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Does anybody miss DSJ?


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#301 kayemod

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 11:40

According to Doug Nye in Jenks: A passion for motor sport (P 196) he registered as a conscientious objector.  If writing an article on him, you must read that book.

 

Typical Jenks perversity, given his work at the time, I'm sure he would have been 'reserved'. He'd just have registered as a 'conchie' to piss people off.



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#302 Doug Nye

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 17:38

Jenks registered his conscientious objection to active service on the grounds that he had no argument with Germany and Germans, nor with Italy and Italians, nor with anybody much...apart from the politicians of each of the above, plus those governing the UK and the British Empire...who had gone to war without asking him and had thereby buggered up the motor racing and motor-cycle racing calendar - which was the only factor he wanted to govern his life. 

 

DCN



#303 Ray Bell

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 23:04

That's great reasoning, such that it should be all that is needed...

However, in the case of the Hitler war it is flawed. I'd like to quote from a book I have written by a Polish Jew, but I can't find the book.

#304 JtP2

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 23:08

Having just received a large collection of MotorSports, curtesy of Brakedisc, the answer is an overwhelming yes. Very pre Bernie political correctness. Reading some of the comments, did Colin Chapman ever have a go at DSJ or did he just point Elio De Angelis at him?

 

Did DSJ not work at Farnborough during the war?



#305 D-Type

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 23:56

~

Did DSJ not work at Farnborough during the war?

Yes he did, at the Royal Aircraft Establishment. But I don't know what he did there.

#306 JtP2

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 00:38

DSJ I am sure wrote a fascinating article on the first Gloster Whittle flight.



#307 Allan Lupton

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 10:40

DSJ I am sure wrote a fascinating article on the first Gloster Whittle flight.

Well he may have done so, but as it took place from Cranwell, I doubt DSJ was a witness. The second prototype E.28/39 (W4046) did eventually fly from (and was destroyed from) Farnborough.



#308 JtP2

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 11:54

I wondered about the first Gloster Whittle flight being at Cranwell.  But if DSJ was part of the servicing crew, he would have gone there with the aircraft.



#309 Allan Lupton

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 12:51

I wondered about the first Gloster Whittle flight being at Cranwell.  But if DSJ was part of the servicing crew, he would have gone there with the aircraft.

I've no recollection that DSJ was ever involved with aircraft servicing, but at that stage all the support people would have been Gloster employees.



#310 D-Type

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 13:01

Speculating.
Working at the BAE it is possible that DSJ knew of the new aircraft with an experimental engine.  But as it was a new design it may well have been shrouded on secrecy.
Being the person he was, DSJ would have tried to get to see the maiden flight.  But would he have known the date?  As far as I understand they carried out taxiing tests until the test pilot felt confident to make some trial hops and then he would decide to 'go for it'.  How preplanned would it be?
In wartime would DSJ, who after all was only a very insignificant cog in the war machine, have been allowed to take time off and make the journey from Farnborough to Cranwell?

 

It's nice to think that our man was there but I sincerely doubt it.



#311 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 13:36

Seeing a jet fly in those days would be the equivalent of seeing a British F1 car having its first test...

It wouldn't surprise me to learn he was there.

#312 Doug Nye

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 14:00

Jenks missed out, as far as I know, on any contact with the Gloster-Whittle's first flight. He worked on the experimental Flight - 'C-Flight' I think without checking - at Farnborough, largely as an observer and very junior note and record keeper-cum-budding engineer irk, a technical assistant. He worked hard at finding time in the RAE library, poring through every motoring magazine he could find there, in between reading the latest technical publications emerging from the aeronautical industry, the RAF and the Air Ministry. In spare times he also expended a fair amount of effort fettling various motor-cycles and larking about with Bill Boddy - who was in the Technical Publications section at Farnborough - in all manner of creaky and cranky old cars, often using petrol begged, borrowed or stolen from their mutual friend Holly Birkett.  Holly was the vet in nearby Fleet, and as such he was permitted a special petrol allowance. This permitted him and his pals to manage far more motoring than the ordinary private citizen could achieve on their coupons.

