Jump to content


Photo

Please help me with my F5000 McLaren M10A!


  • Please log in to reply
181 replies to this topic

#101 GeorgeTheCar

GeorgeTheCar
  • Member

  • 376 posts
  • Joined: September 03

Posted 13 August 2006 - 02:28

Copy your quote with a standard copy

Open the reply

Right under your name is a series of grey boxes

Last one on the right is Quote

Have fun!

Advertisement

#102 David McKinney

David McKinney
  • Member

  • 14,156 posts
  • Joined: November 00

Posted 13 August 2006 - 05:33

It's a lot easier to click on the 'quote' box at the top of the post, George ;)

#103 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 13 August 2006 - 12:51

Originally posted by David McKinney
I have him with the purported M10A in 1989, unraced 1990, then raced again 1991 and 1992. Previous owner said to have been Roger Ealand.

Most interesting! In 1985, Ealand advertised the ex-Lane hillclimb M10B, a car we now know to be 400-03, ex-McKenchnie/Walker and later to Shardlow and Bailey. Ealand had got it from Ian Webb in early 1984 but unfortunately Ian can't remember where he got it from. I don't know where that car is today.

Originally posted by David McKinney
The alleged M10B first appears in Pugh hands in 1991, having been raced by Rick Hall in 1989 and 1990

Rick had the ex-Prophet/Moore/le Tissier M10B (another '400-04', the one now with Bruce Leeson) from 1988 to Feb 1990 and the ex-Holland/Oates/Harris M10B (another '400-06', the one now with Mark Longmore) from 1990 to 1993. This means he must have had a third one during the same period. I'd better give Rick a call and see how good his memory is.

Duncan - when you say the Lane car on my [unpublished!] M10B page is an early tub, do you mean this one?

Allen

#104 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 13 August 2006 - 14:44

Allen, you reference "An article in Autoweek 10 May 1969 dated 18 April (Autoweek's normal production lag) says that Motschenbacher, Hansen and Barker will drive M10As so Barker's was definitely an early order but may not have been built until later. The article says that "Motschenbacher's and Hansen's cars arrived in the United States last week". Eaton's isn't mentioned."
From what I understand the Eaton car was collected from England by the team, it came into the USA via New York and then crossed the border by trailer into Canada
I'll call Ralph today and try to tie that up
Ian

#105 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 13 August 2006 - 18:43

That's too nice of a picture not to publish Allen!

Can you post the history on this car it's beautiful


#106 h4887

h4887
  • Member

  • 933 posts
  • Joined: July 04

Posted 13 August 2006 - 19:04

Originally posted by Exact10

That's too nice of a picture not to publish Allen!


Do you know where it was taken?

#107 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 13 August 2006 - 20:05

The photo was taken at Doune in 1971. The image is copyright Steve Wilkinson 2006 and in this form it is also copyright Allen Brown 2006. That's why I linked to it the way I did.

History as follows (copyright Allen Brown 2006 - sorry I have to stress copyrights today but as the text and the JPEG have come directly from an unpublished page on OldRacingCars.com, I have to do it).

Roy Lane British Hill Climb Championship 1971. To Richard Shardlow: British Hill Climb Championship 1972 (until rolled at Harewood 10 Sep 1972). Not rebuilt and eventually sold late 1973 to John Bailey. Rebuilt with 5.5-litre Chevy and LG600 and used in Sprints during 1974 and 1975 (e.g. Duxford Sprint Oct 1974 and a win at Curborough August 1975).

I'm not sure where the car was from 1975 to 1984.

The origins of this car were unclear until very recently with some sources saying it was an unused circuit racing McLaren and others implying it was built by Lane from spares. Then Jeremy Jackson spotted in his notebooks that he'd seen Richard Shardlow's ex-Lane M10B in 1972 and had been told it was the car that Mike Walker had crashed in 1970. Also, Jeremy had observed the number 400-03 on Roger Ealand's car (said to be ex-Lane in one of Ealand's adverts) in Sep 1985.


