46 replies to this topic

[David Shaw]

I have been pondering for a while now as to why Jane at the Gold Star back in the 60s. He was driving almost everything from Series Production and Improved Production to 1.5 open wheelers and big banger sports cars.
When Harvey had his unfortunate accident in practice for the Bathurst 100 at Easter 1968, I would have expected that Jane would have taken over the repaired BT23E himself in the Gold Star. He firstly used Palmer, then Cook and Moffat but didn't drive the car himself apart from a couple of minor mixed races at Calder and let the car sit idle rather than run it himself.

[Leo D]

Hadn't Bob already had a big accident himself in an open wheeler by this stage in which he was pretty knocked about?.... Sandown?... Elfin?...
Maybe he just didn't want to get back into one?

[Ray Bell]

Yes, Jane had a trip to hospital after backing the Elfin into a tree at Dandenong Road...

And he must have been so frustrated by the lack of impact his car was having after it was rebuilt. The only success it had that year was to set the outright lap record at Calder.

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
And he must have been so frustrated by the lack of impact his car was having after it was rebuilt. The only success it had that year was to set the outright lap record at Calder.

Ray,
Was that the meeting where Bevan Gibson drove the Climax powered Brabham of Janes?.... I can't remember who was the pilot of the Repco?... Ian Cook?

[Ray Bell]

You're right there... I'd totally forgotten that...

And I'd obviously forgotten that it wasn't the outright record that Jane set, just the openwheeler record. Matich was quicker in the same race in his SR3. Jane, meanwhile, was half a second better than Geoghegan.

[Leo D]

I think some pics are required for this Ray..... just give me a few minutes to get them up..

[Ray Bell]

Gladly... especially of Jane in the Brabham!

What a rare sight...

[Leo D]

Bevan Gibson



Ian Cook?

[David Shaw]

Well #4 is definitely the BT23E, and #3 is the BT11A. Does this mean that after the '68 Tasman Series the BT11A was re-fitted with the FPF?

[Ray Bell]

I don't know, but it does look like Peter Macrow standing over in the corner near the convertible...

Odd that both these drivers should finish up dying on the track. And is someone going to snare that picture of the Bob Jane truck for the 'Transporters' thread?

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
I don't know, but it does look like Peter Macrow standing over in the corner near the convertible...

Odd that both these drivers should finish up dying on the track. And is someone going to snare that picture of the Bob Jane truck for the 'Transporters' thread?

Peter Macrow, wasn't he driving the Argo at that stage?...... nothing to do with the Jane Group?

[David Shaw]

I have seen a photo of the BT11A during the '68 Tasman Series, and the exhausts appear to be an unusual colour, neither black nor white that the factory BT24s wore, nor the chrome of Geoghegan's car. Could it be that Jane had them painted red to suit the car?

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Leo D
Peter Macrow, wasn't he driving the Argo at that stage?...... nothing to do with the Jane Group?

Yeah, quite likely...

But there was no embargo on who he could talk to!

[Andrew Fellowes]

Leo D forgive me but maybe this is easier to see with exposure changed. Perhaps Twinny or someone else here (like everyone) could do a better job than me,

[cosworth bdg]

Andrew, that image is much better , but still needs a little bit more sharpening up. Regards ,PN.

[cosworth bdg]

Originally posted by Andrew Fellowes
Leo D forgive me but maybe this is easier to see with exposure changed. Perhaps Twinny or someone else here (like everyone) could do a better job than me,

Andrew, i would if i new how to.

[cosworth bdg]

Is not the ex Ian Cook [ one time Bob Jane driver] BT 36 /WAGGOT being restored by a Sydney based competitor ?

[Andrew Fellowes]

No, its the BT23E-1 1968 Jack Brabham Tasman car, to Bob Jane, Curran, Madrers, Delaney and then Art Valdez.

[Haydn]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Ray Bell
I don't know, but it does look like Peter Macrow standing over in the corner near the convertible...

Odd that both these drivers should finish up dying on the track. And is someone going to snare that picture of the Bob Jane truck for the 'Transporters' thread?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Ray,

That looks like Ian Cook to me - not Peter Macrow. Both were involved in driving the Argo - Chev. at some time.

I have seen a photo of Peter (and girlfriend) standing next to the Argo IIRC on the Old Race Photos web site with again from memory a note indicating the subject as Ian Cook. This may have misled you.

I raced against both of them many times during the mid 60's and although a lot of water has passed under the bridge since then I haven't forgotten what they looked like. I bumped into Peter a few years ago and he hasn't changed that much except like most of us who are now "seniors" the odd wrinkles have appeared together with an extra kilo or two.

Cheers,

HaydnM

[cosworth bdg]

Andrew, there is a BT 36/WAGGOT being restored in sydney and it was driven by the Late Ian Cook ,i think for Bob Jane. Ian Cook was killed in this car at Sandown Park at the end of the main straight.......................

