11 replies to this topic

[wingwalker]

after the clarification which siad the MSC - PDLR incident in hungary was OK (so PA - NH in italy wasn't even investigated) what do you guys think will happend at suzuka? nothing? a few incidents? chicane cutting en masse? considering position they are in (fighting for WDC and WCC) ferrari and renault might abandon reasoning all together and order the drivers to cut anytime they wan't as long as it won't do pernament damage to the tyres... cause if it is ok to cut the chicane once it is ok to cut it twice.. and thanks to brilliant minds at FIA cutting the chicane whether for defensive or offensive purposes IS ok as for now...

but this the chicane in question: (i'd paste picture here but i'm not sure whether it's ok with the copyrights)

http://show.imagehos..._-1_1648658.jpg

[pUs]

Well, I don't know what to say. I don't expect it to be an issue.

[le chat noir]

Quickest way through that chicane, is to take the chicane. Running across the grass won't work like FA at Monza or MS in Hungary.

[ensign14]

Somebody cut a chicane a few years ago and lost the Championship as a result to a Ferrari driver.

[HoldenRT]

I can't be sure because I can't view the picture (imageshack is better ;) ) but I'm assuming you are talking about the same chicane that Alonso cut last year, when trying to outbrake Klien after going through 130R?

It's puzzling though because if that's true le chat noir's comment doesn't make sense, because you can gain an advantage from cutting it, as we saw from Alonso last year, when the FIA ordered him to give back the position to Klien. (not realising he already had, but yeah)

Last year, that was an illegal cut, after the precident in Monza, it would be legal. Indeed there could be more problems especially if there is rain around and the track is extra slippery. That's the bed FIA has made, they have to lie in it. Hopefully we don't see anything to crazy.

Without any penalties we shouldn't see any of the faster cars at the back anyway, so they won't be taking such risks as last year. Then again it looks like it could be a wet qually, but maybe this year it won't be such a lottery, as the qualifying system is different now so..

[Buttoneer]

I agree with HoldenRT.

There will unquestionably be a lot of pressure on drivers to make full use of the track. I expect there to be either a 'clarification' on the Friday or a major uproar when someone cuts this during qualy on Saturday.

We'll have to wait and see...

[Gemini]

Originally posted by le chat noir
Quickest way through that chicane, is to take the chicane. Running across the grass won't work like FA at Monza or MS in Hungary.

I remember Ralf getting drive through one year because whenm recorded fastest lap by cutting chicane

[le chat noir]

Originally posted by HoldenRT
I can't be sure because I can't view the picture (imageshack is better ;) ) but I'm assuming you are talking about the same chicane that Alonso cut last year, when trying to outbrake Klien after going through 130R?

It's puzzling though because if that's true le chat noir's comment doesn't make sense, because you can gain an advantage from cutting it, as we saw from Alonso last year, when the FIA ordered him to give back the position to Klien. (not realising he already had, but yeah)

Last year, that was an illegal cut, after the precident in Monza, it would be legal. Indeed there could be more problems especially if there is rain around and the track is extra slippery. That's the bed FIA has made, they have to lie in it. Hopefully we don't see anything to crazy.

Without any penalties we shouldn't see any of the faster cars at the back anyway, so they won't be taking such risks as last year. Then again it looks like it could be a wet qually, but maybe this year it won't be such a lottery, as the qualifying system is different now so..

Ah, you could be right - its that corner. I had in mind MS and RS and also MS against Sato, was it?, where they sort of out-braked themselves, but were then spinning and all sorts on that surface, and bounced up and down by the kerbs.

If you see the pic, there are two tarmac ways thru, the way, and another, slower way with tighter corners, and a tighter exit so slower speed on the start/finish straight. To cut thru the middle you need to go on the astroturf type stuff, for a longer period than either that Monza or Hungary chicane which were both tarmac.

So what I'm saying is, tho with this new interpretation, you would choose to cut Hungary and Monza, you'd be safer here not to. Could still happen, but it would be dynamic action, not planned. So I don't see a big issue, but that's not to say there won't be the odd one.

[Dudley]

If the FIA could stop changing rules just for Renault's benefit we wouldn't have to have this discussion.

[RDM]

More interestingly though, presumably, is the precedent set by FA in Monza, where he was able to come from behind, only get in front (of NH?) by hugely out-braking himself, and then cutting the chicane.

As this was apparently declared legal by the Monza stewards...possibly being intimdated by Alonso's bizarre pre-race comments, the nature of the final chicane at Suzuka would seem to be particularly open to abuse by more of these type of out-brake-yourself-to-overtake manouvers.

[lukywill]

caracol should be a good chicanne for marketing.

[Dudley]

Originally posted by RDM
More interestingly though, presumably, is the precedent set by FA in Monza, where he was able to come from behind, only get in front (of NH?) by hugely out-braking himself, and then cutting the chicane.

As this was apparently declared legal by the Monza stewards...possibly being intimdated by Alonso's bizarre pre-race comments, the nature of the final chicane at Suzuka would seem to be particularly open to abuse by more of these type of out-brake-yourself-to-overtake manouvers.

Exactly. Frogs In Autos once again changed or created a rule to rig the championship in Renault's favour, only to have it backfire on them. Again.