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1973 Iso-Marlboro FX3B & 1974 Williams


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#101 Rob Ryder

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Posted 04 October 2010 - 18:22

This is another long shot request and good excuse to bring a jolly good read back to life :-)

I am wondering if any one at TNF might be able to help me locate two good quality photographs, one of Henri Pescarolo in the Politoys FX3 during practice for the 1972 Austrian GP, during which he crashed and did not take part in the race.

Pescarolo was in a March 721 for this race, not a Politoys FX3.

Check your PM's for a Migault pic :cool:

Rob

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#102 arttidesco

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Posted 04 October 2010 - 20:06

Pescarolo was in a March 721 for this race, not a Politoys FX3.

Check your PM's for a Migault pic :cool:

Rob


:blush: DOH! Don't I just love the feeling of egg running down my face :wave:

Thanks for the correction Rob, so I'll amend my request from a pic of Henri Pescarolo driving a Politoys in practice during the 1972 Austrian GP to a request for a nice pic of Henri Pescarolo driving the Williams Politoys March at the 1972 Austrian GP please :smoking:


#103 goro

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Posted 04 August 2013 - 11:44

Hello to all. I decided to build a model of the cars in scale 1/12. Is built from scratch. Some pictures of the buildings there
http://imgbox.com/g/cMTVV8JQgH
I know a few mistakes, but I want to finish the car.
Thank you all for documents that I found in this thread. There are not many, but certainly helped me.
have fun
Best regards
goro - Igor

Sorry, helped me google translator

Edited by goro, 04 August 2013 - 11:47.


#104 arttidesco

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 15:38

Fines

You said that FW-01 and FW-02 were rebuilt from IR-01 & and IR-02 respectively, but that FW-03 was a completely new chassis that never carried the IR designation?

Cross checking the accepted FW designations with the IR chassis listed in Motor Sport for 1974 Grand Prix I find;

FW-01 = IR-03
FW-02 = IR-02
FW-03 = IR-04

These are the only IR chassis numbers appearing in Motor Sports mag for 1974. The chassis used by Merzario from Brands Hatch onwards is definitely listed as IR-04.

So where does IR-03 come into the picture, as you only mention IR-01 and IR-02? This may not be complicated to Don, but is annoying the hell out of me!!!!

Rob

[p][Edited by Rob Ryder on 10-05-2000]

 

Apollonogies for bringing this old chestnut up again, but in the 1974 Spanish GP Notes DSJ, page 563, reports that the then new IR/04 had been renumbered by Frank as FW/04 is this now accepted as incorrect ?



#105 Michael Ferner

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 16:21

Doesn't make much sense to me! Perhaps a DSJ idiosyncrasy, in that he refered to the replacement chassis as IR-03, and hence the new car was IR-04 to him, even if it was called FW-03 (not -04!) from the start. From my POV, and apparently Williams's too, there were only two cars/entities in 1973, albeit one with a replacement chassis, and the new car was the third in the series. The two 1973 cars were renamed/renumbered in 1974, and maybe only at the Spanish GP, although I just checked and the German magazine Rallye Racing had the FW designation in Brazil already (still IR in the Argentine).

#106 arttidesco

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 16:46

Danke Herr Ferner.

 

DSJ referred to Arts new 1974 Spanish GP car as IR/04 all the way through to the 1975 South African GP !

 

To confuse matters DSJ refers to Arts new car at the 1975 Spanish GP as ... FW/04  :stoned:  

 

Does anyone know which month in 1974 ISO Rivolta went bankrupt ?



#107 arttidesco

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Posted 10 March 2014 - 16:57

Danke Herr Ferner.

 

DSJ referred to Arts new 1974 Spanish GP car as IR/04 all the way through to the 1975 South African GP !

 

To confuse matters DSJ refers to Arts new car at the 1975 Spanish GP as ... FW/04  :stoned:  

 

Does anyone know which month in 1974 ISO Rivolta went bankrupt ?

 

Correction DSJ has IR/04 at the 1975 Race of Champions !

 

Curiously in an unattributed piece entitled "Before We Loose Track", beneath the Race of Champions report,  the cars Frank Williams entered from 1969 - April 1975 are listed and there is no mention of IR/04 whatsoever,  but IR/03 is referred to as the "fourth car built" and that it was "renumbered FW/03 for 1975." 

 

Must have been some potent brew being passed around by scribes of the time.