[Leo D]

Originally posted by David Shaw
I have seen a photo of the BT11A during the '68 Tasman Series, and the exhausts appear to be an unusual colour, neither black nor white that the factory BT24s wore, nor the chrome of Geoghegan's car. Could it be that Jane had them painted red to suit the car?

The exhausts in the posted shot are chrome...... The same finish that was on the exhaust system on the M6 McLaren.
The only way that I know to get that particular area any clearer picture wise, would be for me to re-scan the original 35mm Slide... and then the area in question is only about a 1-2mm square.

[Vicuna]

As a touring car driver , where do our Aussie friends rank Jane from the era he raced in - compared with:

Beechy
Moffatt
Geoghegan

[Frank de Jong]

As a coincidence, I was researching the BTCC 1962 GP support race at Aintree last night - where Bob Jane was on pole position with a Jag Mk2. He retired in the race.

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Vicuna
As a touring car driver , where do our Aussie friends rank Jane from the era he raced in - compared with:

Beechy
Moffatt
Geoghegan

As we're only talking about these 4, my vote goes as follows....

1. Pete Geoghegan.... 5 times National Champion. Could and did drive/win in other classes.....
2. Bob Jane.... 3 times National Champion. Could and did drive/win in other classes...
3. Norm Beechey.... 2 times National champion. Only raced Touring Cars........
4 Allan Moffatt.... 4 times National Champion.... wore glasses

I'm ducking for cover now.....

[Vicuna]

Interesting Leo - as a Kiwi who only saw these guys race here occassionally I am surprised Moffatt comes in at 4.

Big Norm was always my sentimental favourite while Moffatt was largely despised by local crowds.

I can't say the same for Pauline though...

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
I don't know, but it does look like Peter Macrow standing over in the corner near the convertible...

Ray, For the life of me, I can't recall why the 2.5 cars were at Calder for that meeting..... 2.5 ltr cars "usually" didn't run at Calder.... it wasn't a Gold Star Round..... I've got the feeling it was to promote something, but I can't recall what....

I'm voting for that being Ian Cook btw....

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Vicuna
Interesting Leo - as a Kiwi who only saw these guys race here occassionally I am surprised Moffatt comes in at 4.

Big Norm was always my sentimental favourite while Moffatt was largely despised by local crowds.

I can't say the same for Pauline though...

I picked Norm over Moffatt mostly because racing wasn't Norm's "Day Job" .... it was Moffatts "Day Job" .... Moffatt had the better "Mouse Trap" at the time 69,70,71 yet didn't run away and hide from Beechey results wise I mean.....

As to Bob Jane, I picked him over Norm, only because he ran and won in more than one class of racing..... yeah, I know i put him down as 3 ATCC wins... I was thinking 1 Jag... 2 Camaro.... but it was 4 wasn't it... 2 Jag... 2 Camaro... can I help it if I can't count?

As for Pete Geoghegan, well.... there is no question... he was the best of the 4....

BTW.... a bit of trivia.... both Bob Jane and Norm Beechey had Chrysler dealerships in the mid 60's but neither of them raced Chyrsler products ..... ATCC wise that is....

I'm ducking for cover again

[David Shaw]

Originally posted by Leo D
The exhausts in the posted shot are chrome...... The same finish that was on the exhaust system on the M6 McLaren.

Yes, these exhausts are chrome, but this is the BT23E not the BT11A. My scanner is not up and running ATM, but on page 53 of Australian Motor Manual May 1968, it shows Harvey hunched over the back of the BT11A at Warwick Farm, and it appears that both the exhausts and the wheels are red. I haven't seen any other photos of the car with the V8 in it, let alone a colour photo.

[Ray Bell]

Yeah, that looks more like Ian Cook blown up...

I had reservations about the height when I first posted that. I think Ian Cook was taller than Peter Macrow... I never really knew Ian Cook more than to see him in the pits, whereas I frequently talked to Peter Macrow during and after race meetings.

Did Janey have a Chrysler dealership? I know he had Holden (Southern Motors), but I don't recall Chrysler at all. And I mostly agree with those rankings, too, though it's hard to say that Moffat should definitely be lower than Beechey. I do feel, though, that you put a strong case for your reasoning.

As for the 2.5s being at Calder... wasn't it a special event for Repco?

