110 replies to this topic

[MPea3]

Takuma Sato says BAR mistreated him.

I think he should be mor eupset at his own performance this year. I think he's been one of the disappointments of the season. Should he have had any doubt where he stood with BAR, with Rubens being signed and the team being very clear as to their desire to keep Button?

I think it's all that damn Dave Richards fault.






hey, nobody's bashed DR in a while...

[xype]

First thing I tought when reading Sato's complains "He can form a self-help group with Villeneuve, than!"

BAR could have the decency to at least tell him that he's not wanted anymore before he reads it in the news. But I guess you can't expect that from a team that already did something similiar to one of their drivers before and was caught cheating this season. Contrasting to BAR's way of handling such situation look at how McLaren and DC did it! That's what I call honest!

Welps, next season they'll be competing with a driver who doesn't respect contracts and another one who is known to bend over for moolah. I guess they'll be a hell of a team.

[POLAR]

BAR themselves didnt know who their drivers would be till Button assured he would stay. But what the hey, Sato reads the news too, dont he?

[Sakae]

Sato had received shody treatment, and has every reason to be upset. Phone call would have been in order. But then maybe this is just another episode how he might have been treated for some time in that garage; who knows what the truth is? I would however think that under normal conditions this is not what you do to your friend, or associate you respect.

[howardt]

I feel a little sorry for Taku. He's just not quite good enough to make it in F1.

On a couple of occasions, he's put in some excellent drives, but without reward. There was one race, I forget which , but I think he got hit at turn1, pitted for a new nose, rejoined 2 laps down, and then was running at McLaren pace for the rest of the race, finishing ....2 laps down. For no points.

He's had some bad luck with reliability & pitstops. But equally there's been a couple of races where he's been a little too anonymous.

Maybe they could have broken the news a little more gently, but frankly I think BAR have lined up better drivers for 06.

[MortenF1]

Originally posted by howardt
I feel a little sorry for Taku. He's just not quite good enough to make it in F1.

Maybe they could have broken the news a little more gently, but frankly I think BAR have lined up better drivers for 06.

I agree, B.A.R have a better pairing next year.

But I disagree that Sato is not good enough for F1. He's shown on many occasions, to have the speed, but he's not been as able as other newcomers to smooth out the rough edges. I still think it's a bit unfair if he was to be left without a seat next year, when drivers I consider to be below him, will still be there.

I wish Williams could give him a test. It's an interim year for them, in which they can afford to take a chance with someone. It makes more sense to give Rosberg a shot though, or to give the familiar Pizzonia a season. But a test would be cool.

[baddog]

Originally posted by race addicted
I wish Williams could give him a test. It's an interim year for them, in which they can afford to take a chance with someone. It makes more sense to give Rosberg a shot though, or to give the familiar Pizzonia a season. But a test would be cool.

He needs the Massa treatment.. send him to maranello for a year or so to pouind round fiorano.. or mac/williams the same.

Shaun

[fifi]

he has a point imo, they could have at least called him as a courtesy

[MortenF1]

Yeah, something like that should resurrect his F1 career. But he'd need a top team to do it, and Ferrari won't pick him up.*
He should atleast get to run a third car somewhere next year, but I can understand that he doesn't want to drive B.A.R's.



*Unless Bridgestone takes care of him...

[BRG]

They could at least have sent him a fax - even Eddie Jordan managed that...

But with Button, Barrichello, Davidson (maybe), Carroll, Dirani, Rossiter, van der Merwe and now Kanaan on BAR's books, it shouldn't take a genius to figure out that Sato might be surplus to requirements.

[MPea3]

Originally posted by BRG
They could at least have sent him a fax - even Eddie Jordan managed that...

But with Button, Barrichello, Davidson (maybe), Carroll, Dirani, Rossiter, van der Merwe and now Kanaan on BAR's books, it shouldn't take a genius to figure out that Sato might be surplus to requirements.

I agree in spite of the tone of my original post. Especially for a race seat! It's a shame, as I really do think he's got talent, but then again, lotsa guys do, and talent by itself isn't enough to be good in F1.

[lulup]

I don't care where he goes,as long as it's not the IRL.

[SeanValen]

It's a tough sport, either you perform or you don't belong in f1, he's had his chances.
But a nice guy, so I wish him well.

[Fortymark]

I hope he gets a drive because he´s one of few entertaining drivers out there.
Sato is good for F1.
I think he´s fast and talented but havn´t had the support at BAR to show really what he can do.
We seen it a couple of times, in Suzuka, Monaco etc.