Edited by arttidesco, 10 March 2014 - 16:58.


#108 goro

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 18:43

Correction DSJ has IR/04 at the 1975 Race of Champions !

 

Curiously in an unattributed piece entitled "Before We Loose Track", beneath the Race of Champions report,  the cars Frank Williams entered from 1969 - April 1975 are listed and there is no mention of IR/04 whatsoever,  but IR/03 is referred to as the "fourth car built" and that it was "renumbered FW/03 for 1975." 

 

Must have been some potent brew being passed around by scribes of the time.

I am very happy that my ISO in scale 1/12 now lives and did not die :clap:  :up:

http://cevert.rajce....-_rucna_vyroba/

goro



#109 arttidesco

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Posted 11 March 2014 - 22:23

I am very happy that my ISO in scale 1/12 now lives and did not die :clap:  :up:

http://cevert.rajce....-_rucna_vyroba/

goro

 

FW/03 is obviously not to be confused with you fabulous '73 Argentinian spec FX3B #FX3/2 :up:



#110 eldougo

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Posted 14 March 2014 - 01:31

From F1 1974 book page 135  Arturo Merzario in the 1974 car at Spanish GP.

 

zjSpKgi.jpg

 

Copyright unknown


Edited by eldougo, 14 March 2014 - 01:34.


#111 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 20:32

What - if anything - can anyone tell me about the designer John Clarke?

 

Other than him working on this, at March or on the Boxer F2 car, I can find next to nothing about him, biographically.

 

What did he do before, what did he do after, where was he from? etc etc

 

Does anyone know?



#112 chr1s

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Posted 15 April 2015 - 20:56

All I could find are these two paragraphs, taken from Doug's 1981 book Racers- the inside story of Williams Grand Prix engineering.

 

Frank took on an ex- March design engineer named John Clarke. He was a quiet, bespectacled, rather introverted engineer who had been responsible for the 1972 March Formula Two cars, which were very good indeed....  

       

Towards the end of season, in his search for engineering aid which he could persuade himself to trust, Frank called in (Gian Paolo) Dellara to advise on the cars. He decided that the rear suspension geometry could be improved, advised John Clarke, and Frank insisted Clarke make the modifications. This led to a split:  " Right or wrong I decided I had had a basinful of engineers learning about Formula One at my expense, and when John objected to my calling in more experienced men over his head, like (Ron) Tauranac or Dallara, we parted not on the best of terms..."



#113 Mallory Dan

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Posted 16 April 2015 - 18:14

The 72 March F2 cars were not 'very good indeed'. The 71 and 73 ones were though...



#114 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 16 April 2015 - 20:19

Thanks Chr1s, I appreciate you taking the time and effort to look.



#115 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 17 April 2015 - 05:44

The 72 March F2 cars were not 'very good indeed'. The 71 and 73 ones were though...

 

Lauda won the 1972 John Player British Formula 2 championship in a March 722.

 

Vince H.



#116 Andretti Fan

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Posted 17 April 2015 - 15:20

Always amazed me how Merzario could even see to drive. Compare where his eye level is at in relationship to the steering wheel and top of the roll hoop and then look at Jarier and make the same comparison. :cat:



#117 MCS

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Posted 17 April 2015 - 20:20

The 72 March F2 cars were not 'very good indeed'. The 71 and 73 ones were though...

 

Really not convinced by this, Dan - sorry. 

 

The 732 and the 73B Atlantic derivative were born out of the 722.  Both Peterson and Lauda ran front radiator/full wide-nosed 722s at the JPS F2 final at Oulton Park in practice in September 1972.  Lauda raced this configuration the following day.  This was the testbed for the 732 design which was finalised not long afterwards, just ahead of the BMW M12 engine deal announcement for the 1973 Formula Two season. That engine was absolutely paramount to the 732s success in F2.  The fact that there were so many 73Bs in Atlantic had a similar effect in Atlantic, although the Purley, Mallock, Paterson and Cooper cars - from memory - were all actually uprated 712Ms and/or 722s.



#118 JacnGille

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Posted 18 April 2015 - 01:25

Always amazed me how Merzario could even see to drive. Compare where his eye level is at in relationship to the steering wheel and top of the roll hoop and then look at Jarier and make the same comparison. :cat:

That was given as "the reason" Little Art was so quick...he couldn't see what he'd hit if he was to have an off. :cool: