15 replies to this topic

[Tim CH]

Near the doors resp. the numbers on the doors you often can find SA, AS or TA (this might be Trans AM). What kind of categories are SA and AS?

i.e.

[HDonaldCapps]

AS = A Sedan

[WDH74]

Unless it's a Shelby GT-350, in which case it ran in BP-B Production. Some of the early AS and TA Mustang notchbacks were built by Shelby as well, but do not feature Shelby chassis plates.

A Sedan still seems to be a pretty popular class, and features loads of Mustangs. It's one I certainly enjoy watching.

-William

[Tim CH]

Thank you for your info.

[jm70]

As is typical of the SCCA, what you see is not always what you get. AS changed a few years ago to GT1, that is for cars prepared more for the current Trans-Am specs. Tube frame cars, etc, etc.
Then back in the late 80's they came up with a NEW A/S. Prep rules more like the OLD A/S. Tub cars, DOT tires, less engine prep. A place for ex Showroom Stock Mustangs and Camaro's to run.
Then you have the cars as shown here, racing in Vintage, with the original designation. But, I'm afraid many of them have power plants with quite a few of the pieces found in the GT1 cars! But all fun to watch!

[Tim CH]

Originally posted by jm70
As is typical of the SCCA, what you see is not always what you get. AS changed a few years ago to GT1, that is for cars prepared more for the current Trans-Am specs. Tube frame cars, etc, etc.
Then back in the late 80's they came up with a NEW A/S. Prep rules more like the OLD A/S. Tub cars, DOT tires, less engine prep. A place for ex Showroom Stock Mustangs and Camaro's to run.
Then you have the cars as shown here, racing in Vintage, with the original designation. But, I'm afraid many of them have power plants with quite a few of the pieces found in the GT1 cars! But all fun to watch!

...thx....was the old A/S existing in 1965? I know that in 1966 TA did exist.

[jm70]

1965 would have been the original, as seen in this photo. Sedan classes were: A, B, C and D. vs Production classes A through H.

[Tim CH]

Originally posted by jm70
1965 would have been the original, as seen in this photo. Sedan classes were: A, B, C and D. vs Production classes A through H.

Thanks a lot! So I will have to put the AS on my Mustang.

Cheers,
Tim

[RA Historian]

Originally posted by jm70
1965 would have been the original, as seen in this photo. Sedan classes were: A, B, C and D. vs Production classes A through H.

I believe that the first year of Sedan classes in SCCA National racing was 1966, the same year the Trans Am started.

[Tim CH]

Originally posted by RA Historian
I believe that the first year of Sedan classes in SCCA National racing was 1966, the same year the Trans Am started.

SCCA Classes: AP+BP+DP 1965

I indeed only could find A- and B-production race cars in 1965. No A-stock class.



For the Shelby G.T.350 of 1965 I found this... "On November 28 at the American Road Race of Champions in Daytona, there were seven GT350R's all racing for top honors in the B/Production field."



Re: Trans-Am I found this... "In 1966, The SCCA introduced a new class that allowed for head to head competition between Dodge Darts, Plymouth Barracudas, and Ford Mustangs. The rules were simple: competition was allowed between "Production Touring Cars" with a max wheelbase of 116". There were two classes, the "2 litre and under" class and the "2 litre to 5 litre" class. The Trans-Am class riles allowed few modifications to a production car. Drivers were allowed to remove bumpers, rear seats, and floor mats. Mufflers could be replaced with straight pipes and different rims could be used so long as the stock rim diameter and width were maintained. The 2 litre class saw competition between Alfa GTA's, Ford Lotus Cortinas, Austin Mini's, BMW's, Renault Gordini's, Volvo 120's, as well as entries of Volkwagens and Saabs. The 5 litre class hosted Plymouth Barracudas, Dodge Darts, Ford Mustangs, and Chevrolet Corvairs (out-cubed by the Ford 289 and Chrysler 273)."



...o.k. so if my 1965 Mustang were raced in 1966 it would have been in the A/S class... So I could mark it A/S ;)

I guess the main problem is, that Notchback Mustangs only were raced outside (Australia/Europe) the U.S. in 1965!

BR,
Tim

[RA Historian]

Originally posted by Tim CH

...o.k. so if my 1965 Mustang were raced in 1966 it would have been in the A/S class... So I could mark it A/S ;)

I guess the main problem is, that Notchback Mustangs only were raced outside (Australia/Europe) the U.S. in 1965!

BR,
Tim

You betcha, Tim. Even though it may be a 65 it sure could run in A Sedan in 66. As you indicated in your post, the only Mustangs running in 65 were the GT-350 variants in B Production. With the advent of A Sedan in 66, the notchback Mustangs appeared.