Why don´t Williams pick him up and go for Honda engines in 2007?
Rosberg & Sato + Honda

[metz]

Originally posted by Fortymark

Why don´t Williams pick him up and go for Honda engines in 2007?
Rosberg & Sato + Honda

Cause they got Webber & Nico + Toyota

[Jason]

The past couple seasons BAR has fumble over themselves in order to accommodate JB's every whim, and have never shown Sato anything close to that level of attention. It's the whole mindset at BAR, that's ****ed.

Originally posted by Fortymark
I hope he gets a drive because he´s one of few entertaining drivers out there.
Sato is good for F1.
I think he´s fast and talented but havn´t had the support at BAR to show really what he can do.
We seen it a couple of times, in Suzuka, Monaco etc.

Why don´t Williams pick him up and go for Honda engines in 2007?
Rosberg & Sato + Honda

I love irony, as such, there would be nothing sweeter than to see Sato end up at Williams and then in turn beat Button in his BAR.

[Racer Joe]

Originally posted by MPea3
Takuma Sato says BAR mistreated him.

I think he should be mor eupset at his own performance this year. I think he's been one of the disappointments of the season. Should he have had any doubt where he stood with BAR, with Rubens being signed and the team being very clear as to their desire to keep Button?

He has underperformed and he did disappoint. But all it needed was one phone call from Nick Fry or Gil deFerran, especially considering he wasn't off holidaying in the middle of the Mediterranean. He was actually doing sponsor duty for the team.

Let's see how people like it if the company they work for announce their sacking to the entire company before telling them privately.

[Rene]

Originally posted by baddog
He needs the Massa treatment.. send him to maranello for a year or so to pouind round fiorano.. or mac/williams the same.

Shaun

I agree 100%, I think that would help him become a much better driver....maybe Bridgestone $$$ would help Ferrari agree!

[Corners]

So he got a works drive by being Japanese with plenty of other drivers out there snapping at his heals and what does he do ? Yeah moan about poor treatment, it was always someone else's fault that's the trouble with Sato. He doesn't deserve anything because he will not admit he made an error or he's not good enough or whatever.

[Menace]

Originally posted by Fortymark

Why don´t Williams pick him up and go for Honda engines in 2007?
Rosberg & Sato + Honda

Now that would be something.

Sato+ Honda+ Bridgestones. Sound familiar?

Edit: Atleast at Williams he would be guaranteed for a fair treatment. But then again, would pairing up with a hungry Rosberg be wise?

I really hope Sato finds a good spot for next season... even as a tester for a top team. I always thought he had the speed to fight with the big-boys, somehow it just never materialised at BAR. Team change is exactly what he needs.

[baddog]

Originally posted by Corners
So he got a works drive by being Japanese with plenty of other drivers out there snapping at his heals and what does he do ? Yeah moan about poor treatment, it was always someone else's fault that's the trouble with Sato. He doesn't deserve anything because he will not admit he made an error or he's not good enough or whatever.

What are you making this **** up for fun? Has he got a record of blaming others for his mistakes? no.

His complaint was only about finding out he had lost his job in the news. Thats going to piss anybody off.

Shaun

[angst]

With all the arse kissing that BAR have been doing with Button this year (and last) I very much doubt that Sato has been given anything like the same treatment. I hope Sato takes a step back and does GP2. I know that sounds like a retrograde step but.... if he wants to get back into F1 there's no point going off to the States or back to Japan. I think he'd flourish with a good team in GP2, and that's where the F1 managers get to see the talent outside of F1.

[HBoss]

Originally posted by baddog


He needs the Massa treatment.. send him to maranello for a year or so to pouind round fiorano.. or mac/williams the same.

Shaun

Didn't he already go through that in 2003?
Maybe he could have some fun at CART.

[xenna]

Originally posted by Corners
So he got a works drive by being Japanese with plenty of other drivers out there snapping at his heals and what does he do ? Yeah moan about poor treatment, it was always someone else's fault that's the trouble with Sato. He doesn't deserve anything because he will not admit he made an error or he's not good enough or whatever.

[Schu]

The writing is on the wall regarding Sato. He can't really expect to be retain by anybody much less a good team by BAR with his performance the last 2 years

[Jodum5]

A few things:
1. Sato's career has been a joke. He did great last year (with the US Podium and consistent finishes), but obviously was flattered by a solid car. This year he has ONE POINT to Jenson's 30, with a car that has been far from great
2. Since BAR hired Rubens (how many weeks ago?), he must've known his number was up. BAR was very publicly challenging Williams' claim on Button for the future.

