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Ted Lisle, UK / Australia


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#1 Terry Walker

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 12:08

Former jet bomber pilot and I believe former squadron leader Edward "Ted" Lisle moved to Oz in the late 60s, and had a lot of success driving a Mini Cooper 1071S. His son Rick Lisle also became a noted Cooper S exponent here.

Before that, back in UK, he apparently raced some F2. I have him down in the 1958 USAF Trophy at Silverstone, 7th in a Harper Max FWA. (Harper Max??)

Is anything more known about his UK racing experience? I've pretty well exhausted all avenues of info south of the equator.

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#2 David McKinney

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 13:29

Wasn't the USAF Trophy a Snetterton event?
Or were there more than one?

#3 Terry Walker

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 14:19

Blowed if I know. Worse, I'm not sure where I got that info from. I think I googled Ted Lisle out of curiosity and that was all I got.

#4 KJJ

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 06:21

Originally posted by Terry Walker
Blowed if I know. Worse, I'm not sure where I got that info from. I think I googled Ted Lisle out of curiosity and that was all I got.


Think you might have found it here. I've only managed a quick look but there doesn't seem to be a mention of this race in Autosport or Motor Sport for the date shown. When was the Snetterton race?

#5 RAP

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 07:15

USAF Trophy was held at Silverstone 12th July 1958. A 10 lap scratch race for cars up to 1500cc. It was part of the Aston Martin Owners Club meeting.

#57 Sqdn-Ldr E J Lisle Harper-Max 1100cc car's year 1958 Entrant E J Harper

No mention in the Autosport report.

RAP

#6 humphries

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 08:52

Following on from Richard, the Harper Max-Climax #46 was entered in the race for 1100cc Sports Cars at Snetterton on 27 July to be driven by Lisle but it was a non-starter.

Again it was entered for two races at the N.S.C.C. meeting at Silverstone 30 August simply as the Harper-Climax # 25 with E.J.Harper down to drive but I have no knowledge of how well it went or whether it even started. The car may well have taken part in sprints.

In 1958 1100cc sports car racing in the UK was very competitive with hordes of well-sorted Lotus XIs battling with the works Elva MkIIIs. One-off specials needed to be very good, such as Eric Broadley's car proved to be.

I have never seen a photo of the Harper. Anybody?

John

#7 Terry Walker

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 09:19

It was a sports car? I sort of assumed it was an F2 single seater.

Anyway, it seems Ted Lisle didn't make many waves in the UK, but then if he was a serving RAAF officer he might have been short on spare time.

#8 Wilyman

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Posted 23 September 2006 - 06:51

Terry Walker.
Sqd Ldr Ted Lisle. RAAF ? Steady on old chap. That's RAF dontcher know?*
Flew the Neptune or was it Canberra? bombers.

*Yes I know that you know.;)

#9 cavvy

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Posted 23 September 2006 - 12:35

I always believed Ted flew Vulcans?

The 1071 was soon updated to 1275/1293/1310.

Where is son Rick these days - Rick was a Mini punter of no mean talent mainly in the John Harris Team duelling the Le May cars post Caversham.

#10 wdm

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Posted 23 September 2006 - 20:01

A spot of Googling and a leap of faith leads to this page... http://www.bauform.n...il_nl_66-1.html

Sounds like this might be the self-same Mr Lisle?

Willie

#11 Terry Walker

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Posted 24 September 2006 - 05:13

That's the Ted Lisle is I thinking of all right. A million thanks. Oh and er . . RAF indeed. Slip of the digit. My B.i.L was in the RAAF.

#12 Terry Walker

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 11:44

Cavvy - Rick lives in Mandurah, and is soon to move back to Perth.

#13 Geoff.Harrison

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Posted 27 September 2006 - 12:00

He competed in an Austin Seven Ulster during the early 60's in 750 and VSCC hillclimbs and race meetings .

#14 mikeallen

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Posted 03 February 2015 - 10:17

Ted Lisle also raced at the 1962 Gold Cup meeting at Oulton Park in a Mini alongside Flt. Lt. Len Gibson but sadly retired. Seems he was quite a flier, DFC and bar!!



#15 Team Result

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Posted 13 September 2021 - 08:35

Not recalling the name, I just did an internet search for Ted Lisle and wound up here. An entry list for the 1968 Surfers Paradise Six Hour Race just published by Bob Williamson on his Old Motor Racing Photographs - Australia FB page perked my interest. It lists Ted and a Len O'Sullivan? as drivers of Frank Matich's Matich SR3 Repco! Furthermore, Frank and Glynn Scott are listed as drivers of a Dennis Kennedy? entered Ferrari 212? from Queensland! History shows that Frank and Scotty lead the race in Frank's SR3 until stopped by an oil leak with less than an hour to go and the Geoghegan brothers won in the Scuderia Veloce Ferrari 250LM. Can anyone shed any light on the above two unusual entries?



#16 cooper997

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Posted 14 September 2021 - 03:45

I can't see the facebook 1968 entry list, although I can see 1966.

 

Ted Lisle and Don O'Sullivan ran a Lola in 1968.

 

If Seldo aka David Seldon hasn't been sacred off completely, he may recall something of the West Aussies. Given he left his mark on this event's history with the Volvo rollover. 

 

Terry Walker's now woundup website, would ultimately have been the place to look for all things Western Australian. Try the wayback machine looking for terrywalkersplace might get you there.

 

 

Stephen



#17 Team Result

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Posted 14 September 2021 - 12:22

I can't see the facebook 1968 entry list, although I can see 1966.

Ted Lisle and Don O'Sullivan ran a Lola in 1968.

If Seldo aka David Seldon hasn't been sacred off completely, he may recall something of the West Aussies. Given he left his mark on this event's history with the Volvo rollover.

Terry Walker's now woundup website, would ultimately have been the place to look for all things Western Australian. Try the wayback machine looking for terrywalkersplace might get you there.


Stephen

It is hard to find as Bob posted it as a reply to someone's question, not as a separate pic/post. Try scrolling down until 1500hrs Sept 13th. Initially I thought the SR3 entry was a typo and it was meant to be Don O'Sullivan....Now, re-checking there are two entries for Don O'Sullivan Racing : Drivers; ? Kennedy (likely the entrant of the mysterious Ferrari 212), Trevor Baltzer and ? Bassett (likely Queenslander Trevor Bassett) in Don's Lola and Drivers; Howie Sangster and Ted Lisle in a Mini Cooper S. Then, more confusing, Don is listed as a driver in a Porsche entered by F.(Fritz) Kohout and co-driven by Howie and F. Kohout. My opinion is that this entry list was printed early (remember Speed Week had events on two consecutive weekends) while there many driver negotiations were on going, especially in the Matich and O'Sullivan camps. Circuit owner, Keith Williams is even doubly entered in both his Monaro and a Ferrari GTC?, with Max Stahl and Evan Thomas respectively as his co-drivers!

#18 cooper997

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Posted 15 September 2021 - 05:21

Ross, I've tried scrolling through and no luck finding it.

 

I have a couple of the Surfers 12 hour programmes that fortunately have the inserts still. But no access to the 1968 Six hour.

 

O'Sullivan is in the results of the RCN report in the 911 you mention. If you haven't got access to the Oct 68 RCN, then pm your email address and I'll send it through.

 

 

Stephen



#19 Team Result

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Posted 16 September 2021 - 09:39

Stephen,

here it is.

1968-Surfers-Six-Hour.jpghttps://i.postimg.cc...rs-Six-Hour.jpg



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#20 GazChed

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Posted 16 September 2021 - 10:59

Looking at the entry list, I see the Ferrari 212 is powered by a 3.3 litre engine. This possibly suggests it was a Ferrari Dino 206S chassis powered by a Ferrari 275 engine.

Apart from the 212s of the early fifties, the only other 212 I can think of is the car based on a 206S but powered by a 2 litre V12 engine derived from the 1.5 litre Formula One engine which dominated the 1969 European Hillclimb championship.

I wonder if the Surfers Paradise 212 was even built ? It doesn't feature in the results on racingsportscars.com and such a car would surely have attracted a lot of interest at the time. Or is it just a 250/275 by a different name ?

#21 Team Result

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Posted 17 September 2021 - 01:06

Looking at the entry list, I see the Ferrari 212 is powered by a 3.3 litre engine. This possibly suggests it was a Ferrari Dino 206S chassis powered by a Ferrari 275 engine.

Apart from the 212s of the early fifties, the only other 212 I can think of is the car based on a 206S but powered by a 2 litre V12 engine derived from the 1.5 litre Formula One engine which dominated the 1969 European Hillclimb championship.

I wonder if the Surfers Paradise 212 was even built ? It doesn't feature in the results on racingsportscars.com and such a car would surely have attracted a lot of interest at the time. Or is it just a 250/275 by a different name ?

Thanks for the explanation. When I first read the entry list I had to search online to find out what model a 212 was. I then concluded that this entry was either a typo or completely made up entry name. It certainly wasn't a car from the 1950's! Your suggestion of a modified Dino makes more sense. Much later I instructed at a Queensland Ferrari Owners Club day and recall that Trevor Bassett was a member. In conclusion, I'm going for this entry being a modified Dino 206S road car owned by Dennis Kennedy, born of a conversation at a FOC meeting and never getting beyond the 'what if' stage. 



#22 ellrosso

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Posted 17 September 2021 - 08:36

Sounds like the Scuderia Veloce 250LM with its 3.3 V12....  I've got the Racing Car News race report somewhere in the garage - I'll see if I can find it.



#23 GazChed

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Posted 17 September 2021 - 19:11

Did Scuderia Veloce have more than one 250 LM ? The race winner was a Scuderia Veloce 250 LM driven by the Geoghegans, with Scuderia Veloce's other entries, a 275 GTB and a 350 P4 finishing 9th and retiring respectively. For the record the Ferrari Dino 206S was a 2 litre sports racing car while the Dino 246 GT was the road car.

Putting in 'Dennis Kennedy Ferrari 212'I came across a website by the name of www.barchetta.cc which contained a thread referring to a Ferrari 212 Inter Vignale Berlinetta which was built and imported into Australia in 1952. In 1960 it was raced at Warwick Farm Raceway and sometime between then and 1976 it was owned by a Dennis Kennedy. In 1976 it was sold having been restored. Is this ageing car possibly the basis of Kennedy's Ferrari 212 or just a red herring ?

#24 Team Result

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Posted 17 September 2021 - 23:02

Did Scuderia Veloce have more than one 250 LM ? The race winner was a Scuderia Veloce 250 LM driven by the Geoghegans, with Scuderia Veloce's other entries, a 275 GTB and a 350 P4 finishing 9th and retiring respectively. For the record the Ferrari Dino 206S was a 2 litre sports racing car while the Dino 246 GT was the road car.

Putting in 'Dennis Kennedy Ferrari 212'I came across a website by the name of www.barchetta.cc which contained a thread referring to a Ferrari 212 Inter Vignale Berlinetta which was built and imported into Australia in 1952. In 1960 it was raced at Warwick Farm Raceway and sometime between then and 1976 it was owned by a Dennis Kennedy. In 1976 it was sold having been restored. Is this ageing car possibly the basis of Kennedy's Ferrari 212 or just a red herring ?

Great sleuthing there! Thanks to cooper997, I have now read the RCN report on this race. No mention of the mystery Ferrari 212, though it confirms the notation on the entry list that Frank Matich and Glynn Scott lead the race for almost five hours until the Matich SR3's engine blew. Furthermore and to bring this thread back on to its topic, it confirms that Don O'Sullivan and Ted Lisle shared the former's Lola T70 and were running third when Lisle hit the oil from the SR3 in the sweeper at the end of the straight and crashed. 



