242 replies to this topic

[ensign14]

Crawling up the general public's arse is one thing, talking out of one's own is another.

[aportinga]

Quote

Originally posted by Tmeranda
There are a lot of reasons Michael failed in F1. This and Michael's lack of testing and circuit knowledge may be several, but certainly lack of talent was not one! Given a neutral circuit and equal cars I would bet on Michael against Mika. And when it was all over he wouldn't drop to the ground crying like his advesary.

You're out of your mind.

Maybe with 5 years under his belt but even then - taking the two on their best day Mika would paste him... However to MS defence Mika would probably break down an cry if he had to run on super speedway ovals.

[ivandjj]

i am not saying that marco, 21 now, is particularly smart. but it is nice that he shares with us his real feelings. AJ foyt, 74 now, is not much different. and i like him too for that.

[aportinga]

Quote

Originally posted by ivandjj
i rember hakkinen's statement given shortly after getting a race seat for estoril
~ ron gave me his word that i will be racing for mclaren in 1993 and i felt comfortable with it ~

i would guess that ron expected senna not to race for mclaren in 1993, so he got himself andretti and hakkinen.
if senna stayed on the beach in 1993, maybe andretti would've got fairer chance and more support from the team.

but hakkinen was obviously mclaren future and with senna there for the whole 93', andretti was in the shyte from the beggining. don't know about outright sabotage, but i wouldn't be surprised that ron somehow helped andretti to the door to make room for hakkinen.
ron was right with his selection of drivers of course, but that doesn't mean that that michael was treated fairly.

regarding marco it's actually refreshing that he is saying what he thinks, instead of being oh so polliticaly correct and crawling up f1's, ron's and general public's asses.

There was discussions that they would also run 3 cars.

[Arion]

Just read the rest of the interview, I wonder what MA is telling Marco, he seems to think people in F1 have something against a Andretti.

Marco Andretti tested a Honda F1 car in 2006, but he isn't willing to make the jump unless it is with a team that can win. He believes the F1 establishment wants him to fail, too.

"I don't have any other mentality other than to go over there and win," Andretti said. "Because I think it's a bigger story if I go over there and fail, really. It really is. Because that's what people are waiting for, to be honest, over there."

[Ben]

Quote

Originally posted by j madra
I was always under the impression the Andretti was the odd-man out when it came to testing. Weren't McLaren contractually obligated to use Senna and Hakkinen for testing?

Once again the BBC is your friend. A test session heavily featured in one show has Andretti and Hakinnen at Silverstone whilst Senna is sunning himself in Portugal.

Ironically at this test Hakinnen was slower than Andretti and Mika looked like the spoiled brat. Pat Fry and Geigio Ascanelli are filmed debating whether they have a "car problem" or whether Mika's had a "Brain failure"

Once again - hardly the sort of thing you display to the world if you're conspiring against Andretti and think Mika can do no wrong.

Ben

[F1Fanatic.co.uk]

I don't believe it, and I'm not surprised some people will believe anything bad about McLaren, however preposterous.

[ensign14]

Quote

Originally posted by Arion
Just read the rest of the interview, I wonder what MA is telling Marco, he seems to think people in F1 have something against a Andretti.

Marco Andretti tested a Honda F1 car in 2006, but he isn't willing to make the jump unless it is with a team that can win. He believes the F1 establishment wants him to fail, too.

"I don't have any other mentality other than to go over there and win," Andretti said. "Because I think it's a bigger story if I go over there and fail, really. It really is. Because that's what people are waiting for, to be honest, over there."

Nothing to do with Andretti, F1 likes to prove itself to be the best in the world and have drivers who have dominated other series to come over and flop. Hence the pissing Villeneuve around in 1997.

[Josta]

Quote

Originally posted by Arion
Just read the rest of the interview, I wonder what MA is telling Marco, he seems to think people in F1 have something against a Andretti.

Marco Andretti tested a Honda F1 car in 2006, but he isn't willing to make the jump unless it is with a team that can win. He believes the F1 establishment wants him to fail, too.

"I don't have any other mentality other than to go over there and win," Andretti said. "Because I think it's a bigger story if I go over there and fail, really. It really is. Because that's what people are waiting for, to be honest, over there."

So not only has he stuck 2 fingers up at McLaren, (currently one of only 2 teams that are winning), he is saying Honda are **** so not worth a look. If ever there was a bigger act of shooting yourself in the foot in the quest to F1, I haven't heard of it.

[Spunout]

Those are big words from somebody who only got the test because of his last name.

[SlateGray]

Quote

Originally posted by ensign14
Crawling up the general public's arse is one thing, talking out of one's own is another.

The voice of experience?

[AyePirate]

Quote

Originally posted by Arion
Just read the rest of the interview, I wonder what MA is telling Marco, he seems to think people in F1 have something against a Andretti.

Marco Andretti tested a Honda F1 car in 2006, but he isn't willing to make the jump unless it is with a team that can win. He believes the F1 establishment wants him to fail, too.

"I don't have any other mentality other than to go over there and win," Andretti said. "Because I think it's a bigger story if I go over there and fail, really. It really is. Because that's what people are waiting for, to be honest, over there."

I think his grandpa would tell him to shut his pie hole.

[wati]

Quote

Originally posted by Vitesse2

While Ayrton produced miracles with the Ford HB-engined McLaren, winning five races in a dog of a car which had no right to be at the front,

The 1993 McLaren was a very good chassis, it was far from being a dog. Underpowered yes, but it was a great handling package.