Have fun with your car!

Tom

[Bob Riebe]

Originally posted by RA Historian
You betcha, Tim. Even though it may be a 65 it sure could run in A Sedan in 66. As you indicated in your post, the only Mustangs running in 65 were the GT-350 variants in B Production. With the advent of A Sedan in 66, the notchback Mustangs appeared.

Have fun with your car!

Tom

The sedans were running before 1966, as special regional classes. It was the incredible popularity the special regional races, and demands by the racers that caused the SCCA to make it a national class.
Ron Grable was one of the drivers who drove the sedans before the official class existed.
They were not running Mustangs, that I know of, but Ramblers, Larks etc., which is why the original title was: Trans-American Sedan Racing Championship.
Bob

[RA Historian]

Bob is right. I guess my earlier post gave the impression that there was no sedan racing prior to 1966, but he rightly points out that it did exist indeed, just not at the National level. Mostly Volvos, Saabs, Jaguar 3.8 sedans, Alfas, and the like to begin. Remember the "Little LeMans" at Lime Rock, an enduro for (mostly non-US) sedans? Then the Marlboro 12 hours, which I think predated the Trans Am.

The advent of the US "compact car" in 1960 or thereabouts saw Falcons, Valiants, Corvairs, and Larks begin to race. I remember a televised compact car race from Daytona in, I believe, 1960. Sedan racing did have its events and disciples but they were largely localized.

Team Lotus ran a pair of 28s (Lotus Cortinas) in the under two liter portion of the USRRC in 1964. I remember seeing Trevor Taylor in one at Meadowdale, and David Hobbs at Road America.

I am sure that a lot more examples can be cited, but it was the advent of the "pony car" the gave the category the boost into the big time. The Mustang and the Barracuda started it in 1966, then the Camaro, the Firebird, etc. The Trans Am soared, peaked in 1970, then fell. It survived several formulae, good times and bad, until it finally ground to a rather inglorious halt, officially in 2006, but for all practical purposes in 2005.
Tom

[Frank S]

One of the support races for the USGP at Riverside, 1960, was a race including sedans. Walt Hansgen won in a Jaguar. I don't recall if it actually started the race, but on the Thursday or Friday during a practice, when I was Turn Marshal, Flagman, Emergency Crew, and Communications Talker-Observer at Turn Seven, a Ford Falcon 2-door automatic was the last car to take the checker. Procedure was to call as the last car cleared each turn:
"Car 26 through Turn Two ... What the HECK is that?"
"Through Turn Four ... It's a Falcon!"
"Through Turn Six ... It's a BIRD."
"It's a DOG!"
"It's a BIRD DOG!"
(Catch-phrase chorus of a recent Everly Brothers radio hit song -
http://www.allthelyr...om/song/382837/).

Maybe you had to be there?

--
Frank S

[Tim CH]

Originally posted by RA Historian
You betcha, Tim. Even though it may be a 65 it sure could run in A Sedan in 66. As you indicated in your post, the only Mustangs running in 65 were the GT-350 variants in B Production. With the advent of A Sedan in 66, the notchback Mustangs appeared.

Have fun with your car!

Tom

...be sure, I will

[Tim CH]

Found on http://www.thecarsource.com/

The Shelby Group 2 Notchbacks
1966, the Beginning of Trans-Am Racing
last updated April 17, 2005

During the mid-60's, pony cars were hot. The Ford Mustang was selling so well the other manufacturers came out with their own version of the short trunk cars. Owners and enthusiasts started taking their pony cars to the race track making sedan racing ever more popular. SCCA began to take notice and for 1966 established a sedan class with a National Championship category. The SCCA set up Group 2 cars under FIA Appendix 2. The amateur classes were based on displacement: A - 2000cc to 5000cc; B - 1300cc to 2000cc; D - under 1000cc. The Championship series included over 50 amateur races leading to an invitational American Road Race of Champions (ARRC) for the top three sedan class finishers in each of the seven geographical divisions.

A professional series was a established called The Trans-American Sedan Championship. This series of races was made up of seven professional races at different tracks across the US. The manufacturer with the most points at the end of the series would win the first ever Manufacturer's Trophy. The Trans-Am races, as it became known, ranged from 200 miles to 2,400 miles. The races ran from 2 hours to 24 hours and required pit stops for gas and tires.

Group 2 cars were divided into only two classes, over 2 litres and under 2 litres. The maximum displacement was 5 litres or 305 cid with a maximum wheelbase of 116 inches. Plus eligible cars had to seat 4 people eliminating the 65 GT 350s. In the beginning, the GT 350s were set up as two seaters to qualify for SCCA's Class B Production. The rear sears were removed and replaced with a fiberglass shelf. Ford wanted the Trans-Am Manufacturers Trophy. After the great success of the GT 350 fastbacks, Ford immediately turned the project over to Shelby American.