Allen

#108 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 13 August 2006 - 20:42

Thats good stuff Allen, yes thats the picture , I hadn't noticed your updates on your (unpublished!) page , I have been working from a set of printed pages. That accounts for another early surplus tub. I'll summerise my figures and get them to you , also with a few other comments.

Ian , it might interest you to know that Eatons M12 is somewhere in the picture , the ex Works M8 427 b/b Chev engine in the background was for his car.

#109 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 13 August 2006 - 20:45

Great to know Duncan, I think you mentioned earlier that Eatons car was fitted with its motor in the US, I'm not entirely sure that was true, I will call Ryan Falconer and find out when he built the motor for George. I'm not certain but I think the car left England complete.
I have tried Ralph Frisken's number

#110 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 13 August 2006 - 20:56

Duncan

Do you have sufficient photos to compare this 1971 Roy Lane picture with Ean Pugh's car today. You say they are both early tubs - could they be the same car?

Allen

#111 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 13 August 2006 - 21:22

I think so Allen, hadnt thought of that connection. Will do it this evening and post later. I am only missing modern photos of 400-07 the Richard Erye car, and would now like to see Barry Davidsons 400-04, I was going to ask Simon Hadfield to send me some. We will need to do some work on 400-06 also. This early/ late thing clarifies things somewhat (provided of course we have the photos to do it).

#112 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 13 August 2006 - 21:31

NEWS FLASH!


Pugh's car has an LG gearbox . After a little messing with the briteness / contrast knobs I see a high shifter rod. We may be onto something, any more shots of Lanes car available?

#113 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 13 August 2006 - 22:21

Originally posted by Duncan Fox
... and would now like to see Barry Davidsons 400-04 ...

I just have these two:

Posted Image

Posted Image

They were sent to me by Barry and I think show the car as it arrived at Simon's. Roy told Barry that this was a tub he acquired from Prophet at the end of 1970 and had been damaged. This implies Prophet had retubbed his car at some point in 1970 so the car that then goes on to Moore, Le Tissier, Rick etc and is now with Bruce Leeson uses the later tub and Barry's is built around the original tub. Or maybe. It's not clear whether Roy ever used this tub but, as far as Barry and I can determine, it looks like he didn't.

Allen

#114 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 13 August 2006 - 23:09

Allen

Lovely looking car, however, its a late tub, just to confuse things.

Ian we havnt high jacked your thread ,we're just using it 'cause it seems to be a good place to "bludge a ride"so to speak.

#115 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 14 August 2006 - 00:01

Hi Duncan,
Don't you worry about me, let's keep this thread rolling with as much info, pics and stories about McLaren's M10's as we can, I'm learning tons and thoroughly enjoying it, as I said at the begining of the whole this whole story I was a Ferrari fan until I got my M10!
If anyone has an interest in Lotus Elevens and the resto I'm going to be doing on chassis 207, I'll start a new thread.........at present its in barn finds

#116 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 14 August 2006 - 21:14

Allen ,after comparing the photos, I have come to the conclusion that although there are similarities between them there is no one unusual or custom feature that is comman to the two. They are both early tubs , both have LG Hewlands, and both have low offset front wheels , They could be the same car, but the Pugh car would have had a major rebuild ,altering some of the Lane "fingerprints" I would love to see how the Lane nose is fitted.
A short discussion with Rick Hall would now be in order I think.

#117 Duncan Fox

Duncan Fox
  • Member

  • 186 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 14 August 2006 - 21:22

This from Howden via Jerry;

As far as I was concerned the car that David Prophet had
was always an M10A, but which
probably fell into no-mans land between 10A and 10B. I seem to recall that
David always entered it as an M10B.
The fact that it always had a LG gearbox,as was fitted to the 10A's,
reinforced that notion. Some years
ago I went to Donington Park to drive a few cars for a documentary series
on the development of the racing car.
One of those I drove was that ex-Prophet car, by now owned by Ean Pugh. It
is the only one quite like it.

