3949 replies to this topic

[Lipp]

Impressive performance by Sainz, IMO he's the best rookie this season.

 

Well he was trailing Max all weekend, same way when Carlos was quicker in all practices at Malaysia but Max beat him due to the rain. But for being the best rookie the jury is still out, both have to catch up with Nasr in the points. Let's hope for a nice fight on the track with no faults from the team during pitstops.

[Jimisgod]

Well that was underwhelming from Max.

[JosD]

Well that was underwhelming from Max.

 

Somewhat disappointing, especially since he was 4 tenths slower than FP3. Those things happen, but on the other hand, perhaps he we can see some fine overtaking maneuvers from him tomorrow.

[Supertourer]

Somewhat disappointing, especially since he was 4 tenths slower than FP3. Those things happen, but on the other hand, perhaps he we can see some fine overtaking maneuvers from him tomorrow.

 

Max saying that STR changed the floor on his car after FP3 and the issue may he had may be something to do with that, the team are investigating.

[zanquis]

Well they changed the floor of the car maybe they will find something a bit wrong. It was a shame cause if the car is not doing what it did before you are screwed. Also u obly count gaps in same sessions not q2 vs q3 cause otherwise Carlos is screwed and can never win qualifyingduel again.

[Kao18]

That is something I dont understand. If the car is good why mess with it before qualifying.

I don't believe you can put this in the 'Max has to get better at qualifying' category. You don't just loose that much pace because its qualifying and you forgot how to drive or don't know how to setup the car while you have been in the top the whole weekend.

We might see an active and somewhat aggresive Max tomorrow if the car is good. Knowing him he will want to make up for today.

[CurbPainter]

That is something I dont understand. If the car is good why mess with it before qualifying.
 

 

It could just have been needed because of wear...you still have to fall within the rules.

 

 

I don't believe you can put this in the 'Max has to get better at qualifying' category. You don't just loose that much pace because its qualifying and you forgot how to drive or don't know how to setup the car while you have been in the top the whole weekend.

We might see an active and somewhat aggresive Max tomorrow if the car is good. Knowing him he will want to make up for today.

 

Bad Qualifying is making too many mistakes or being too slow when all is well...P9 or P10 two weeks ago would have been bad Qualifying.

 

If they can identify the problem and the race pace is good, it could be a nice comeback again just like the Chinese GP...and the weather forecasts still give the possibility of some rain at the end of the race.

Edited by CurbPainter, 04 July 2015 - 18:07.

[itsgreen84]

Max Verstappen @Max33Verstappen

Found the problem what made us not have a good qualifying.A shame after such a strong start.But. The race is tomorrow

[TheRacingElf]

 

Max Verstappen @Max33Verstappen

Found the problem what made us not have a good qualifying.A shame after such a strong start.But. The race is tomorrow

 

His engineer also confirmed there was something wrong and that they found out what it was

 

 

Xevi Pujolar ‏@xevipujolar 46m46 minutes ago

We found the problem. We get ready to fight back tomorrow! #KeepPushing #NeverGiveUp

[A3]

- Verstappen once again beaten in Q

- Max serioulsly needs to work on qualifying....

- Embarassing result. This time Sainz destroyed Max by 0.9 seconds. 

- Sainz is the best rookie

 

Jumping to conclusions: Level 99

 

 

In the end Max his car had a problem, (they probably forgot to tighten the screws on the new floor ) but that doesn't matter because Max sucks at qualifying anyway, right?

 

 

[itsgreen84]

This goes both ways, if there is more than .3 between both guys, there is something wrong (with the car)...

 

By all things we have seen so far this season they have been fairly evenly matched...

[Kao18]

- Verstappen once again beaten in Q
- Max serioulsly needs to work on qualifying....
- Embarassing result. This time Sainz destroyed Max by 0.9 seconds.
- Sainz is the best rookie

Jumping to conclusions: Level 99


In the end Max his car had a problem, (they probably forgot to tighten the screws on the new floor ) but that doesn't matter because Max sucks at qualifying anyway, right?

Exactly, so much cynics immediately playing the 'qualify' card again. Max doesn't come across as the complainer type. He may still be learning but if he complains so much during qualifying after he has been flying in practice for two days you know something has to be wrong.

[CurbPainter]

This goes both ways, if there is more than .3 between both guys, there is something wrong (with the car)...

 

By all things we have seen so far this season they have been fairly evenly matched...

 

 

Anthony Davidson said during practice that with the cars of today, there was only a couple of tenths between the best and worst drivers on the grid.

