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S.Q.T. (stupid question thread)


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#4401 CoolBreeze

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Posted 03 April 2019 - 10:16

Cargolux is used more for bigger and oversized equipment. DHL is still used for smaller parts and also for customs clearance, etc, as DHL has better network etc across the world. For the flyawa races, the teams uses sea freight and load all their cargoes into containers, and set them out early to various places, IE China, Australia, etc.

 

It saves massive costs.



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#4402 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 03 April 2019 - 13:56

It may have been answered somewhere before, but I can't really find it.

 

Do all F1 teams assemble material etc etc at one centrally located airport for the fly-away races ?

 

Do the European based teams, Ferrari, Alfa and Toro Rosso arrange their own flights/transport.

 

OR...........are the British based teams picked up and do the planes then make a Euro stop to pick up the rest.

 

Then.....do these planes then stay at the fly-away port for the return transport.

 

I have no idea how 'dedicated' these flights are for the F1 material.

 

 

I know they fly in and out of East Midlands as their base. Read this article on how a Renault car gets around the world.

 

https://shippingandf...-f1-race-track/

 

https://www.leiceste...ipments-1749268



#4403 PayasYouRace

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Posted 03 April 2019 - 18:53

According to Wikipedia:



So etymologically being a "pole sitter" is a bit mad, as sitting directly on the pole would be a terrible place to start a horse race. However it does retain the fact that "pole" refers to an actual place (i.e. you can sit on it) and is not merely an abstract concept (i.e. a token given to the best qualifier, as in "set the fastest time").

Er, maybe. Trying to discover logical rules behind word usage rarely gets you anywhere.

If we’re getting into etymology, I’d love to know why every other language uses the English word “boxes” to describe what we call the pits.

#4404 Myrvold

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Posted 03 April 2019 - 19:33

If we’re getting into etymology, I’d love to know why every other language uses the English word “boxes” to describe what we call the pits.

Heh, here we call it "pit box". Always thought it was just stolen straight from English!



#4405 Winterapfel

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Posted 03 April 2019 - 20:49

Regarding the transport, I find this video very helpful in understanding what is involved!

https://youtu.be/6OLVFa8YRfM

#4406 Tiakumosan

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 01:12

Hey, I was wondering ... if a race has 50 laps, driver A is 2 laps down and finish the race with 48 laps, and driver B, not being lapped, completes lap 49 and has a failure at the last lap. Will driver A be ahead of driver B on final classification, because he completed the race, even though driver B completed more laps than him? Thanks.



#4407 Bleu

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 06:10

Hey, I was wondering ... if a race has 50 laps, driver A is 2 laps down and finish the race with 48 laps, and driver B, not being lapped, completes lap 49 and has a failure at the last lap. Will driver A be ahead of driver B on final classification, because he completed the race, even though driver B completed more laps than him? Thanks.

 

In car racing driver B is ahead in the standings. However in MotoGP, driver has to finish to be classified.



#4408 Clatter

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 10:54

Hey, I was wondering ... if a race has 50 laps, driver A is 2 laps down and finish the race with 48 laps, and driver B, not being lapped, completes lap 49 and has a failure at the last lap. Will driver A be ahead of driver B on final classification, because he completed the race, even though driver B completed more laps than him? Thanks.

In your scenario driver A would continue driving until they had completed 50 laps and take the chequered flag.

#4409 Marklar

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 11:56

In your scenario driver A would continue driving until they had completed 50 laps and take the chequered flag.

But driver A is two laps down, no? Race ends for him at 48 laps.

#4410 wingwalker

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 12:25

In car racing driver B is ahead in the standings. However in MotoGP, driver has to finish to be classified.


I think in F1 lap count matters, so the one with a larger number of completed laps would be ahead regardless of who sees the chequered flag.

With the emphasis on "I think".



#4411 Clatter

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 12:33

But driver A is two laps down, no? Race ends for him at 48 laps.

Ok, I was thinking that driver B was winning and driver A 2nd, silly reasoning on my part. The finishing places are classified when the last driver on the lead lap has crossed the line, so Driver B would be classified ahead of Driver A despite breaking down.

#4412 Sterzo

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 13:15

Hey, I was wondering ... if a race has 50 laps, driver A is 2 laps down and finish the race with 48 laps, and driver B, not being lapped, completes lap 49 and has a failure at the last lap. Will driver A be ahead of driver B on final classification, because he completed the race, even though driver B completed more laps than him? Thanks.

