9 replies to this topic

[howardt]

Does anyone know what the lateral G forces are on the high speed corners these days ?
I'm sure that Copse would have been among the highest G-loads on the F1 calendar.

It does make a difference, because the cars (specifically the tyres and aero) have become so developed now that they are pulling more G than ever before, and are getting very close to the point where it is actually dangerous.

There was an occasion a few years ago (and I think this was before the Indy/IRL split) where an Indy race was cancelled at the last minute because the oval was steeply banked and the drivers were enduring high G for extended periods, and were feeling dizzy and faint. Fighter pilots have to wear especially designed G-suits to keep blood circulating as they experience high G (although this is usually vertical). Once you get to higher G, strange things start to happen to the body, like for instance blood drains out of the eyeballs so that vision is impaired.

How long before we see F1 pilots wearing G-suits ?
I presume that this is the thinking behind Max's control tyres and weedy wings ?

[Buttoneer]

I'm sure I recently saw figures of around 5G but I'm sure others will dig out a proper reference for you.

[Spunout]

Once you get to higher G, strange things start to happen to the body, like for instance blood drains out of the eyeballs so that vision is impaired.

That is happening already (and has, for years).

[le chat noir]

4 or 5 seems about right. There were a few articles on this pre-Silverstone. Mansell used to claim pulling 8G - by adding up the sequence of corners!

[ivanalesi]

A week ago I was watching Mexico 1990 and Murray said that Patrese and Prost have reported 5g on the last corner So they are doing a good job on keeping cornering speeds down.
Otherwise, G-suits are still in development I know that almost any air force army in the world is using different type of g-suit... the latest technologies can work for loadings reaching 14g:) The most common is 7-9g, so this is at least 50% increase and it shouldnt be an issue when F1 cars reach this loading.

[Xig]

Originally posted by howardt
... There was an occasion a few years ago (and I think this was before the Indy/IRL split) where an Indy race was cancelled at the last minute because the oval was steeply banked and the drivers were enduring high G for extended periods, and were feeling dizzy and faint...

That was the CART race at Texas Motorspeedway on 2001. If I remember correctly it is a 1.5 mile oval, but due to the banking and the turbocharged engines the where running at speeds reached only in superspeedways.

They could do a few lap without problems, but after a few more laps, the drivers started to have blurry vision and headaches.

The problem there was not the lateral G forces, but the vertical G forces. As the banking was high, turning fast on such corners was somehow like a fast ascending on a fighter plane. IIRC, the resultant G force was like 5 or 6G. Not that much, but much of that was from the vertical vector, and they had those high loads for almost 80% of the lap.

I think that having 5G at one corner on F1 is not that dangerous, even having 7G would not be that dangerous (not considering any possible crash due to something going wrong mid corner), as they would be geting that load only a small fraction of time, not enough to drain the blood from the eyes or the brain.

well, that's my 2 cents.

[logic]

F = mv^2 / r
G = mg
F = Gk

=>

k = v^2 / rg

k tells how many G's

so if speed arounf corner is 120km/h or 120/3.6 m/s and corner radius is 20m then

k=(120/3,6)^2 / (20*9.81) = 5,7 x G

[Clatter]

Originally posted by howardt
Does anyone know what the lateral G forces are on the high speed corners these days ?
I'm sure that Copse would have been among the highest G-loads on the F1 calendar.

It does make a difference, because the cars (specifically the tyres and aero) have become so developed now that they are pulling more G than ever before, and are getting very close to the point where it is actually dangerous.

There was an occasion a few years ago (and I think this was before the Indy/IRL split) where an Indy race was cancelled at the last minute because the oval was steeply banked and the drivers were enduring high G for extended periods, and were feeling dizzy and faint. Fighter pilots have to wear especially designed G-suits to keep blood circulating as they experience high G (although this is usually vertical). Once you get to higher G, strange things start to happen to the body, like for instance blood drains out of the eyeballs so that vision is impaired.

How long before we see F1 pilots wearing G-suits ?
I presume that this is the thinking behind Max's control tyres and weedy wings ?

Unless they start running more long banked corners then they will never need g-suits.

Pilots need them because the g-force the direction of the force is forcing the blood away from their head, and they also have long periods of sustained G. F1 forces are not acting in the same direction as those experienced by pilots, and they are only for a fraction of a second at a time. The only real affect on an F1 driver is that it will make their necks tired, therefore they will probably need to concentrate more training in this area.

[Calorus]

Originally posted by Clatter


Unless they start running more long banked corners then they will never need g-suits.

Pilots need them because the g-force the direction of the force is forcing the blood away from their head, and they also have long periods of sustained G. F1 forces are not acting in the same direction as those experienced by pilots, and they are only for a fraction of a second at a time. The only real affect on an F1 driver is that it will make their necks tired, therefore they will probably need to concentrate more training in this area.

0

Very true, it should be noted that typical F1 driver training for the neck muscles consists of wearing a helmet with lead weights gaffa'd or strapped to it the doing reps.

[Andy Donovan]

I remember reading that Williams made inquries into buying g-suits back in the days when the cars had skirts, but I think it was just that - an inquiry just in case things got any more extreme. I don't think they ever really considered it seriously.
I wouldn't have thought an aviation flight suit would be much use anyway, as they are set up more for vertical g forces. Almostly purely sideways g forces from F1 cornering would probably need a different solution.