guess "kicking ass" can be a relative to all as well.

[Menace]

For those who actually watched the practise, was there a particular reason why JPM did 13laps vs. Kimi's 6? Problems? Saving the engine?

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by Menace
For those who actually watched the practise, was there a particular reason why JPM did 13laps vs. Kimi's 6? Problems? Saving the engine?

Kimi spun, had to fix the car.

[santori]

Originally posted by d_view7



No excuses please. Fisichella for example didnt do that bad against Alonso in Melbourne would you say? Coulthard didnt do bad against Klien either. A good driver will adapt fast. Montoya has had plenty of KM's in the new McLaren.

But Fisichella did do relatively badly against Massa for the first few races of 2004.

[Fortymark]

Originally posted by Arrow
There is no need for excuses from the montoya camp because hes doing a better job than kimi so far. I could be faster than kimi or montoya if i was allowed to bounce off walls. Kimi needs to find a speed to set good lap times not sector times.
Saying all that, its way too early to really make any worthwhile comparisons yet.

Btw this is going to be a long long thread!

In Australia kimi was faster and he also outraced Michael. Although I think if JPM had been behind MS he would maybe have passed him on track.
Kimi did an mistake by stalling and JPM did an mistake in the race.
Draw so far imo.

[Pinguin]

I think to be fair you should consider qualifying 2 fuel levels as well.

Indeed two seperate statistics revealing sheer speed, and results (like KR bieng faster than DC in most of the races in 2002 but DC getting the results) would be nice. So we can see which driver made less mistakes overall and is more reliable.

ATM it seems Montoya has been getting the results though not being faster on outright speed!.

Not to dissapoint some Montoya fans, but I also want to add that when a driver is usually 0.3s slower than his teammate it remains so. It may be hard to perceive as an armchair man-down-the-pub but they're all professional race drivers giving it 100% most of the time behind the wheel. The extra *intrinsic* 1% or 0.3s cannot come from being in the team for x amount of time...

[karlth]

Originally posted by Pinguin
Not to dissapoint some Montoya fans, but I also want to add that when a driver is usually 0.3s slower than his teammate it remains so. It may be hard to perceive as an armchair man-down-the-pub but they're all professional race drivers giving it 100% most of the time behind the wheel. The extra *intrinsic* 1% or 0.3s cannot come from being in the team for x amount of time...

So a driver's speed can be judged immediately during his first lap in a new car and a new team?

Now if that won't slash testing costs I don't know what will.

[Vilenova]

I'm not surprised Juan is up. It'll be cloose but Monty is better. IMO <--- In My Opinion. Gonna be a great battle to watch between these 2.

[Vilenova]

Originally posted by Pinguin

ATM it seems Montoya has been getting the results though not being faster on outright speed!.

Not to dissapoint some Montoya fans, but I also want to add that when a driver is usually 0.3s slower than his teammate it remains so. It may be hard to perceive as an armchair man-down-the-pub but they're all professional race drivers giving it 100% most of the time behind the wheel. The extra *intrinsic* 1% or 0.3s cannot come from being in the team for x amount of time...

I see where you're going and you're correct that they are professionals and give 100%. (or should be)
The thing is though that giving 100% doesn't nessacarily mean you're getting 100% from the car. There is ALWAYS room for improvement.

[d_view7]

Originally posted by karlth


Excuses are valid if logical. For some reason an excuse has become a dirty word on this BB.

There is no comparison of Fisi and Alonso yet as unlike the McLaren drivers they never drove in similar circumstances in Melbourne. Giancarlo seems though to have adapted very well to the team, but then again he drove for it a few years ago with most of the same personel.

Regarding Klien and Coulthard there is no comparison because the Austrian is too slow.

How many kilometers would you say Montoya needs before we can say he has now adapted and is on a level playing field with Kimi?

[karlth]

Originally posted by d_view7
How many kilometers would you say Montoya needs before we can say he has now adapted and is on a level playing field with Kimi?