 

I can hardly think of any of the Qualifying's have gone right for both of them at the same time, Barcelona sort of (set up not quite right for Max) and Canada (but Max had low downforce set up to be able to overtake making his lap times a bit slower). In all others, one of them or both had some kind of problem or mistake.

[Requiem84]

Very intriguing that TR doesn't disclose which problem it was. Odd not to mention this.

Also surprised nobody claims the legitimacy of these 'technical problems' ;-)

Edit: rumor circuit is saying Anti roll bar failed. If that's true, I admit I jumped to conclusions and max' performanceshould be seen in another light. Let's wait for confirmation :-)

Edited by Requiem84, 04 July 2015 - 22:23.

[zanquis]

Very intriguing that TR doesn't disclose which problem it was. Odd not to mention this.

Also surprised nobody claims the legitimacy of these 'technical problems' ;-)

Edit: rumor circuit is saying Anti roll bar failed. If that's true, I admit I jumped to conclusions and max' performanceshould be seen in another light. Let's wait for confirmation :-)

It is not weird that they dont mention exactly what went wrong, that is for them to know. No need to be so specific. Would be bad for who ever the engineer responsible. You gain nothing by shaming him.

Overall it might be the tracks that suit Max a bit better but will have to see what his tactics will be would not be surprised if he needs to pit early as it might have damaged his rear tires.

[krobinson]

:up:Carlos

[Jimisgod]

- Verstappen once again beaten in Q

- Max serioulsly needs to work on qualifying....

- Embarassing result. This time Sainz destroyed Max by 0.9 seconds. 

- Sainz is the best rookie

 

Jumping to conclusions: Level 99

 

 

In the end Max his car had a problem, (they probably forgot to tighten the screws on the new floor ) but that doesn't matter because Max sucks at qualifying anyway, right?

 

 

 

These are the same fans who were suggesting Max was the best choice Ferrari had for 2016. Suddenly stating a fact - Max lost by 0.9 seconds - is jumping to conclusions?

[Ragnar668]

Why no disclosure of the problem?

Rumor is Anti-roll bar failed

[A3]

Because it's embarrassing? Could very well mean they forgot to fix the ARB properly.

[Gilles4Ever]

Unless it's broken they can't replace/repair it under parc ferme rules?

[A3]

Unless it's broken they can't replace/repair it under parc ferme rules?

They can if it's a safety thing, right?

[Requiem84]

On Verstappen.nl it is said thexproblem has been fixed. I assume MV goes into the race with a good car.

[CurbPainter]

Unless it's broken they can't replace/repair it under parc ferme rules?

 

They changed his floor after FP3, so it might well have gone wrong with not proper installing things back again.

 

I think in case of safety they can, they did after Malaysia Qualifying with his brakes the same...so fixing or replacing a part can be done, but no set up change.

Edited by CurbPainter, 05 July 2015 - 07:25.

[Gilles4Ever]

They can if it's a safety thing, right?

It would only be unsafe if it was broken or was going to break surely?

The wording of the tweets indicates that whatever the problem was it will be rectified for the race so imo it's something that broke or something that can be set differently during the race like bias, wing angle etc.

If something had been fitted incorrectly, surely that wouldn't be allowed to be changed unless it were broken. If you had to refit it that would require taking it out of parc ferme and be a pitlane start?

[CurbPainter]

It would only be unsafe if it was broken or was going to break surely?

The wording of the tweets indicates that whatever the problem was it will be rectified for the race so imo it's something that broke or something that can be set differently during the race like bias, wing angle etc.

If something had been fitted incorrectly, surely that wouldn't be allowed to be changed unless it were broken. If you had to refit it that would require taking it out of parc ferme and be a pitlane start?

 

If something isn't connected as it should be, the car becomes unsafe, so to me it looks like they can refit it or replace it in that case.

 

On Verstappen his page it's being said to be solved already...

 

http://www.verstappe...id=9217&lang=en

 

Changes on bias and wing angle etc, can't be done before the race, but his problems seemed to be too big to be just something like that.

[A3]

I have no idea to be honest.

 

 Suddenly stating a fact - Max lost by 0.9 seconds - is jumping to conclusions?

 

No, that part isn't.

Saying that Sainz destroyed Max, that Max need to up his qualifying, that Sainz is the better rookie is jumping to conclusions.

 

Sainz trailed Max (closely) all weekend and with a technical problem you simply cannot blame Max for this.