 

Jenks did recall 'Gerry' Sayer - the Gloster-Whittle E28/39's first-flight pilot - taxying the first Bell Airacobra that DSJ had ever seen clean into the C-Flight hangar (totally against the rules, even then). The noise was ear-splitting and dust and paperwork, anything light, was blowing around inside the hangar as if in a whirlwind. When Sayer switched off and the din died down, he unlatched the door, which on the Airacobra was just like a car door, stepped onto the wing, slammed the door shut behind him and then slid down onto the hangar floor - grinning from ear to ear. Young DSJ was deeply impressed. If you've got it, flaunt it... Gerry Sayer lost his life soon after, test-flying a Hawker Typhoon.

 

DCN



#313 fuzzi

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Posted 06 February 2015 - 17:33

While he may have missed the first flight of the Gloster-Whittle, I can't resist recalling this piece from "The Racing Driver" in the chapter "Tenths"

 

"..I can still recall watching a very brave man displaying the bravado of the Grand Prix driver who is at nine-and-a-half tenths. This was a young RAF flight-lieutenant who, on a cloudless summer's evening some years ago, flew the prototype jet-plane and tried the first aerobatics with this form of propulsion. It was not known then whether a gas-turbine could be flown upside down, or at high G-forces, or whether it could be restarted at altitude if once stopped. It was long, lanky, quiet Mac who volunteered to find out, for only by trying, up in the air, could the theories be proved. I was fortunate enough to be on duty that evening and was able to watch these trials with the small group of people on the ground. The tension in that group as the little yellow and green Whittle-Jet went quiet at a height of some eight to ten thousand feet, and the ghastly suspense of waiting for the whine of the turbine to restart, was horrible yet fascinating. If it did not restart then Mac was going to have to jump, and the experimental work that had gone into the plane was going to be smashed to pieces. There was the horrible knowledge that something could go wrong and the whole plane become a burning inferno up in the air. Our relief when the high-pitched whine restarted was nothing compared to Mac's feelings and after that it was a comparitively simple matter to try a gentle roll. After a few minutes it was obvious that nothing untoward was going to happen to the gas-turbine when aerobatics were used, and for quite a while we were entertained by some really superb flying as Mac tried every flying trick he knew, throwing the little aircraft about at every bit of nine-tenths and as he got more confidence in its handling, getting closer and closer to ten-tenthsand obviously enjoying every maunoeuvre. That was 'Dicing with Death' in a big way."  

 

No wonder my copy of "The Racing Driver" is falling apart. :yawnface:



#314 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 February 2015 - 12:27

A superb addition to the discussion, Julian...

Thanks for that.

#315 Doug Nye

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 16:50

Absolutely agreed - so long since I read that, forgotten it completely.   :up:

 

DCN



#316 bradbury west

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 16:57

Bump.

As tomorrow is May 1, I am sure many of us will give a thought to the contribution of our little hero in a certain fast tour of much of Italy 60 years ago. They don't make 'em like that any more, nor do it like that.

I am about to enjoy re reading a masterful piece of motoring journalism.

Roger Lund

 

edit

I still cannot post pictures here, or copy bits from earlier posts, and for some reason my pictures, bar one, have disappeared even though I never used Imageshack...

Anyway, there is still my shot of my last sighting of DSJ at the FoS in 96 at post 175, and the relevant story with it,  and Alan Cox has a glorious photo at 195 showing DSJ and SCM in 199 in car 722 at the  FoS. You could not wish for a finer reminder of that day than to see a shot of the 2 guys who did the deed on May 1 1955 enjoying their company 40 years on, as older men, who lived to tell the tale, and then some.

RL


Edited by bradbury west, 30 April 2015 - 17:17.


#317 D-Type

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Posted 30 April 2015 - 22:24

I still like the posting I saw on another forum:

"The 1955 Mille Miglia was won by Denis S Jenkinson in a chauffeur-driven Mercedes-Benz"



#318 Doug Nye

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 10:34

I passed the above on to the chauffeur and his Lady missis, who roared with laughter.  This just arrived on e-mail:

 

THAT IS VERY FUNNY!!!

CIAO, STIRLING

 

The thing is, with him you know he means it.