Hope this helps

#118 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 09 September 2006 - 02:56

The monocoque has now gone to Ian Gordon whose shop is based very close to Tony's "Robin Engineering" on the circuit at Infineon.
Ian and Gary, both New Zealanders, will strip and reskin the base tub, removing the front bulkhead and surrounding sheets of aluminum, replace the lower floor section, straighten any dings and dents but keep in the accident damage repair made in 69 after the Sears crash.
I want to retain the used and raced appearence of the basic car, I really do want to keep it as though its come straight out of 69, fresh from the track, not over restored and sterile.
The LG500 Transmission has joined all of the suspension components with Tony and has been stripped ready for a check and reassembly with all new bearings. Apparently, so far the only damaged item is the ring and pinion.
Meanwhile on a visit to the Historics at Monterey I met Pete Lyons, a well known photographer and author, who's spent most of his life documenting the various races on the West Coast since the 60's.
I've bought some of Pete's great photographs in the past and I asked him this time whether he'd have anything in his archives showing my McLaren piloted by George Eaton.
Pete kindly gave me permission to show these pictures, they are, of course, copyright Pete Lyons and his work can be viewed here http://www.petelyons.com
Here are the results

Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

Posted Image

#119 Vicuna

Vicuna
  • Member

  • 1,606 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 09 September 2006 - 08:42

Originally posted by Exact10
The monocoque has now gone to Ian Gordon whose shop is based very close to Tony's "Robin Engineering" on the circuit at Infineon.
Ian and Gary, both New Zealanders, will strip and reskin the base tub, removing the front
I've bought some of Pete's great photographs in the past and I asked him this time whether he'd have anything in his archives showing my McLaren piloted by George Eaton.


Is Ian a Kiwi? I thought he was Australian :confused:

Advertisement

#120 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 09 September 2006 - 09:44

I have been following this great thread since it first started.
What I have enjoyed most are the pictures of the "restoration process" so to speak...
I'm wondering if we might get to see some pics of the tub being re skinned etc.....

Whilst we're talking things McLaren 10A/B I was wondering if somewhere there is a current listing of all of the surviving cars, similar to the one Allen Brown has on his excellent site for the Lola T332.

Keep up the good work on this great project............

#121 eldougo

eldougo
  • Member

  • 8,052 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 09 September 2006 - 09:45

:wave:
Ian isan Aussie......

#122 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 09 September 2006 - 16:13

Thanks for the reply Leo,
I'll ask Ian and Gary to let me take some pics when they start to strip the tub, hopefully they'll be next month. Tony and Howden set me up with Ian Gordon, I'm really looking forward to him getting his teeth into it.
Have you seen the great thread, don't remember where on the internet, but its a resto of an early F5000 Crossle, the guy who did it made not only a great job of the work but also of documenting it. I've tried a search but can't find the page, can anybody post a link?
I'm also restoring a Lotus Eleven, bought form Howden Ganley (I really do owe Jerry Entin a beer)
I'll post a similar thread about that car too.
In the meantime both of the Porsche projects have been sold so that I can concentrate on the racers
Best Regards
Ian

PS I walked into that one Eldougo!

#123 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 09 September 2006 - 23:47

Originally posted by Leo D
Whilst we're talking things McLaren 10A/B I was wondering if somewhere there is a current listing of all of the surviving cars, similar to the one Allen Brown has on his excellent site for the Lola T332.

Nearly there. Probably this month.

#124 eldougo

eldougo
  • Member

  • 8,052 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 10 September 2006 - 00:26

:lol:

You sure did.....,Don't forget i will be in town soon and hopefully see you on the 3rd or 4th.
October,or meet up at I.G. workshop.