As Bleu says, driver B is classified ahead of driver A. The FIA's website tells us: "Any driver who completes over 90 percent of the race will be classified as a finisher, regardless of whether they were running as the winner took the chequered flag."

 

https://www.formula1...and_Points.html



#4413 7MGTEsup

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 14:38

As Bleu says, driver B is classified ahead of driver A. The FIA's website tells us: "Any driver who completes over 90 percent of the race will be classified as a finisher, regardless of whether they were running as the winner took the chequered flag."

 

https://www.formula1...and_Points.html

 

Is Monaco 1996 still the least amount of cars still running at the flag we have had till this point? Or were there races in the distant past with less runners at the finish?



#4414 Kalmake

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 19:35

Is Monaco 1996 still the least amount of cars still running at the flag we have had till this point?

Yes.



#4415 Sterzo

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Posted 17 April 2019 - 20:53

Does anyone know when the rule was changed to "Any driver who completes over 90 percent of the race will be classified as a finisher"?

 

It certainly wasn't the rule in the fifties and sixties, when you had to pass the chequered flag, hence drivers such as Brabham and Ireland pushing their cars round Monaco, and others pitting their steaming heaps and coming out again to limp round on the last lap.

 

In the early days of Grands Prix, you had to complete the full distance. The winner in 1906 (Szisz) finished in 5 hours 45 minutes and 30 seconds, but the 17th and last (Rougier) took 8hours 15 minutes and 55 seconds, so everyone was hanging around for two and a half hours waiting for him to finish. Not easy for the commentator.


Edited by Sterzo, 17 April 2019 - 20:54.


#4416 Kalmake

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 07:08

Does anyone know when the rule was changed to "Any driver who completes over 90 percent of the race will be classified as a finisher"?

1966.

 

Monaco that year had 4 classified (still the record fewest) and 6 running at the end.



#4417 w1Y

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 07:21

Do teams that regularly get lapped build that in to their fuel calcs and engine usage

#4418 Marklar

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 07:54

Do teams that regularly get lapped build that in to their fuel calcs and engine usage

They even underfuel the cars based on SC probabilities. It's always better to save fuel during the race than to have too much weight.

Edited by Marklar, 18 April 2019 - 07:55.


#4419 w1Y

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Posted 18 April 2019 - 08:09

They even underfuel the cars based on SC probabilities. It's always better to save fuel during the race than to have too much weight.


Im aware of the safety car probability so assume its save to say the likes of williams account for at least 1 less lap. Not like it makes much difference for them. Im thinking the renaults and Haas.

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#4420 Tiakumosan

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Posted 19 April 2019 - 16:13

Thanks everyone for the answers!



#4421 Kalmake

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Posted 19 April 2019 - 16:26

KMag in 2018 USGP just barely wasn't lapped and ended up using too much fuel*. Leader pace was maybe a bit slower than they anticipated with Räikkönen holding up Verstappen and Hamilton.

 

*In this case they didn't under fuel but went over the maximum 105kg allowed.



#4422 GenJackRipper

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Posted 20 April 2019 - 09:30

If we’re getting into etymology, I’d love to know why every other language uses the English word “boxes” to describe what we call the pits.

Perhaps from hearing the teams yell "Box!" "Box!" "Box!" every race? :D
 



#4423 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 12:28

Why does Jack Aitken have "Han Sae-Young" in Korean next to his name on Twitter?



#4424 Anja

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 12:37

I don't know exactly how it works but supposedly it's his "alternative" Korean name (his mother is from South Korea). 



#4425 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 12:38

Perhaps from hearing the teams yell "Box!" "Box!" "Box!" every race? :D


I’m after a serious answer. F1 teams tend to say boxes on the radio because they’ve tended to have non English speakers in their cars for many years. It might be easier to hear over the radio. But the word boxes is used in many languages to mean the pits and I’m surprised they don’t have a natural word for it.

#4426 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 12:54

I don't know exactly how it works but supposedly it's his "alternative" Korean name (his mother is from South Korea). 

 

thank you!