 

DCN



#319 Allan Lupton

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 16:29

I passed the above on to the chauffeur and his Lady missis, who roared with laughter.  This just arrived on e-mail:

 

THAT IS VERY FUNNY!!!

CIAO, STIRLING

 

The thing is, with him you know he means it.

 

DCN

Surely SCM had heard that one before!

Even on here, Duncan posted it nearly nine years ago (Oct. '06)



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#320 Doug Nye

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 19:31

Oh do give us - and Stirling's memory - a break...or is simple good-natured empathy another thing of the past?



#321 Allan Lupton

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Posted 01 May 2015 - 22:15

Sorry, no offence intended.



#322 Gary Davies

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 04:47

Doug, after things had started to die down in Brescia, I understand Stirling drove his Mercedes saloon over the rocks to Stuttgart where he'd heard there was some enthusiastic Fr√∂hlichkeit going on. I wonder if you can recall what DSJ did after the finish? He was only 34 and fit, but I can imagine he was feeling somewhat physically battered, having had nothing to hold onto for 10 hours.

 

He didn't mention what he did in the June 1955 report, nor in Continental Notes and there's no reference in A passion for motor sport.

 



#323 AAGR

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 10:02

After a sleep, maybe he sat down and started writing the famous report ? Writing ? yes - ASFAIK he didn't/couldn't type.



#324 Ray Bell

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 10:52

He disclosed that in one of the Motor Sport reprints...

In the report itself he tells how he "lay in a hot bath" that night.



.

Edited by Ray Bell, 02 May 2015 - 10:53.


#325 Gary Davies

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 11:16

Ray, I have the 20 page reprint of the 1955, 1956 and 1957 events before me as I sit here. I bought it when it was first published. It is signed by Stirling Moss, the only autograph I have ever sought. I shall re-read it but I'm certain the words therein, apart from DSJ's foreword written at Crondall in 1968, are precisely those that appeared in the contemporary editions of Motor Sport. 

 

I'm sure you've seen the hot bath reference but not in my reprint.


Edited by Gary Davies, 02 May 2015 - 13:24.


#326 Roger Clark

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 12:34

I have read somewhere, I can't remember where, that he drove to Naples for the Grand Prix the following week and wrote the whole thing in longhand using a pencil.  He was in a hotel overlooking the bay.  When he had finished he put the manuscript in an envelope and posted to Motor Sport.  Imagine what we would have missed if that package had been lost in the post!



#327 Slurp1955

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 15:11

I have read somewhere, I can't remember where, that he drove to Naples for the Grand Prix the following week and wrote the whole thing in longhand using a pencil.  He was in a hotel overlooking the bay.  When he had finished he put the manuscript in an envelope and posted to Motor Sport.  Imagine what we would have missed if that package had been lost in the post!


...... and putting it into the Italian Postal System too, tantamount to throwing it away !

#328 kayemod

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 15:27

...... and putting it into the Italian Postal System too, tantamount to throwing it away !

 

Maybe the Italian postal system was more reliable back then, and I think ours must have been too, wasn't most of the Boddy copy posted in a mailbox nailed to a telegraph pole somewhere close to the end of his drive in Wales? What always impressed me though was the apparent reliability of the UK rail system in those days, or even earlier in the 20s & 30s. As I child, I read all the Sherlock Holmes stories, and was always impressed by dialogue like "We'll catch the 11.38 from Little Snoring Watson, we'll be in Paddington at 4.32". These days they'd be disembarking for a bus connection between stations at least once in their journey due to "Engineering work", and that's after they'd encountered the dreaded "Leaves on the line".



#329 Slurp1955

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 16:04

Maybe the Italian postal system was more reliable back then, and I think ours must have been too...


I know from my own experience selling stuff online that the Italian "Traced and Signed For" parcel service translates as "Thrown On A Nearby Doorstep", JohnP

#330 Ray Bell

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 17:54

Gary, I'm pretty sure it's in the reprint which came free in a Motor Sport around the early nineties...

It covered just the '55 race. I just don't know where to put my hands on my copy now.

#331 Doug Nye

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 19:18

Maybe take a look at next month's 'Motor Sport'...?