#25 cooper997

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Posted 18 September 2021 - 07:38

GazChed, SV only had the 1 much used and abused 250LM. As far as I'm aware the 275 you mention was Bill Brown's GTB, subject of a cover/feature in November 1968 Sports Car World.

 

Top left of this cover is the 212 referenced in the Surfers list. First Ferrari brought into Australia by W H Lowe.

 

Bill Lowe debuted the car in competition at November 1952 Rob Roy Hillclimb. By Surfers 1968 it may have been a little bit of optimism for Mr Kennedy entering.

 

1982-SCW-Ferrari-TNF.jpg

cooper997 collection

 

 

Stephen



#26 GazChed

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Posted 18 September 2021 - 11:40

The breadth of the entry list is fascinating, ranging from the Scuderia Veloce Ferraris, a Lola T70 and the Matich SR3 to Mini Coopers, an NSU and a Renault R8. Thanks to this thread I now know what a Brolga M1500 (very pretty) and a Buckle GTZ look like and I don't think a sixteen year old Ferrari would have looked far out of place. The fact that drivers of the calibre of Frank Matich and Glyn Scott were involved just adds to the mystery.

#27 ellrosso

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Posted 20 September 2021 - 08:10

Interesting entry list for the '68 Surfers 12 hr. Malcolm Bailey's EH with Chev V8  - wonder if that made the start - Jim Sullivan as co driver. Don O'Sullivan and Howie Sangster sharing Fritz Kahout's Porsche 911S - this car won the Caversham enduro in 1968.

Would have been as reliable as clockwork at Surfers - did it race?



#28 GazChed

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Posted 20 September 2021 - 09:22

According to racingsportscars.com the Kahout/O'Sullivan/ Sangster/Starcevich Porsche 911S finished fourth overall and won the 2 litre GT class, completing 224 laps to the winning 250 LM's 249 laps.

The EH Chevrolet doesn't feature in the results as a finisher or a retirement so presumably was a non starter. Apart from the winning Ferrari 250 LM, the only other starters in the big sports racing class were the Ferrari 350 P4, the Lola T70 and the Matich SR3.

Edited by GazChed, 20 September 2021 - 09:35.


#29 Team Result

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Posted 20 September 2021 - 23:03

Interesting entry list for the '68 Surfers 12 hr. Malcolm Bailey's EH with Chev V8  - wonder if that made the start - Jim Sullivan as co driver. Don O'Sullivan and Howie Sangster sharing Fritz Kahout's Porsche 911S - this car won the Caversham enduro in 1968.

Would have been as reliable as clockwork at Surfers - did it race?

I'm unsure whether the regs allowed cross-entered drivers to drive more than one car in the event. From race reports, Don O'Sullivan drove his Lola T70 that crashed on the SR3's oil and Howie Sangster was at the wheel of the O'Sullivan Racing Mini when it crashed in to two officials' cars! So, who co-drove the Porsche?


Edited by Team Result, 20 September 2021 - 23:03.


#30 GazChed

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Posted 21 September 2021 - 05:56

The Porsche 911S is listed on WSRP as being entered by Fritz Kahout and driven by him and shared by Don O'Sullivan, Howie Sangster and Stan Starcevich. Judging by that it seems you could almost drive any car you wanted ! Anyone know why the Ferrari 350 P4 retired ?

Edited by GazChed, 21 September 2021 - 05:57.


#31 cooper997

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Posted 21 September 2021 - 11:22

GazChed, early on Bill Brown had an incident involving a slower car is the short version.

 

David McKay's SV book has the story page 171-72.

 

Can post or email if required.

 

 

Stephen



#32 Kendevine

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Posted 24 September 2021 - 00:58

Ted Lisle drove the Don O'Sullivan Lola T70 at Caversham a number of times, I well remember starting him in the Handicap races. He was also down as co driver with Fritz Kahout in the Porsche 911 that won the 1968 6 hr race. He was a very friendly guy. In Later years he raced at the Historic York Flying 50 races. At one time he even drove the famous Maybach Corvette.


Edited by Kendevine, 24 September 2021 - 01:00.