So he has not performed and he has had a warning of 3 or so weeks that someone was taking the last available seat (unless Taku was willing to wait till an after season courtroom showdown). So what exactly did BAR do wrong? Sour grapes. He should go to Champ Car, he'll do good there. Maybe honda will supply an engine to that series as well ;)

All this from a Takuma Sato fan.

[angst]

Originally posted by Jodum5
A few things:
1. Sato's career has been a joke. He did great last year (with the US Podium and consistent finishes), but obviously was flattered by a solid car. This year he has ONE POINT to Jenson's 30, with a car that has been far from great
2. Since BAR hired Rubens (how many weeks ago?), he must've known his number was up. BAR was very publicly challenging Williams' claim on Button for the future.

So he has not performed and he has had a warning of 3 or so weeks that someone was taking the last available seat (unless Taku was willing to wait till an after season courtroom showdown). So what exactly did BAR do wrong? Sour grapes. He should go to Champ Car, he'll do good there. Maybe honda will supply an engine to that series as well ;)

All this from a Takuma Sato fan.

Brilliant. With fans like you who needs detractors? (defarmers?)

[Jason]

Originally posted by Jodum5
A few things:
1. Sato's career has been a joke. He did great last year (with the US Podium and consistent finishes), but obviously was flattered by a solid car. This year he has ONE POINT to Jenson's 30, with a car that has been far from great
2. Since BAR hired Rubens (how many weeks ago?), he must've known his number was up. BAR was very publicly challenging Williams' claim on Button for the future.

So he has not performed and he has had a warning of 3 or so weeks that someone was taking the last available seat (unless Taku was willing to wait till an after season courtroom showdown). So what exactly did BAR do wrong? Sour grapes. He should go to Champ Car, he'll do good there. Maybe honda will supply an engine to that series as well ;)

All this from a Takuma Sato fan.

And yet, making a phone call takes how many minutes? Particularly inconsiderate considering the countless hours of testing Sato did for the them, over the years, as much as 150 laps in one session this year, and yet BAR can't be bothered to take a few minutes out of their day to inform him before going to the presses. Clearly BAR's shitty way of saying he was no longer wanted there.

[Jason]

Originally posted by angst




Brilliant. With fans like you who needs detractors? (defarmers?)

Sounds like bullshit! I've never heard "Jodum5" defend or say anything positive about Sato, in all my time here.

[Cosmograph]

Originally posted by baddog


He needs the Massa treatment.. send him to maranello for a year or so to pouind round fiorano.. or mac/williams the same.

Shaun

He's had it already. Plenty of testing for BAR prior to getting the race seat. He's shown nothing to indicate that he deserves a drive in the top half of the grid. One point in 2005 and 60 points (approx.) of his teammate in 2004 is hardly cause for celebration.

He did put in a couple of decent performances but has under delivered as well as being guilty of a couple of bonehead moves.

[swaction]

Originally posted by Corners
So he got a works drive by being Japanese with plenty of other drivers out there snapping at his heals and what does he do ? Yeah moan about poor treatment, it was always someone else's fault that's the trouble with Sato. He doesn't deserve anything because he will not admit he made an error or he's not good enough or whatever.

I agree - He hasn't admitted apologised for any of his prangs this year... He's had a shocker Maybe a year off testing as suggested by others will calm him down, listening to his starts on board with Jock in his ear is just scary. He's a danger to other driver out there.

[RiDE]

Well, I hope BAR gets their worth from Button. I can't imagine the trouble and money they went through for a guy that hasn't won a single race yet.

I like Sato, so I hope he finds a seat somewhere.

[Pumpkin]

Clearly Sato should have been told before the press release came out. That is a given. Unfortunately for him the writing was on the wall . Button's hand forced Sato and Davidson to wait which were very loyal Honda boys as opposed to the former. Clearly there was frustration from Heidfelds end as well. The merry go round resulted in the Sato shuffle.
In a perfect world Toyota would snap Sato up for testing duties but with two testers of their own on the books this is unlikely.
Nice guy with great support from Honda but failed to measure up.

[Minkies' Mum]

I think it's sad. I've got a lot of time for Sato and I hope he gets a drive next year. He's entertaining and a very nice guy too.
Lynda.