 

DCN



#332 Tuboscocca

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 19:33

Ray, I have the 20 page reprint of the 1955, 1956 and 1957 events before me as I sit here. I bought it when it was first published. It is signed by Stirling Moss, the only autograph I have ever sought. I shall re-read it but I'm certain the words therein, apart from DSJ's foreword written at Crondall in 1968, are precisely those that appeared in the contemporary editions of Motor Sport. 

 

I'm sure you've seen the hot bath reference but not in my reprint.

Gary --put it back in your safe: :cat:

 

http://www.amazon.co...kinson +reprint

 

I'm not tempted to buy it...

 

MIchael



#333 kayemod

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 19:34



Maybe take a look at next month's 'Motor Sport'...?

 

DCN

 

For anyone too impatient to wait that long...

 

92c02861-b288-4aef-9a30-935ba9e391fd.jpg



#334 Ray Bell

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Posted 02 May 2015 - 19:56

Thanks, Rob...

That's the one I recall.

#335 Gary Davies

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 00:18

Gary --put it back in your safe: :cat:

 

http://www.amazon.co...kinson +reprint

 

I'm not tempted to buy it...

 

MIchael

Crikey!!!  :drunk:



#336 Mal9444

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 06:11

I still like the posting I saw on another forum:

"The 1955 Mille Miglia was won by Denis S Jenkinson in a chauffeur-driven Mercedes-Benz"

Don't forget the other one, alegedly from Italy;

"[The 1955 Mille Miglia] was won by Sterleeng Moss who was accompanied by a small priest with a long black beard who read to him from the Bible all the way..." 

 

... or words to that effect, presumably in Italian.


Edited by Mal9444, 03 May 2015 - 06:11.


#337 Doug Nye

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Posted 03 May 2015 - 15:53

DSJ actually wrote a lot on the Tuesday after the Sunday Mille Miglia, and that was also the day on which the Mercedes-Benz team left town. Left to his own devices he wrote more on the Wednesday, left Brescia on the Thursday - covered the Naples GP that following weekend - then moved from the Albergo Turistico (yes really) to an un-named other than "seafront" hotel where he wrote "fitfully' from Monday, May 9, to Wednesday, May 11. On Thursday May 12 he left Naples to drive to Bari - commenting on "much MM publicity". He met racing friends including MM organisers Renzo Castagneto and Siciliani, and Dan Margulies - then building his career as a racer/great-car wheeler-dealer - Masten Gregory and Jacques Swaters.  For Sunday May 15 his diary entry reads: "All day in Bari. Races late in evening on floodlit circuit".

 

Was the Singapore GP something new then?  Nah - not really...    ;)

 

DCN



#338 bradbury west

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 00:55

Another year goes by. It is 19 years since we lost Jenks. Please see the sentiments in post 254.

Roger Lund



#339 bradbury west

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 08:58

Another year passes. It is now 20 years since our bearded hero left us. He was always such a telling influence in my formative years.

Roger Lund



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#340 kayemod

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 09:43

Another year passes. It is now 20 years since our bearded hero left us. He was always such a telling influence in my formative years.

Roger Lund

 

Me too, I don't want to move this respectful thread too much off course, but what do we think Jenks' thoughts would have been on the current Lewis debate? He admired Ayrton so much that I don't remember him being too critical of his occasional misbehaviour, but something tells me that he'd have regarded Hamilton's actions and attitude much less favourably. DSJ was a big Keke fan, and although the style of the two Rosbergs is very different, I think he'd have approved of Nico.



#341 Ray Bell

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 10:18

I wouldn't like to predict what Jenks would have thought...

First, with this race he would have given lots of credit to Verstappen. After that he would have addressed the issues which have taken the attention of almost everyone else.

His appraisal would no doubt have been measured and backed up with sound reasoning... of some kind.

But I also feel he would have become more jaded with driver behavior over the past twenty-two years.