[Waggy]

Max Verstappen is the most overhyped driver since Kimi. his fans find any excuse for him consistantly being beaten by his team mate in qualifying, results dont lie, sainz is faster.

 

p.s waiting for the Max fans finding data thats says between lap 22-34 Max was faster so he is better bla bla

[A3]

If something had been fitted incorrectly, surely that wouldn't be allowed to be changed unless it were broken.

 

They could claim it got loose because of vibrations, I don't know. Doesn't matter, at least it will be rectified.

[A3]

Max Verstappen is the most overhyped driver since Kimi. his fans find any excuse for him consistantly being beaten by his team mate in qualifying, results dont lie, sainz is faster.

 

Edited by A3, 05 July 2015 - 07:45.

[Kao18]

Typical Max bad luck again, the ARB preventing him from perhaps getting his best grid position this season. Can we get a problemfree qualifying/race (for both drivers) at tracks where they can excel sometime please....

[Requiem84]

Max Verstappen is the most overhyped driver since Kimi. his fans find any excuse for him consistantly being beaten by his team mate in qualifying, results dont lie, sainz is faster.

p.s waiting for the Max fans finding data thats says between lap 22-34 Max was faster so he is better bla bla

Rather than commenting on the sometimes overhyped fans, comment on MV or CS.

Can you do that?

[itsgreen84]

Why no disclosure of the problem?

Rumor is Anti-roll bar failed

 

Dutch site Formule1.nl spoke with Max and he said it was the engine waste gate that resulted in the driveability problems...

 

 

Max Verstappen is the most overhyped driver since Kimi. his fans find any excuse for him consistantly being beaten by his team mate in qualifying, results dont lie, sainz is faster.

 

p.s waiting for the Max fans finding data thats says between lap 22-34 Max was faster so he is better bla bla

 

Quite easy to explain this one, he was slower than his FP3 time by 0.5 seconds. That doesn't happen without some reason.

[CurbPainter]

Typical Max bad luck again, the ARB preventing him from perhaps getting his best grid position this season. Can we get a problemfree qualifying/race (for both drivers) at tracks where they can excel sometime please....

 

...and I also would like to see in the second half of the season at least 3 or 4 Qualifying sessions in which we can actually really compare them both, another missed chance...it's always one or the other, or too cold tyres, bad set ups, etc.

[krobinson]

 

Saying that Sainz destroyed Max, that Max need to up his qualifying, that Sainz is the better rookie is jumping to conclusions.

 

 

What about saying that Max is the better rookie? You will find loads of people saying that in this thread, yet you don't seem to mind that.

[Waggy]

Dutch site Formule1.nl spoke with Max and he said it was the engine waste gate that resulted in the driveability problems...

 

 

 

Quite easy to explain this one, he was slower than his FP3 time by 0.5 seconds. That doesn't happen without some reason.

Yeah I think the stars were out of alignment, thats why Max was slower

[Requiem84]

Ignore the troll :-).

[Requiem84]

Dutch site Formule1.nl spoke with Max and he said it was the engine waste gate that resulted in the driveability problems...



Quite easy to explain this one, he was slower than his FP3 time by 0.5 seconds. That doesn't happen without some reason.

What does the waste gate do? Surprised that an engine component can influence the handling of the car so much. Perhaps engine delivered power completely different?

[A3]

What about saying that Max is the better rookie? You will find loads of people saying that in this thread, yet you don't seem to mind that.

Oh I don't know who is the better rookie, but claiming Carlos is after yesterday's qualifing is a bit rich, IMO.

[CurbPainter]

What does the waste gate do? Surprised that an engine component can influence the handling of the car so much. Perhaps engine delivered power completely different?

 

 

WASTEGATE

 

In short:

 

On conventional turbo engines, a wastegate is used in association with a turbocharger to control the high rotation speeds of the system. It is a control device that allows excess exhaust gas to by-pass the turbine and match the power produced by the turbine to that needed by the compressor to supply the air required by the engine. On the Renault Energy F1, the turbo rotation speed is primarily controlled by the MGU-H (see below) however a wastegate is needed to keep full control in any circumstance (quick transient or MGU-H deactivation).

 

The challenge:

 

The wastegate is linked to the turbocharger but sits in a very crowded area of the car. The challenge is therefore to make it robust enough to withstand the enormous pressures while small enough to fit.

 

One to watch:

 

On a plane there are certain parts that are classified as critical if they fail. By this measure the wastegate is the same: if it fails the consequences will be very serious.