[Jodum5]

Jason, Because I am his fan I should blindly defend him? No, a fan his somone who supports somone. I will root for Taku, but I will not make excuses for him. Simple has that. It isn't rocket science that he hasnt lived up to anybody's expectations and that is what I pointed out in my post. AND they did make the call to him, to tell him he won't be getting the drive for next year. They couldn't do it sooner because they werent sure of how things would play out. He never seemed to mind being in limbo for weeks waiting for the decision on Jenson, But once they give him their answer, he's all of a sudden shocked at their treatment?

Anyway, if he performed much better this season and still got treated the same way, then his response would be granted, but he didn't did he?

[Dino G]

I am Taku fan as well but his performnace this year has been a big disappointment.

I have a hard time feeling sorry for him. It was his nationality that has paved his fortune in F1. Of course he has talent but really, he is here because Honda and being Japanese. He came in a and replaced a former F1 champ and didn't feel too badly about it. What goes around comes around.

It is obvious that the Takuma experiment orchestrated by Richards in order to oust Villeneuve has damaged the team's ability to score points. There is no doubt in my mind that Villeneuve would have been close, if not better than Button. That would have produced a lot more points than what has been produced.

Taku will land on his feet, but oh the beating he suffered at the hands of Button this year...in a pretty good car too.

I hope he gets the Midland seat but I fear that what we see from Taku is 98% of what he can do. A guy like Alonso we may have only seen maybe 85% of his true talent, same with Kimi. Guys like Sato, Pizzonia, Webber, Heidfeld...I think they are at near the top of what they can do. So even if he gets a Jordan seat, he won't be much better.

[Cosmograph]

Sato's Blackmail:

Now it appears that Sato is better at orchestrating a Blackmail Honda campaign than in actually driving and delivering any points to the team.

How unseemly that fans are blackmailing Honda with threats of a Suzuka showdown unless the keep Sato or find him a seat.

And to think that when I looked at the A-A WDC stats Sato was dead last. To any who say that its not about his being Japanese I offer you the sad spectacle now unfolding

[xype]

The only thing I'm wondering right now is how Honda will take all of this. They "lost" JV (debatable, but rumors said Honda's engineers are missing his input, whatever that might be) and they had Buttongate I, which was a major embarassment. If conspiracy theories are to be believed, Richards got the boot over it.

And now Takuma Sato reads about his "retirement" in the newspaper, saying noone was kind enough to let him know, even with a fax or a phone call. Sure he must have seen it coming from 1000 miles away, but still.

I have the impression that the Sato situation was handled very un-japanese, and now Toyota is rumored to try and orchestrate Sato a Midland drive.

I can't believe Honda is happy about it. In fact, I think they might be rather unhappy with the whole situation right now. Would be even funnier if Fry got the boot over it.

[Cosmograph]

Did you read the A-A piece which links Sato to Red Bull Jr. and a Honda tie in? Evidently Honda's higher ups are getting emailed and threatened (with a Suzuka protest) because they dumped Sato. According to the report they are scrambling for an alternative seat.

[Corners]

I must be seeing something some people haven't, NOTHING is ever Sato's fault according to him. In his own mind he is the greatest and if that doesn't manifest itself then he holds his hands up and says its not his fault. No matter what crashes he causes or spin-offs he has or lack of performance he WILL find something to blame but himself. He's a dangerous driver who drivers over the limit but he hasn't noticed, he also hasn't noticed that he is slower than many other drivers in F1.

[Rob76]

To be honest, if Sato still thought he was in with a serious chance of keeping a race seat at BAR then he's far more naive than talented. This from Nick Fry in mid August:

"The situation is very simple in lots of ways," said Fry. "If Jenson stays there won't be a race seat for Takuma, you don't need to be a mathematician to work that out. We have two race seats and two great drivers.

"Whether Taku stays with the team after that we will see, I think it is as much Takuma's decision as ours whether he would want to stay as a third driver, we could discuss it.

"If Jenson goes then there are no guarantees. We have got to have two drivers who can perform at a set level and Takuma has from now to the end of the season to demonstrate that he can do that. We hope he can, because he is an excellent team member and as a person we like him a lot.

"But this is a business and a high level sport and if he can't prove that to us then we will obviously have to consider other alternatives."

Since then (until the official Button announcement), rather than take the opportunity to prove he could perform at a high level (even if BAR didn't have a seat he needs to impress other teams) he gets out qualified 3-0, finishes out of the points or retires (when his teamamte scores each time, including a podium) and gets a 10 place grid penalty for crashing into Schumacher.