[David Shaw]

Originally posted by Vicuna
As a touring car driver , where do our Aussie friends rank Jane from the era he raced in - compared with:

Beechy
Moffatt
Geoghegan

If I ignore what each of them have done in other categories, I would rate them:

Geoghegan - the best touring car driver Australia has seen.
Moffat - Moffat didn't get the ATCC with the Mustang he sorely wanted, but he was probably the least naturally talented of these 4 but got 4 ATCCs from sheer determination and hard work. Many don't realise what he has done overseas, winning the 3rd TransAm race outright in a Lotus Cortina, winning the first race in the ill-fated WTCC with John Harvey in 1987 and sharing a Sierra with Klaus Ludwig to win the Fuji 500 in his last race.
Jane - Jane 2 sets of 2 ATCCs nearly a decade apart and had a great device with the LS1 Camaro which he used to great effect, even when he had to run it with the 350.
Beechey - 2 ATCCs by again having the right weapon at the right time. Didn't always make the right decision (ie. the soft tyres on the Nova in the '67 ATCC) and often played the showman.

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Ray Bell

Did Janey have a Chrysler dealership? I know he had Holden (Southern Motors), but I don't recall Chrysler at all.

Ray,
Both Norm and Bob had their Chrysler dealerships in Sydney Road....
Norm had his Chryler dealership in Coburg.....
Bob had his Chrysler dealership in Brunswick.... a couple of miles further south of Norms'...
A couple of guys that worked for my dad brought new Valiants there in 1966.... I think if you look at the pics I posted, you'll note a couple of Dodges...one red...one blue....

Norm's Speed shop was located approximately half way between the two, again in Sydney Road....

What was Bob's first car yard, again in Sydney Road, still does something automotive on the site....this was a little further south of his New Car Dealership... "Bob Jane Autoland" I think it was called when Bob had it.... I'm pretty sure that's where he also started out making seat covers.

What was Norms dealership is now an office block.......

[Ray Bell]

Wasn't the prime mover for Jane's transporter also a Dodge?

[Leo D]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Wasn't the prime mover for Jane's transporter also a Dodge?

..... a Red one, hidden behind the yellow sign in those pics... latter painted orange.....

[Catalina Park]

Jane had a Dodge truck with a trailer in about 65 (I have a photo of it somewhere) a little while later on he had a semi trailer but I think it had a Ford prime-mover.

[Ray Bell]

I would have said that too...

But look at this comparison:

[repcobrabham]

forensics!

[Catalina Park]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
I would have said that too...

I was wrong in my post above. The Ford prime-mover came before the Dodge. (as you can see in the transporter thread)

[Andrew Fellowes]

Originally posted by Frank de Jong
As a coincidence, I was researching the BTCC 1962 GP support race at Aintree last night - where Bob Jane was on pole position with a Jag Mk2. He retired in the race.

Didn't he get told that 'We don't drive like that over here'

[Ray Bell]

Probably also "We don't set our cars up like that here!" ... the story goes that they reset the rear springs (in somewhat of a hurry...) using an oxy torch!

[jcurran]

G'day Andrew,

From what you have said, Bt23e is back in Asustralia, can you confirm this?

I have a small interest in this one (once owned and raced by my old man).

James Curran.

[Frank de Jong]

Originally posted by Andrew Fellowes

Didn't he get told that 'We don't drive like that over here'

It was Australian Bob Jane in John Coombs' 3,8 Jaguar who took the lead, pursued by Mike Parkes and Jack Sears in the Equipe Endeavour cars.
Jane, weaving this way and that way, was determined to keep in front.
(...)
Jane's driving was somewhat spectacular to say the least. On the fifth lap he spun round at Cottage Corner, and was nearly hit by both following cars. During the avoidance, Jack Sears took the lead, chased by team-mate Parkes. Farther back came Sir Gawaine Baillie, ahead of Peter Dodd. Undaunted by his tete-a-queue, Jane once more set off to challenge Sears and Parkes, but had plenty of leeway to make up.
(...)
Bob Jane retired three laps from the end with serious overheating.

(Autosport july 1962)

[David Shaw]

This is the photo of the BT11A with the Repco installed, and it appears to have red rims to match the Shell livery, and possibly red exhausts as well.



and another photo of the BT11A/Repco I have found, although this doesn't show much.

[David Shaw]

And I have finally found a colour pic at Autopics:



but it doesn't show the crucial bits, though they don't appear to be coloured.

[Ray Bell]

Good shot too... plenty of power on, entering Pit Straight if I'm not mistaken...

[bradbury west]

What was the story with Bob Jane and the Maserati 300S coupe/hardtop? It looks superb.
See below from the brilliant Autopics website

http://www.autopics....c.html?cache=no

Roger Lund

PS, give yourself time to scroll through all the years as a treat.

[David McKinney]

Growing dissatisfaction with the widening gap between Australian saloons and their original concept led to a restructuring of national rules for 1960, with touring car events restricted to more or less standard production saloons running under Appendix J, and the wilder machinery running in the new Appendix K category. This group also admitted smaller-run production coupés, which were interpreted to include sports-racers with tops tacked on. Many ageing cars were thus given a new lease of life, including Frank Matich's D-type and, IIRC, Lex Davison's HWM-Jaguar

[bradbury west]

David, many thanks

RL