 

http://www.formula1b...o-engine-works/

Edited by CurbPainter, 05 July 2015 - 08:06.

[A3]

What does the waste gate do? Surprised that an engine component can influence the handling of the car so much. Perhaps engine delivered power completely different?

I think it regulates turbo boost pressure (amongst other things), so the power might have kicked in all of a sudden and too early, which caused lots of wheelspin, destroying the rears.

 

I'm not that technical, so maybe I'm talking rubbish.

[Requiem84]

Interesting thanks. But reading that it sounds like the wastegate would only influence engine power (from the turbo).

Not clear to me how this part could impact car balance.

[krobinson]

Oh I don't know who is the better rookie, but claiming Carlos is after yesterday's qualifing is a bit rich, IMO.

 

I agree completely, but there are people here who have decided that Max is by far the better driver and Carlos is pretty much waste compared to him. But at least that is good that you agree that those people are jumping to conclusions too and so far neither driver has proven much.

[Ragnar668]

What about saying that Max is the better rookie? You will find loads of people saying that in this thread, yet you don't seem to mind that.

Not loads of people, the same people a lot of time   

Let's be honest, until quali MV had the upper hand.
Then in quali, he suddenly spins out of nowhere and he is 4/10 slower then in free practice
Have to agree with A3 here " I don't know who is the better rookie, but claiming Carlos is after yesterday's qualifing is a bit rich, IMO."

 

[A3]

I agree completely, but there are people here who have decided that Max is by far the better driver and Carlos is pretty much waste compared to him. But at least that is good that you agree that those people are jumping to conclusions too and so far neither driver has proven much.

I've always said that Carlos is a very good driver who'll be in F1 for years to come, I just think Max has an edge over him in racecraft, which is what will make him stand out more in the end.

Edited by A3, 05 July 2015 - 08:25.

[lars75]

What about saying that Max is the better rookie? You will find loads of people saying that in this thread, yet you don't seem to mind that.

 

I hardly see those comments! Most of them saying the are at least equally matched.

 

So do I, but when I take his age and experience in to count I believe Max is doing slightly better overall.

 

Don't forget the boy is just 17 with one season single seater racing. He came to F1 by force and expectations were high. But it's insane to expect and/or believe he would demolish Sainz from day one and allways will be beating him. People who expected that completly lost their mind and sence of reality.

 

And for the upcomming race today, I surely hope for this one time the team doesn't screw up one of the pitstops from these youngsters. That would be a victory by it's self for the team and would make the chances for both better to have a strong race.

 

Max was the only driver from who his time in Qualifying was slower compared to his time in FP3. There was a problem with his car obvisously.

 

In qualifying it's 6-3 in favour of Sainz, in the point standing Max currently is in the lead again. Both need to pick up some points to beat Nasr. But both of them to me are doing a better Job than Nasr, who gets beaten by Ericsson once in a while and he is not at the same level as Sainz and Verstappen or Nasr. To me Max is the biggest sensation comming to F1. Where Max is, there is action in some kind of way. Sainz is solid and consistant wich is good for bringing home the car. 

 

We will see at the end, but I think Max will be in front point wice and in Qualifying it can be close.

[CurbPainter]

I agree completely, but there are people here who have decided that Max is by far the better driver and Carlos is pretty much waste compared to him. But at least that is good that you agree that those people are jumping to conclusions too and so far neither driver has proven much.

 

In the races Max has had a better race pace up until now, and that already shows he will be one of the better drivers in F1 in the future. Carlos has been doing well in Qualifying, but in race pace nothing more as a future midfield driver up until now.

 

So if you think single fast laps are an indication of what lies ahead, be my guest in thinking there hasn't been a difference between them...however Team Principals are paying better attention as you do.

[DutchQuicksilver]

They've fixed the issue on Verstappen's car, so with his pace from Friday and Saturday morning, he should be able to comfortably finish in the points.

[Kao18]

They've fixed the issue on Verstappen's car, so with his pace from Friday and Saturday morning, he should be able to comfortably finish in the points.

 

When there is overtaking involved it usually isn't 'comfortably'. Besides the engine still lacks power on the straights. It's not going to be that easy even with his free practice pace.

[A3]

Well, in fp2 he was 6th in the speed trap top 10, so overtaking might be possible.

[Requiem84]

Well, in fp2 he was 6th in the speed trap top 10, so overtaking might be possible.

 

That was just some experimental setup I believe.

 

This are the Qualifying top speeds: