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Push-rod suspension


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#1 Monstrobolaxa

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Posted 25 April 2007 - 20:12

Does anyone know any good books on Push-rod suspensions? or double A-arm suspensions?

The thing is that I'm working for a sportscar team and I'm in charge of designing and developing the car for 2010 (which will reach the tracks in 2009, for testing). Up to know I've been working on chassis stiffness and in a few months will be looking into the suspension layout. I already have quite a few books on chassis design, car aerodynamics, vehicle dynamics...but I feel that I don't have enough info to correctly design the suspension.

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#2 Greg Locock

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Posted 25 April 2007 - 22:28

Here is a lazy list, from eng-tips. I suspect that Carroll Smith is as good as any for race cars, but if I only had one I'd have Milliken RCVD (I haven't got just one, I've got access to all except the last two)


I've arbitrarily split them up into heavy textbooks/references, and cheaper books. Note that none of the textbooks describe the actual nuts and bolts of sizing the arms and so on.

Textbooks/references

The Automotive Chassis Engineering Principles
J. Reimpell H. Stoll J. W. Betzler.
ISBN 978-0-7680-0657-5
Description: Vehicle dynamics and chassis design from a production car perspective. Very useful, if you are designing a production car.

Race Car Vehicle Dynamics
Milliken and Milliken.
Description: Vehicle dynamics and chassis design from a race car perspective. Probably the most useful generally of the big books, it is a good read as well. A fair amount of aero.

Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics
Thomas Gillespie.
Description: Mathematically oriented derivation of standard vehicle dynamics equations, and definitions of standard terms. A bit dry.

Chassis Design - Principles and Analysis
William F. Milliken and Doug Milliken.
Description: Vehicle dynamics as developed by Maurice Olley from the 1930s onwards. First comprehensive analytical synthesis of vehicle dynamics. Great historical stuff, and some nice explanations. Not as generally useful as RCVD.

Tires Suspension and Handling
John Dixon
Slightly more analytical than RCVD, covers much the same ground, but no aero.

Car Suspension and Handling
Donald Bastow
I only read a good discussion of steering effects due to camber gain, but it seemed useful and analytical.

Cheaper books

Carroll Smith - Tune to win etc. Generally a good introduction, but his explanation of roll axis in one book is confusing at best. I also disagree with him about single sided mounting for Heim's, but agree it is nicer to do it his way. Good on practical details, and fundamentals. Probably good enough for FSAE, for example.

Fred Puhn - billyshope says this is a useful reference especially for oval racers

Herb Adams - Never seen it

#3 gary76

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 12:23

Not wishing to be demeaning but my advice would be to sit down and apply some basic mechanics to some drawings, do a few basic load calculations and try and understand what you are trying to achieve. With some time you will understand the mechanism, its shortfalls as well of any advantage it may offer you. There is no 'magic' in it.
Put in a nutshell, use some of the education you have been blessed with in getting to the position you are in to use!!!

#4 gbaker

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 12:58

Greg strikes again.

#5 McGuire

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 14:32

Originally posted by Greg Locock

Fred Puhn - billyshope says this is a useful reference especially for oval racers


You know/know of Bill Shope??? It's a small, small world. Hell of a guy, one of the original Ramchargers back in 1958. Ever take a look at his traction dyno deal?

#6 LS 1

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 14:50

I just finished Smith's "Tune to Win" and don't think it would be very helpful from a design point of view. He has another book, "Engineer to Win" which I have not seen but which might be more useful.

#7 Ben

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 19:22

Originally posted by McGuire


You know/know of Bill Shope??? It's a small, small world. Hell of a guy, one of the original Ramchargers back in 1958. Ever take a look at his traction dyno deal?


engtips.com...

Ben

#8 bettonracing

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 23:23

Originally posted by LS 1
I just finished Smith's "Tune to Win" and don't think it would be very helpful from a design point of view. He has another book, "Engineer to Win" which I have not seen but which might be more useful.


Engineer to win felt a bit too much like Materials Science 1100all over again. It graduates into the practicality of material choices (2024 T3 Al for rotor hats & Al monocoque chassis, 300M for axles, etc) and eventually follows up on some concepts brought up in Tune to Win.


To the OP

You'll also find alot of information by searching here (atlas F1 Technical), Eng-tips.com & FSAE.com forums. There are few questions that haven't been answered between all 3 so be sure to search extensively before asking. Also remember the archives. You'll notice a few familiar names in your searching. 'Net stalking' these ppl's [posts] will yield more useful threads as well.

Regards,

H. Kurt Betton

#9 rhm

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Posted 27 April 2007 - 23:38

If you're a beginner then Competition Car Suspension by Allan Stainforth would be a good start.

#10 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 April 2007 - 09:50

Id heard (I think on this forum) that his book was iffy.

#11 Ben

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Posted 28 April 2007 - 10:08

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
Id heard (I think on this forum) that his book was iffy.


That was probably me, and I still think it is.

Ben

#12 McGuire

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Posted 28 April 2007 - 10:48

Originally posted by Ben


engtips.com...

Ben


Oh, the Interwebs.

#13 Monstrobolaxa

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Posted 29 April 2007 - 01:52

Thanks guys....