Just a guess of course but I would expect Montoya to have found his rythm with the race team and engineers probably around Barcelona or thereabouts. If Montoya is struggling then he is in trouble.

[MrSlow]

Another thing that should not be forgotten is the car itself and how it suits the drivers. Last season Kimi was not so impressive compared to DC until the new car came along for the last part. It was similar with Mika and DC, their relative speed depended a lot on the cars characteristcs. A car will have a "built in" handling characteristic that is difficult, sometimes impossible, to change with the setup. At least if you want to keep it optimised for speed.

[Menace]

Originally posted by karlth


Just a guess of course but I would expect Montoya to have found his rythm with the race team and engineers probably around Barcelona or thereabouts. If Montoya is struggling then he is in trouble.

karlth - With all due respect, Montoya doesn't seem to be "struggeling" right now.


Prediction: Kimi will prove to be the faster of the two over the course of the season. I firmly beleive Kimi is the fastest driver in F1.

[Menace]

MrSlow - Good point! No doubt it will take a little while until Montoya gets the car even more suited for his own driving style. This will happen ofocurse naturally through his input towards development of the car.

[Menace]

Originally posted by Vilenova

I'm not surprised Juan is up. It'll be cloose but Monty is better. IMO <--- In My Opinion. Gonna be a great battle to watch between these 2.

Yes it will.

[Bluesmoke]

Originally posted by Menace
Prediction: Kimi will prove to be the faster of the two over the course of the season. I firmly beleive Kimi is the fastest driver in F1.

I firmly believe you're wrong.

[Menace]

Originally posted by Bluesmoke


I firmly believe you're wrong.

I firmly beleive you're wrong.

[armonico]

Originally posted by Menace


... I firmly beleive Kimi is the fastest driver in F1.

What is your belief based on?

Please let me give you a recent example. There is/was a general belief that Alonso misused his engine in Australia while pushing and overtaking. The fact is he didn't. He managed his engine the same as Fisi. However, he pused his tyres when racing in clean air.

From http://www.as.com/ar...d_date=20050318

Después de una carrera a tope en Australia, ¿no le da miedo tener una avería?

Igual que todos, creo. Todos aquéllos que no pudimos cambiar el motor tenemos respeto a lo que pueda pasar con el calor. Habr?que cruzar los dedos y esperar que todo vaya bien. Yo especialmente no debería tener problemas por hacer una carrera desde atrás. Lo que más forc?fueron los neumáticos y las piezas del coche que saltaron cuando me toqu?con un bordillo. Us?las mismas vueltas del propulsor que Giancarlo.

After the race in Australia, are you scare of having a break down?

He said he pushed the tyres most. He used the same engine laps as Giancarlo.

¿No lo exprimi?un poco más por los adelantamientos y la función del override, que permite alcanzar más revoluciones en un momento determinado?

Eso no llegu?a utilizarlo. Se trata de un dispositivo que elimina el control electrónico de crucero del coche, que corta el régimen del motor y le impide subir de vueltas más de la cuenta a partir de los 315 o 320 km/h, que era el tope de los ingenieros en Australia. Para ocasiones determinadas, cuando coges un rebufo grande, tienes la posibilidad de quitar un momento ese limitador para que el monoplaza alcance una velocidad punta mayor y poder as?adelantar. En Melbourne sólo se puede aplicar en la recta de meta y all?nunca adelant? As?que no lo emple?

Haven’t you forced it (the engine) more because of the overtaking and the override function, which allow it to reach more revs in a particular moment?

That (the override function) didn’t get to use it?...(then he explained what the this function is about to override the revs limit control to reach more top speed to overtake)... …In Melbourne, it only could be use in the finish lane and I never overtook there. So I didn’t use it.

[MrSlow]

Maybe we can concentrate on what they are doing during the race weekends in this thread?
Maybe we can also keep it about JPM and Kimi?;)

There is plenty of threads with discussions about who is the best driver.