#125 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 10 September 2006 - 01:47

Yep, be happy to meet you up there, you can look at the tub and look at the suspension and box at Tony's place
Give me a call nearer the time and we'll make arrangements
925 580 1947

#126 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 11 September 2006 - 14:40

Does anyone have any contacts with the photographs of the late Alice Bixler, she was the photographer whose work was used in "Five minutes to green" by Frank Orr
Thanks

#127 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 19 September 2006 - 12:19

Ian,
Looking forward to those photos... :D :D

Allen,
Looking forward to reading that page...... :D :D

As far as I know, I think we only have one McLaren 10 A/B still living down under... anbody know for sure ??

#128 Ray Bell

Ray Bell
  • Member

  • 65,627 posts
  • Joined: December 99

Posted 19 September 2006 - 13:30

Originally posted by eldougo
Ian is an Aussie......


Is he an Aussie, is he, eh?

I always thought he was. Probably wouldn't have stayed with Max Stewart if he hadn't been, would he?

How many times I've heard old Andy talk about 'IG'...

#129 yasmin

yasmin
  • Member

  • 90 posts
  • Joined: September 06

Posted 19 September 2006 - 13:54

Originally posted by Leo D
Ian,
Looking forward to those photos... :D :D

Allen,
Looking forward to reading that page...... :D :D

As far as I know, I think we only have one McLaren 10 A/B still living down under... anbody know for sure ??


Only one I know of belongs to Max Warwick in melbourne

#130 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 19 September 2006 - 14:46

yasmin

Only one I know of belongs to Max Warwick in melbourne



Yes, Repco powered and it has not been seen since it had contact will the front straight wall at Sandown a few years back:(

Will it be seen again in November ???????

One can only hope.......

#131 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 11 November 2006 - 15:13

Although not running, it was great to see the car there..... :up: :up:
Posted Image

#132 Jerry Entin

Jerry Entin
  • Member

  • 5,524 posts
  • Joined: December 02

Posted 11 November 2006 - 15:57

Posted Image
Derek Bell in 1972 in Sid Taylor's Mk 10 McLaren at Elkhart Lake
photo lent site Tom Schultz copyright 2005 Tom Schultz.

#133 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 11 November 2006 - 16:55

Originally posted by Leo D
Although not running, it was great to see the car there..... :up: :up:
Posted Image

Hi Leo

Could I use your pictures on OldRacingCars.com?

Thanks

Allen

#134 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 12 November 2006 - 05:41

Allen
That's ok by me.... just drop me a PM to let me know what you want to do... I may have some other F5000 shots of interest to you.

#135 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 14 November 2006 - 17:52

I am today going to put the M10 up for sale/trade.
I've spent the last year trying to amass all of the parts needed to finish it and of course trying to get someone to reskin the monocoque.
I have all new suspension, the uprights and gearbox are being rebuilt by Tony at Robin and everything else you can see on this site. I am very sad to have come to this decision but if anyone has an interesting sports racer that they'd like to trade in some way just give me a call 925 580 1947
Ian

#136 macoran

macoran
  • Member

  • 3,989 posts
  • Joined: August 05

Posted 14 November 2006 - 17:55

What a pity !! I've recently been busy copying a lot of your posts into a word file.

#137 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 15 November 2006 - 04:55

:(

#138 Jerry Entin

Jerry Entin
  • Member

  • 5,524 posts
  • Joined: December 02

Posted 26 November 2006 - 07:16

Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
George Eaton at Riverside in 1969. George finished 7th. George finished 3rd at Seattle with this car. This is the car Ian is restoring. George won the heat race at Elkhart Lake and was leading in the main when the engine broke.
photos by Gil Munz-scanned for site by Ike Smith

#139 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 26 November 2006 - 15:14

OK Guys, as you were, I'm keeping it!
I'm going to have it reskinned as soon as possible

Jerry Entin, as usual Take a bow!
Fantastic photographs and as normal Jerry is working behind the scenes to help me with everything.
Howden Ganley has been doing the same, tirelessly firing emails all over the place trying to help me out
Thanks to both of you

Ian

Advertisement

#140 macoran

macoran
  • Member

  • 3,989 posts
  • Joined: August 05

Posted 26 November 2006 - 15:21

Originally posted by Exact10
OK Guys, as you were, I'm keeping it!