Shelby American built sixteen 1966 Group 2 Notchback Mustangs, all for sale to independents. Chuck Cantwell, GT 350 Project Engineer and Jerry Schwartz, fabricator & mechanic were given the job of developing and prepping the cars. The Mustangs were built to GT 350R specs. The main differences between the Group 2 cars and the GT 350Rs were cosmetic. The Group 2 Mustangs were required to be close to stock with steel hoods and front ends. The GT 350Rs had fiberglass hoods and front aprons, plastic side and rear windows. The Group 2 cars used glass windows. Stock interior and four seats were also required for the Group 2 cars.

The GT 350Rs and the Group 2 Mustangs had a lot of similarities. Both cars had:

* racing type, positive locking devices on the hoods and trunks
* 7"x15" American racing magnesium wheels
* lowered A-arms
* 34 gallon fuel tanks with 3 /12" quick release caps and splash funnels
* trunk mounted batteries
* Stewart Warner electric fuel pumps
* six CS gauges housed in a special instrument housing
fuel pressure, oil temp, 0-160 mph speedometer, 0-8,000 rpm tach, oil pressure, & water temp
* four point roll bar
* 3" competition lap belts with shoulder harness
* 18 quart Ford Galaxy radiator
* oil cooler with remote oil filter
* tube headers with 2 1/2" straight pipes dumping out just in front of the rear wheels
* "Monte Carlo" stabilizer bars to strengthen the front end
* export brace (named after the brace used on Mustangs for export)
* 11.3" front disc brakes
* 10"x2 1/2" wide rear drum brakes
* one inch sway bar
* 16" three spoke wood steering wheel
* stock Ford valve covers on the 289 cid with a special breather
* Koni shock absorbers
* Detroit "No-Spin" rear ratcheting differential
* 3.89 rear axle
* 19:1 quick steering
* Borg Warner T-10 close ratio four speeds
* 7.5 finned cast aluminum oil pan
* over ride traction bars
* Shelby American racing 289 cid with an aluminum hi-rise and a 715 cfm Holley carb
The engines developed over 350 horse power.

The Group 2 Mustangs were based on the Mustang GT. All Group 2 cars had the stock GT package including fog lights in the grilles. The lenses and bulbs were replaced with high intensity driving lights for better use during the night driving in some of the Trans-Am races. Most Group 2 racers came with a 1/2" rear sway bar and a Panhard rod. Some of the cars came with a scooped out fiberglass panel between the passenger compartment and the trunk allowing a spare tire to be mounted. The spare would not fit in the trunk with the larger gas tank. A spare tire was not required during racing. It is possible this option was shared with the four Group 1 race cars Shelby America sent to Europe. This a rare item to see today in restored cars. The SCCA required a metal bulkhead between the driver's compartment and the gas tank early in 1967. Any car raced during 1967 had to have the bulkhead replacing the fiberglass spare tire mount.

The 16 Group 2 Mustangs were painted white with black interiors. All cars were sold to independent teams. Shelby did not run a Group 2 Trans-Am team in 1966. Only one car was completed in time for the Trans-Am race at Sebring in 1966. Three were to be available. The first car went to Cooper, Clark & Associates. They paid $6,414 for the first Group 2 car in a bidding war. Later Group 2 Mustang sold for $5,500.

Shelby prepared cars placed in five out the remaining six races. Independent teams drove non-Shelby Group 2 Mustangs to wins at Mid-America Raceway, the Virginia 400 and second at Briar 250. Ford and Chrysler fought for the lead in points up to the last two races. At Green Valley, Brad Booker and John McComb driving a Shelby Group 2 Mustang beat out the "Team Starfish" Barracudas and Group 44 Dodge Darts to win tying the standings at 37 each for Chrysler and Ford.

The last race of the season was at the Riverside Track in California. Shelby sent Jerry Titus to drive a Shelby Group 2 Mustang. During the qualifying on Saturday Titus set a track lap record of 1:41.9 at an average of 91.854 miles per hour to earn the number one spot for the race on Sunday. The race started with a LeMans type start. Titus flooded his Mustang leaving him next to last to start. A later broken oil filter cost him almost two laps while it was being replaced. Titus fought his way through the 34 cars to finish first, 48 seconds ahead of the Tullis Group 44 Dodge Dart. Mustang and Ford won the first Trans-Am Manufacturers Trophy.

Source of information: SAAC Shelby American, issue #50 from an article written by Bill Hanlon