#4427 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:08

I’m after a serious answer. F1 teams tend to say boxes on the radio because they’ve tended to have non English speakers in their cars for many years. It might be easier to hear over the radio. But the word boxes is used in many languages to mean the pits and I’m surprised they don’t have a natural word for it.


It wasn't always so. I remember when it first started to be used in favour of pit. I imagine that it is a much easier word to understand over a radio and that it refers to the painted box outside of the pit.

#4428 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:25

It wasn't always so. I remember when it first started to be used in favour of pit. I imagine that it is a much easier word to understand over a radio and that it refers to the painted box outside of the pit.


What wasn’t always so? I just said what you’ve said about the radios.

#4429 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:35

What wasn’t always so?


The use of the word box. It's relatively recent.

#4430 Kalmake

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:36

'Box' means garage and such in French, German and Italian. Maybe the term was adopted to English F1 lingo from one of those.



#4431 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:40

'Box' means garage and such in French, German and Italian. Maybe the term was adopted to English F1 lingo from one of those.

Ok thanks. In Spanish too.

What I’m getting at is why they use the English word “box” and not their natural “garage/garaje/etc.

The use of the word box. It's relatively recent.

Only on the radio, as I said. As Kalmake says, it’s the word for garage in many languages.

#4432 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:51

'Box' means garage and such in French, German and Italian. Maybe the term was adopted to English F1 lingo from one of those.

in France they're ravitaillements

#4433 Tiakumosan

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:57

Garagem in portuguese.

#4434 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 13:59

Ok thanks. In Spanish too.

In spanish, a pit is a pozo.

#4435 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:00

In spanish, a pit is a pozo.


A pit as in a hole in the ground. Not pits at a race track. Those are “boxes”.

#4436 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:05

A pit as in a hole in the ground. Not pits at a race track. Those are “boxes”.


No, that's foro. A pozo de taller is a garage workshop.

#4437 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:16

No, that's foro. A pozo de taller is a garage workshop.


Pretty sure a pozo is a well (as in, where you pull water up from). But that’s my point again. There’s a word for it in a not racing context, and yet, “boxes” at a race track.

However maybe we’re getting somewhere now. That’s two languages where you repair your cars at a racetrack, not at a garage, but in some sort of hole in the ground, at least linguistically. Well it’s likely that comes from inspection pits which pre date cars and would originate in railway sheds. Perhaps that’s where some of these words come from because most racing terms come from horse racing but you generally don’t need a pit to inspect the underside of a horse.

#4438 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:27

Pretty sure a pozo is a well (as in, where you pull water up from). But that’s my point again. There’s a word for it in a not racing context, and yet, “boxes” at a race track.
However maybe we’re getting somewhere now. That’s two languages where you repair your cars at a racetrack, not at a garage, but in some sort of hole in the ground, at least linguistically. Well it’s likely that comes from inspection pits which pre date cars and would originate in railway sheds. Perhaps that’s where some of these words come from because most racing terms come from horse racing but you generally don’t need a pit to inspect the underside of a horse.

In spanish, many words have many meanings. Take bomba as an instance, a bomb or apump here in fact, avlightbulb, not sure if that is the case on the mainland. Yes, a pozo can be a well, but a pozo de taller is a workshop. I disagree with the contention that box means garage in many languages. My view is that it refers to the painted box, imported into the uk from America where they often only have a painted box in the front of the pitwall where the pit garages are.

Edited by milestone 11, 27 April 2019 - 14:28.


#4439 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:30

In spanish, many words have many meanings. Take bomba as an instance, a bomb or apump here in fact, avlightbulb, not sure if that is the case on the mainland. Yes, a pozo can be a well, but a pozo de taller is a workshop. I disagree with the contention that box means garage in many languages. My view is that it refers to the painted box, imported into the uk from America where they often only have a painted box in the front of the pitwall where the pit garages are.

I’m familiar with the idea of words having multiple meanings. I speak English after all.

But the use of “boxes” in English to mean the pits has developed from foreign languages which have been using it longer.

You’d also have to forgive my occasional mistakes is Spanish because in Llanito we have a lot of “Spanish” words that aren’t correct Spanish.

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#4440 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:34

I’m familiar with the idea of words having multiple meanings. I speak English after all.
But the use of “boxes” in English to mean the pits has developed from foreign languages which have been using it longer.

Tim Murray will know it's origin. If he doesn't make a comment in a day or two, I shall PM him.