#342 Gary Davies

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 13:33

I first started buying Motor Sport, and therefore reading DSJ, in 1962. I recall trying to sneak looks at Motor Sport beneath the lid of my school desk while one master or another was droning on about algebra, amo amas amat, the English Kings or whatever. I rapidly arrived at the firm conclusion that there could be no better life than nipping around Europe in a Porsche 356 or a Jaguar E-Type, visiting wonderful racing tracks and being paid for it. 



#343 Roger Clark

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 15:09

I wouldn't like to predict what Jenks would have thought...

First, with this race he would have given lots of credit to Verstappen. After that he would have addressed the issues which have taken the attention of almost everyone else.

His appraisal would no doubt have been measured and backed up with sound reasoning... of some kind.

But I also feel he would have become more jaded with driver behavior over the past twenty-two years.

I think he would have waited to see which way the river was flowing and then swum against it.  Impeccable logic whichever view he took.



#344 bradbury west

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Posted 29 November 2017 - 00:50

Another year passes.  We have his writings and records as a legacy.

Roger Lund



#345 David Birchall

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Posted 29 November 2017 - 00:53

Did DSJ ever write about Tommy Byrne?  I just finished Tommy's autobiography last night and found myself wondering that...



#346 SamoanAttorney

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 13:13

Did DSJ ever write about Tommy Byrne?  I just finished Tommy's autobiography last night and found myself wondering that...

A bit of late night fiction is always good for sleep.

 

From the German Grand Prix 

 

"Jan Lammers had been moved out of the Theodore Team and Tommy Byrne had been brought out of the Formula 3 school to replace him though the reason was a bit obscure............"

 

DSJ had this to say from The Austrian Grand Prix.

 

"Tommy Byrne just scraped onto the grid with the original Theodore TY02, but hardly justified his replacement of Jan Lammers."

 

"By lap 11 Patrese had already caught and lapped Tommy Byrne, which gives some idea of the discrepancy between the fastest and the slowest............"

 

TB barely warranted a mention at either the Swiss or Italian Grand Prix but at Las Vegas DSJ gave an insight to his thoughts on the Irishman.

 
"First reserve was the little Irishman Tommy Byrne in the Theodore, so by Jarier's bad luck he was lucky to start in the race. When Byrne arrived on the Formula One scene at mid-season he was rather confident, not to say cocky, and was quoted as saying that famous names did not interest him, as long as they did not get in his way! When he did actually qualify for a race the only time he saw some of them was when they lapped him and at Las Vegas he spun off while trying to keep out of the way of some of the famous names that were lapping him!"
 
No further comment needed from DSJ..
 
I was at a dinner last week sitting with a veteran Autosport journalist, we had witnessed Byrne in F3 during 1982. We both agreed that despite his claims he would not have coped with Martin Brundle let alone Ayrton...........but what would we know?

Edited by SamoanAttorney, 03 December 2017 - 18:05.


#347 Doug Nye

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Posted 03 December 2017 - 16:47

This made me smile.  What indeed...  There are so many examples of "definitely the next superstar" being cut down to size when making that step up.  Of course, the trick is to step up in a competitive car. 

 

And getting one's backside into such a car in the first place is presently even more difficult than ever.

 

Where some people have been concerned "too much mouth" certainly did them no favours...

 

DCN 



#348 LittleBertha

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 10:13

My grey cells seem to recall that it was Jenks idea to first use alpha rather than numeric for motorcycle competition identification - have I got that right?

 

 

Certainly the VSCC used that system for the motorcycles when they ran at Colerne and I thought that was in a nod to the great man 



#349 SamoanAttorney

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 13:02

Motoring talent is also to be found in the next generation of DSJ's family.

 

Peter Stevens is his nephew.

 

A while back I was fortunate enough to ride with Peter on one of the Salon Privé Tours.

 

We called into Brooklands during the day's program and paid our respects to the area that was dedicated to the great writer.

 

Apologies for the poor quality image

 

2013SalonPriveTour_jb_0307.jpg



#350 bradbury west

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Posted 29 November 2018 - 10:37

Another year on.
I wonder what he would have made of modern F1 antics, or the state of modern histeric racing? And I still reckon his writings would be a salutary lesson in our sport for modern readers and experts who claim to be enthusiasts.
Yes, I know I am an anachronism and life moves on, but.......
Roger Lund