7 replies to this topic

[Pingguest]

As costs increaded in the Group C, the C2-class was created for privateer teams and small manufacturers. As far as I know the C2 had more limits to the fuel consumption. Teams used engines like the Cosworth DFL or BMW M1.

But, apart from the fuel consumption, where there any more differences in the rules between the C1 and C2?

[fausto]

Group C2 started in 1983, one year after Group C (C1) was introduced, other significant difference was minimum weight (700 and then 750 kilos), no other major differences, apart, maybe, the fuel tank capacity, 55 litres, soon increased to 100, as for C1 cars...

[Pingguest]

I see, but the Group C1 had no minimum weignt (initially), right?

[petefenelon]

Did the C2 chassis regs move on in step with the C1 ones (pedals behind the front axle line...? (Or was that change at a sufficiently early point in C2 that it didn't affect anything other than the Alba and the Harrier?)

[Graham Gauld]

I recall when Hugh McCaig and I ran our Group C2 Ecosse-Cosworth ( Actually a much modified De Cadenet that had run at Le Mans a few years before.) in 1984 with Ray Mallock and his team we were new to the game. Hugh told me he was going to take a case of whisky for the team so I suggested he take two cases. As a result when we found our place in the dirt paddock we quickly found the marshal team nearest our pit and by studying the changes in personel during practice we decided to pounce. As we all had dark blue sweaters with the Ecosse badge we persuaded each marshal that any of our team with a sweater should be allowed down to the pit and would they like to have a bottle of whisky ? As a result we probably had more people in our pit than Porsche !
However, we had other troubles related to the regulations. The FIA official who kept an eye on the regulations was Alain Bertaut and at scrutineering in the park the scrutineers told us the cockpit dimensions on our car were incorrect. They agreed that the cubic area was correct but the dimensions were wrong and, no, we could not start. We got Alain Bertaut along and he pondered for a while. We remarked that in Formula 1 there was an obscure regulation that said a drivr must be able to exit the cockpit in five seconds so we suggested that they try the five second rule on us at scrutineering and this was agreed. Mike Wilds kitted up in race suit, helmet, gloves etc and climbed in and had his seat harness fitted. Meanwhile two of our mechanics stood beside the car to catch the door. A signal was given on a stop watch and in a flash Mike hit the belt buckle and whacked the door which flew out of its pins and was deftly caught by the mechanics : the time, 4.2 seconds. Alain smiled and gave us the ok but when the scrutineers moved on to the next car he quietly told us that we would not be allowed to run the car in any more World Championship C2 events that year until the cockpit was fixed. As a result the car was entered for the support race for the British Grand Prix at Brands Hatch and Ray Mallock had a huge accident when leading the race so writing off the car. A completely new car was built for the following year and we invited Alain Bertaut over to Ray Mallocks place to check it out before we put the bodywork on it. He gave it the thumbs up and we went on to become Group C2 Champions in 1986. All three of the "legal" Ecosse C2's still exist and are still raced and what is more they are all owned by Scots, Hugh McCaig has the Championship winning car that his son Alasdair races, Andrew Smith his friend, has one and Barry Wood has the third one.

[AMICALEMANS]

Thanks Graham for this amazing story about ACO or FIA rules. That's mean that everything is possible in Le Mans, even where you are on the wrong side of the channel

[D-Type]

Hmmm I wonder whether McLaren will be able to make similar use of their Johnnie Walker sponsorship?

[fausto]

Originally posted by Pingguest
I see, but the Group C1 had no minimum weignt (initially), right?

Not at all, at first it was at 800 Kilos, then 850, then again (after 3.5 liters atmos were allowed) 900 and even 1000 (at Le Mans, early 90s....)