Edited by milestone 11, 27 April 2019 - 14:34.


#4441 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 14:41

I’m familiar with the idea of words having multiple meanings. I speak English after all.
But the use of “boxes” in English to mean the pits has developed from foreign languages which have been using it longer.
You’d also have to forgive my occasional mistakes is Spanish because in Llanito we have a lot of “Spanish” words that aren’t correct Spanish.

With regard your edit, which you buggers can do covertly, the same applies here. I thought that I'd seen you mention somewhere that you were from the rock but to be honest, until your mention of Llanito, I wasn't aware that it had it's own language, should have guessed so because of Jerriaise. Regardless, here, a bus is only ever a guagua which I do not believe is used in Spain but is in SA.

#4442 Tim Murray

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 20:29

Tim Murray will know it's origin. If he doesn't make a comment in a day or two, I shall PM him.


Sorry M11, but I can’t help too much here. The term ‘pits’ first came about at the 1908 Grand Prix de l’ACF at Dieppe, where the organisers chose to site the replenishment depots immediately in front of the main grandstand at the start line. To avoid blocking the view of the first few rows in the grandstand, a long trench was dug in front of it and divided up into compartments for each team, where the fuel, spare tyres, etc were kept, along with a few team personnel. (In those days only the driver and his riding mechanic were allowed to work on the car during stops.)

I first became aware of the term ‘box’ in 1973, when during the Nürburgring 1,000 Km sports car race Arturo Merzario disobeyed Ferrari team orders by refusing to pit in spite of being shown the ‘BOX’ sign on his pit board for several laps. (No radios in those days.)

So Ferrari were using the term ‘box’ more than 45 years ago. My understanding is that ‘Die Boxen’ is German for ‘the pits’ but I’ve no idea how and when this originated. Perhaps some of our German contributors can help here. :wave:

#4443 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 22:12

... in Llanito we have a lot of “Spanish” words that aren’t correct Spanish.


Wow, it is strange, some words are completely English though appear to be spelt phonetically. As wiki says, Spanglish. Incidently, I notice that "pa ti" is used instead of "para ti", this is Mexican as is guagua (pronounced wahwah).

Edited by milestone 11, 28 April 2019 - 08:17.


#4444 milestone 11

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Posted 27 April 2019 - 22:20

So Ferrari were using the term ‘box’ more than 45 years ago. My understanding is that ‘Die Boxen’ is German for ‘the pits’ but I’ve no idea how and when this originated. Perhaps some of our German contributors can help here. :wave:


Thanks Tim.

#4445 PayasYouRace

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 06:55

Wow, it is strange, some words are completely English though appear to becspelt phonetically. As wiki says, Spanglish. Incidently, I notice that "pa ti" is used instead of "para ti", this is Mexican as is guagua (pronounced wahwah).

 

We've occasionally met Mexicans and Argentineans and both occasionally use words we use. I suspect older forms of the language. The mother country usually evolves its language fastest.

 

Though ours is a completely different dialect to the Spanglish that Southern Californians (for example) use, having spoken to some of them too.



#4446 PlatenGlass

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 07:08

When did starting from the pitlane become an actual penalty rather than something drivers just do if they have a problem that prevents them getting to the grid in time for the race?

#4447 Sndr

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 07:34

 Perhaps some of our German contributors can help here. :wave:

 

I am a German speaker and I've always thought "die Boxen" was something that was introduced into German from the English language. We do have the term in the same other contexts as English does (meaning case or crate) yet it does not strike me as an original German term (I might be wrong though). In the context of motorsports I do not think there is another German term for box. The pit straight is the "Boxengasse" (Gasse meaning alley), a pit stop is a Boxenstop. 


Edited by Sndr, 28 April 2019 - 07:35.


#4448 thegforcemaybewithyou

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 07:43

Maybe the root of box again comes from the equestrian world similar to the pole sitter. Horse are usually locked into boxes.



#4449 Tim Murray

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 08:10

I’ve asked the question on TNF in case anyone there might have some more info:

Origins of the terms ‘box’ and ‘pit’

#4450 thegforcemaybewithyou

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Posted 28 April 2019 - 09:00

Another term that is often used in German and has a connection to horses is Rennstall when referring to racings teams. Rennen means to race/run and Stall is the building where farmers keep their animals.