Now he may have had some bad luck but he's also severly underperformed. A statistic that on average, should smooth out luck for both drivers: Jenson Button has outqualified him 24 times to 8 over their two seasons together. As entertaining as Sato can be when racing, he just hasn't cut it.

[Cosmograph]

I agree. He's always the victim when in reality he's been incredibly lucky to have a BAR seat for 2004 and 2005 producing nothing in the bargain. One point in 2005, last on the table, and he's "shocked" that he's being sacked. Pretty funny really. Stupid move putting him in the BAR No. 2 seat. They've wasted a lot of potential over two years with the bumbler in the seat. How anyone can argue that he's talented when he's at a combined disadvatage of almost 100 points vs. Jenson is beyond me.

[xype]

Ok, let's try it this way;

Imagine you work at a big ass company. Like IBM. You find out that they will be cutting some 10,000 jobs and that you were one of the most likely candidates to go. Which behaviour from said company would be more honourable and respectful towards you:

1) Your "Boss" inviting you for a talk, saying how bad the economy is, blah, blah, you got the boot, you have two-three days to pick up all your stuff and hand over the door key card. And good luck with finding a new job.

or

2) You go to work one day, try to get trough the door and your key-card isn't working. You ask the security guard what's going on and he says "I guess you were fired, Bob. You stuff is probably back in the dumpster along with the rest."

So which one would make you feel like the company at least had some minimal respect for you left and treated you as a human being even if it was bad news they had for you? I don't think argumenting with "But he did a bad job anyway!" really excuses how BAR handled the situation.

[Cosmograph]

Did he really think that he'd be on the team if Jenson got released from WilliamsF1? The writing was on the wall. Who knows if they didn't offer him a test role in 2006 early on but he refused it ....

[Rob76]

Originally posted by xype
Ok, let's try it this way;

Imagine you work at a big ass company. Like IBM. You find out that they will be cutting some 10,000 jobs and that you were one of the most likely candidates to go. Which behaviour from said company would be more honourable and respectful towards you:

1) Your "Boss" inviting you for a talk, saying how bad the economy is, blah, blah, you got the boot, you have two-three days to pick up all your stuff and hand over the door key card. And good luck with finding a new job.

or

2) You go to work one day, try to get trough the door and your key-card isn't working. You ask the security guard what's going on and he says "I guess you were fired, Bob. You stuff is probably back in the dumpster along with the rest."

So which one would make you feel like the company at least had some minimal respect for you left and treated you as a human being even if it was bad news they had for you? I don't think argumenting with "But he did a bad job anyway!" really excuses how BAR handled the situation.

Well considering Sato had been given over a month's notice of the likelyhood that the best he could hope for was a third driver position, especially if Button was staying, and that he was a contractor anyway, I don't think either scenario really sums up the situation very well. All indications are that BAR are happy to keep Sato on as third driver. Given his performance for the last two years, he should be grateful to take it and hope to improve and impress, or risk relying on Japanese commercial interests finding him a drive at a Japanese powered team further down the grid.....

Regarding your IBM analogy, having worked within IBM, I've seen some pretty shitty treatment of contractors and some very sudden announcements of full IBM employess being 'sold' with division sell-offs.

[zontafan]

Originally posted by Jason
The past couple seasons BAR has fumble over themselves in order to accommodate JB's every whim, and have never shown Sato anything close to that level of attention. It's the whole mindset at BAR, that's ****ed.

ohhhh reminds me of 1999-2000 BAR years except he had a v not a b as his second initial

[MinardiWDC]

Kind of hard to perform on a one car team, just ask the Jacques he got the treatment on both end.


I think we won't see the last Sato, he's got speed and Honda/Toyota/Bridgestone/.

[Dino G]

Originally posted by MinardiWDC
Kind of hard to perform on a one car team, just ask the Jacques he got the treatment on both end.


I think we won't see the last Sato, he's got speed and Honda/Toyota/Bridgestone/.

Problem is you need more than speed to be an F1 driver.

To see what is needed look at another driver who has speed (Montoya) and his teammate.

[HardRock]

He knew the team were looking for another driver. What else he has thinking; besides he has done a poor job this year. Got just one point. He is lucky he wasn't fired before.
Go home Taku.

[HardRock]

Originally posted by MinardiWDC
Kind of hard to perform on a one car team, just ask the Jacques he got the treatment on both end.

One car team.
That's nothing more than a lame excuse for bad drivers like JV and TS.