19 replies to this topic

[ellrosso]

Does anyone know whether the Bill Patterson BMW CSL raced in Europe by Peter Brock in 1976 ever raced in Australia?
Or if it ran at any track in practice or private practice for that matter. We have 2 shots of the car on the oldracephotos.com website taken at Sandown in 1976 (on the back of a truck), but I'm wondering if anyone has any pics of the car on track in Australia.'Regards, Lindsay Ross

[eldougo]

just taking a stab at the question i would say NO.... but i was not in Australia at the time . Ray will know.

[Ray Bell]

Hard to say...

There was never any intention of racing it in Australia, it was purely for Le Mans etc. However, they modified a lot of stuff on the car, with particular recollections being the brakes. I think it unlikely that this was done without some form of testing taking place.

Talk to Plastic if you can.

[Ray Bell]

Sent to me by Jeff Green...

I imagine this was a publicity photo session prior to Le Mans, but as I suggested, I could well believe there was some track testing took place here before the car left. Among the modifications was a lot of normalising of the brakes, the team didn't like the trick stuff that was fitted and was more familiar with the Girlock type of setup used here.

[cavvy]

Currently being restored in Europe, maybe the UK - not in Brock colour scheme as it was a Petersen car.

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by cavvy
Currently being restored in Europe, maybe the UK - not in Brock colour scheme as it was a Petersen car.

is their a link?

[thunder427]

The Jeff Green /Ray Bell , 'Kodac' moment is the 'Press Release' at Sandown International Raceway for the all Australian assult on Le Mans by Bill Paterson/BMW.Peter Brock at the wheel, 'mastered minded' by marketing /promotion 'GURU' Donald Gibb,( creator of the Australian 05/drink driver campaign,ex Moffat/Coca Cola manager and at that time Brocks manager).....the car had been in Melbourne 10 days,we only had it for 7days when this shot was taken,it arrived damaged from 'Kylamai/South Africa' it was totally reworked to appear at this Promotion.the RHD fender ,suspension was smashed.(the problem buying pre -raced cars,you take what you get),I painted the car 'white pearl',hand cut the decals ,every thing below 05,this was in an 'age' when there was only one company that did 'Computer Graphics',I slept in the car the night before the 'photo shoot',as I didnt have enough petrol to get back to the factory with out going to the bank,which in those times openned at 10,o'clock,Chris Farrel rebuilt the rh front fender('Alloy-by memory!!) the car was at Garnet Batsons workshop at Diamond Creek,a Growing up friend of Peters,responsible for assisting Peter in the Lean/early years,we all ran on 'Opportunity'............regards427

[cavvy]

Originally posted by Lola5000
is their a link?

I dont have a link, my contact via the restorer.

Being restored in 74 spec as it ran as part of the factory team.

see if I van get an update posted.

[thunder427]

Cavvy e.mailed me to tell the story of nearly being arrested durring the BMW's refurbishment,owing to the short 'time frame' I had enlisted the help of a friends 'body shop',to achieve this and his teams help' I would have to deliver all the un-boltable parts' which they would prep and base in 'White' as agreed' I drove a two door Monaro (like a Camaro !!) not applicable for carting panels......So !!....I asked the 'sales manager' of a local Ford Dealership that I contracted to for a loan 'utility',"grab that trade-in F100 pick-up over in the Used car division"....when I get there I'm meet with the... "Bu%#*^t, I've got a customer on that first thing tomorrow" !!,"Hey If you need a ute take that Falcon utility,should do the job",Laughs and walks off,Trust me when I say this was a piece of 'Dogs Doings' ,Big Time.......I've set the scene......ute is now loaded with BMW panels and sundry parts,its 2o'clock in the morning,I'm leaving the factory to drive across town ,about a 40minute drive home,some sleep,up in the morning,deliver the parts,..I ask what could difficult about that ??.....I'M tired ,but pumped,jobs done,its 20minutes into the journey, the ute is struggling, but doing its job, (it looks like it escaped from a 'Scrap Yard'),,when ,I look out to my left as I cross a main intersection I see a Traffic/Police Car parked,yep you guessed it, on come the headlight,on goes the 'Flashing' lights,...being the only car/utility on the road it as to be for me,I dutifully pull over,the Uniform walks up to the door, "Evening Sir !!,where would you be heading"??..."Home, Sir"...."can I see your liscence, Sir"??,,..."I don't have it on me , Sir",..."Would you mind stepping out of the vehicle, SIR",...."Its against the LAW not to carry your Liscence...DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT !!!,.."Yes Sir"......."Alright, whats the registration number of this Vehicle" ???,"I dont know ,Sir"....."Why don't you know the Rego number "??, "Its not my ute, Sir", "well who is the registered owner 'SIR !!!, "I don't Know, Sir",I only borrowed it today to transport some parts........Mean while his partner is shinning the torch ,here,there, every where....spies the tray area full of car parts........."So whats this Lot, Steal this did we"???...No Sir they are off (Time to do some name dropping'cause I'M dying here) Peter Brocks BMW Racecar" !!!.....well, "Son Now I Know your full of Bul#*^t !!,Everybody Knows 'Brockie' only drives a Holden",.......IT Didnt get much better for the next 10minutes,I finally did a deal with the Officer ,after giving Him all My credentials twice and the 2nd Officer had called it in (for 'ALL' my priors and also to find that the 'Ute' had only 4 more days registration) that IF it wasn't in the Melbourne papers by next Friday,that "Brockie was going to drive a BMW at Le Mans, then he was welcome to come and 'ARREST' my sorry Butt.................so when I say that photo was at Sandown Raceway,you can Bank on it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!....................Regards427

[roundel]

Hello all,
I am restoring the ex Brock CSL here in England.
It is interesting for me to hear about what happened to the car while it was over there. Could you try to answer a few questions about it ?
It is correct that the car raced at Kyalami in November `75 with Derek Bell & Brian Redman driving. It was damaged during the race and the left front suspension was changed in the pits. So that fits with your info. The car was originally built by BMW in early `74 and was driven by Derek Bell & Jacky Ickx in 3 races. It is possible Peterson drove the car in one race in Sweden. At this time it had an ATE ABS system fitted, but this was probably removed before BMW sold the car to Siggi Muller & Alain Peltier (who won the ETCC with it in `75...). But all of these cars had an electro hydraulic servo system which is probably what was removed in Australia? Was all of the preparation for Le Mans done over there ? Do you know when the car returned to Europe ?
I always assumed that Walkinshaw was somehow involved with the Le Mans effort ? Maybe because the car was in his private collection until we bought it 10 years ago.

Regards Alex.

[Ray Bell]

I would doubt there was any involvement from Walkinshaw...

This was a privateer effort, backing coming from Bill Patterson Motors and their BMW dealership. Patterson was backing Brock's Holden racing, which was more or less put on hold for the duration of his European foray.

I do have a little information about the Le Mans preparation, but it's not here... nor likely to be accessible in the next few days. But I do remember Brock talking about the simplification of the braking system and the use of Girlock components in place of the original.

[roundel]

Hi Ray,
To the best of my knowledge the car never raced again after the last time Brock drove it in Austria in mid `76. Therefore I am assuming the mechanics of the car are as they were then. In which case the brakes are the normal Lockheed/AP period calipers used on all of these cars back then. The only unusual things about the car were the alloy dash and the wiring system, neither of which were normal BMW stuff. Do you know if the car was serviced at Le Mans by an Australian team ?
I would be interested in any other info you may have.

Alex

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by roundel
Hi Ray,
To the best of my knowledge the car never raced again after the last time Brock drove it in Austria in mid `76. Therefore I am assuming the mechanics of the car are as they were then. In which case the brakes are the normal Lockheed/AP period calipers used on all of these cars back then. The only unusual things about the car were the alloy dash and the wiring system, neither of which were normal BMW stuff. Do you know if the car was serviced at Le Mans by an Australian team ?
I would be interested in any other info you may have.

Alex

are you going to race her?
if so Lemans classic?

[thunder427]

rondel; all modifications were performed here in Melbourne prior to shipping to Le Mans,(main mechanic was Garnet Batson,I can try to contact him If you wish/please advice ) the wirring loom was modified as it was deemed to complicated with 'fuses' for all four cnrs., at Le Mans the team , managed by Don Gibb, (whom put the Brock/Le Mans 'concept' to-gether) were under the 'factory' team's 'umbrella' so to speak,with minamal Aussie personal, 'The Don', gave me one of the 'original' Le Mans time sheets, plus He entrusted me with the 'original' Press clippings file, .........rondel ,I will contact Don Gibb, a very articulate person ,whom I am sure will be only to happy to set the Le Mans record straight for you and yes!! ,Walkinshaw was involved, but only to store the BMW when it was left in England....but that is another story.............regards427

[roundel]

Thanks for the info so far, very interesring. I will post a few pictures of the car in a week or two. I was sure Walkinshaw was involved somehow, presumably he bought the car when the Brock team had finished with it ? From your post it sounds like there is a story to that ?

Regarding the future for the car, the owner is in the USA so the car is going there when finished.

Regards Alex.

[thunder427]

roundel,spoke with 'The Don' (Don Gibb) he's back from a succesful business trip and was real interested to join 'TNF' and answer Questions and discuss the Le Mans Assult,two things he pointed out where, #1: NO !! Tom Walkinshaw involvment (Point he made, Tom Who!!? in those days)#2:they airfreighted the BMW to England, teamed up with Brian 'YOGI' Muir,whom opened trailered the BMW to Le mans (but Don Tells a better story !!)they 'billited with the 'French co/Drivers,....Garnet Batson and a couple of other personal travelled to France, along with Brocks Mate, Tim "plastic' Pimbleton..but watch this space for the real story from 'THe Don'..................regards427

[roundel]

Sounds interesting, I look forward to the full story. Does he know how Walkinshaw came to own the car, I suspect there could be another story.....

regards Alex.

[Dale Harvey]

In 1976 I was in Europe on holiday and went to a sports car meeting at Dijon in France, September I think, in the hope that Brock and the BMW would be competing. This is of course after LeMans. John Fitzpatrick was running a BMW and I spoke with him and asked the whereabouts of Brock and co. He told me they had gone home as the car was not competitive. His co-driver on that day was Tom Walkinshaw and seemed to be very much the number 2.
He then told me he was coming to Australia to drive at Bathurst but was unsure about the team he had agreed to drive with. Well, they won the race that year.

Dale.

[motorabilia.biz]

Jeff Green here. My question is; was it a 3.0 CSL or a 3.5 CSL as stated on the Le Mans register site http://www.formula2.net/1976.htm

A story that Peter Brock told me was that he could not match the factory teams times during practice at Le Mans and would follow their line exactly but get oversteer. I can't remember but I think it was Dieter Quester that he was following and later discussed it with. Dieter had a look and they discover that at some stage the rear wing had been put on upside down! Apparently someone had had taken it off when cleaning the car and put it on upside down.

Great to follow this story and hear from the people that were there.

[roundel]

They were all called 3;0 CSL`s as that was what the base homologation road car was called. But after mid `73 all the factory cars were 3;5 litres, & most others as well.
Alex