:clap: :up:

#141 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 5,351 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 26 November 2006 - 16:54

I'm really pleased that you're keeping it Ian.

Enjoy it!

Allen

#142 NGSmith

NGSmith
  • Member

  • 137 posts
  • Joined: July 06

Posted 26 November 2006 - 20:32

Ian,

I am glad you reconsidered. You probably saved me a lot of money because I was going to give you a call to rescue it! Good luck with the project and we look forward to seeing it on the track.

Nick

#143 275 GTB-4

275 GTB-4
  • Member

  • 8,274 posts
  • Joined: February 03

Posted 27 November 2006 - 06:59

Originally posted by Exact10
OK Guys, as you were, I'm keeping it!
I'm going to have it reskinned as soon as possible

Jerry Entin, as usual Take a bow!
Fantastic photographs and as normal Jerry is working behind the scenes to help me with everything.
Howden Ganley has been doing the same, tirelessly firing emails all over the place trying to help me out
Thanks to both of you

Ian


Congratulations Ian...do you know how to post videos???....let us see the first in-car you are happy with :clap:

#144 Leo D

Leo D
  • Member

  • 425 posts
  • Joined: June 06

Posted 27 November 2006 - 07:03

:up: :up: :smoking: :smoking:

#145 eldougo

eldougo
  • Member

  • 8,052 posts
  • Joined: March 02

Posted 27 November 2006 - 07:42

:wave:
Good news Ian( Exact10).....i do hope you get some help to finish this great project.
Cheers ....Eldougo.

#146 BarryD

BarryD
  • Member

  • 64 posts
  • Joined: April 06

Posted 05 January 2007 - 23:37

Duncan, Allen, All,

If any of you guys still want to have a look at my M10b while it is at Simon Hadfield's, you'd better be quick as it is now virtually finished and will be coming Down South to me in a week or so.

Simon has done a beautiful job finishing the car off for me, and I'll post some pix when it gets here.

Happy new Year.

Barry Davison

Posted Image

#147 RA Historian

RA Historian
  • Member

  • 3,741 posts
  • Joined: October 06

Posted 05 January 2007 - 23:57

Pity that those mufflers have to be on it................

#148 BarryD

BarryD
  • Member

  • 64 posts
  • Joined: April 06

Posted 06 January 2007 - 00:23

I agree, but ........
Sadly there are not too many places to play without them these days.
Better to use it with them, than just look at it without them.
BD

#149 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 24 January 2007 - 00:52

Back to the restoration!

Just today I collected the transmission from Tony at Robin, I must say he's made a lovely job of the box, it looks marvelous in it's correct oxide finish. He assures me it's as good inside as it is out. We had to replce the ring and pinion as well as the Hockey stick, I managed to get a great deal on the R and P from Chuck at Can Am cars.

Posted Image

Meanwhile, the monocoque is on its way to England, Kerry Adams is attending to this, he's also making a rollbar and selling me a good useable steering rack as my one is bent and craked. kerry came highly recommended by Howden Ganley who like Jerry Entin, Tony Nicholson, Giles Greenfield and Duncan Fox have remained as helpful and essential as ever.
Duncan is making a rear wing, an oil tank and some front wings (He's sharpening his pencil as I write)


#150 Exact10

Exact10
  • Member

  • 103 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 20 May 2007 - 05:23

The monocoque is well underway, Eamon Fullalove aka "Chalkie" is doing his stuff in England and as you can see he's taken the old tub all the way down to the last rivets.
I've also included a pic that shows the first colour, hidden under the various panels where it was originally McLaren orange.


Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image