[JacnGille]

Will we hear the second most famous words in racin ("Gentlemen start you engines" bein first) :
...Andretti is slowing on the backstretch

[Juan Kerr]

Quote

Originally posted by wati


The 1993 McLaren was a very good chassis, it was far from being a dog. Underpowered yes, but it was a great handling package.

I'm not so sure actually, its more likely that Ayrton found the right setup solution of the equipment he was given as per usual but could not obviously fix the engine.

[Elspeth]

The Andrettis are the biggest bunch of whiners I have ever seen and heard.

Michael didn't want to live in Europe so he only had limited testing time due to his own choice. I don't think he had much of a commitment, and I think he expected everyone to make way for him because he was an Andretti.

All Michael has ever done is whine about everything. I guess he raised his son to be the same way.

Mario accomplished alot in racing; he's the only Andretti worth his salt.

[BMW_F1]

Quote

Originally posted by AyePirate


I think his grandpa would tell him to shut his pie hole.

grandpa has told his son to send his son only if he is fully prepared and ready, (like he ain't yet) . other than that fuggedaboutit

[bogi]

Quote

Originally posted by Josta


So not only has he stuck 2 fingers up at McLaren, (currently one of only 2 teams that are winning), he is saying Honda are **** so not worth a look. If ever there was a bigger act of shooting yourself in the foot in the quest to F1, I haven't heard of it.

Adretti jr jr is an idiot (if he wants F1 seat after this comments).

[StefanV]

"Good enough or F1". Or not. One thing that has to be remembered is that not many of the F1 rejects go on to a great career in other series. Well, at least they will not dominate. A "reject" does not mean they was a complete failure in F1, just that they where good enough to get a contract on driving skills alone. Would Marco do worse than Scott Speed? Worse than Piquet Jr? Had Michael been kicked out of a tail end team?

The difference between the top drivers are small, incredibly small, and the assistance they get from the team makes all the difference.

That said, Michael was never going to be a top driver and that is the real reason he lost his seat. He was good, but not good enough to receive the support he needed to perform decently.

[Fatgadget]

It was funny watching Michael Andretti then... just as it is funny watching Nelson Piquet jr today. LOL.

Just because your dad was good it doesn't mean you too will be.

[random]

Quote

Originally posted by jdanton
Speed was at least professional in his endeavors in F1. Micheal's Concorde hopping didn't do him any favors with the team I'm sure.

Those here who are saying he wasn't quick are crazy. He sucked in F1, but it was due to his ego and thinking he could live in the US. He wasn't professional about F1, and I don't think anyone, especially in the 90s and onward, had enough talent to just show up and drive.

Exactly right.

By the mid 1980's, the "show up and drive" era of the sport was gone. The top drivers of that era had to be fit and completely dedicated to Formula One. The revolution in driver professionalism happened half a decade before Michael Andretti arrived. There have been incremental improvements since then, but nothing like the revolution of the '80s. Commuting to F1 from the US is just as unimaginable then as it would be today.

Regarding Michael's tenure at McLaren. Many of us here probably have a much clearer and much less biased recollection of the events than does Micro Andretti. The facts are not on Micro's side.

Michael Andretti was a very good driver, but he DID take the Concorde back to the US after most races. He lived in Pennsylvania and commuted to Formula One. This single factor displayed a clear lack of dedication. If McLaren questioned his motivation and dedication, there is little wonder why they did so. Had Michael been willing to become more integrated with McLaren, he doubtless would have had a more successful F1 career.

[Ivan]

Random,
Good post.
I remember the '93 season well. Because I had two of my favourite drivers at the same team. Michael blew his chance at being a better F1 driver by not living in Europe. He did have pre-divorce issues with his then wife and that may have had a lot to do with him staying in the USA. Also Michael hardly tested his car, Mika did most of it and his debriefs were over the phone from the US. I posted a MacLaren documentary that I found on YouTube on here somewhere, and it shows how lost he is...talking on the phone with his engineer and he can't tell him what he wants on the car. Another thing that was happening at MacLaren was they had a new car with Active Ride and it kept acting up even giving Senna problems.

Marco is talking out of his ARSE.

[AyePirate]

Quote

Originally posted by BMW_F1


grandpa has told his son to send his son only if he is fully prepared and ready, (like he ain't yet) . other than that fuggedaboutit

Right and joining daddy's IRL team was not amongst Mario's prep. suggestions (IIRC GP2 and Champ Car).

[Ivan]

If Marco really wanted to rave F1, he would have been in GP2 last year!
He took the easy way out and is driving for daddy's team.

[Knuckles]

Quote

Originally posted by Tolyngee


Senna actually gave the gift of a win at the 1991 GP of Japan to his teammate Berger...

I can assure you Senna liked Berger... So, I'll assume you forgot about Berger...

Berger always said the was the one who made Senna open up, and his (often hilarious) (somewhat auto-)biography has many great stories that illustrate this.

[VoidNT]

Quote

Originally posted by JensonWDC
There wasn´t a FIA man in the McLaren garage last year at brazil for nothing, you know...

McLaren, what an evil team They're cheating, they're spying, they're methodically destroying its driver's careers, they're headed by the bald and most dishonest man on the Earth, they're living in a Black Star and they're changing their place in the paddock all the time!

The FIA should install a permanent supervisor at McLaren. Max Mosley would be a perfect candidate after he sacked from his current job.

[VoidNT]

Quote

Originally posted by Ben


Once again the BBC is your friend. A test session heavily featured in one show has Andretti and Hakinnen at Silverstone whilst Senna is sunning himself in Portugal.

Ironically at this test Hakinnen was slower than Andretti and Mika looked like the spoiled brat. Pat Fry and Geigio Ascanelli are filmed debating whether they have a "car problem" or whether Mika's had a "Brain failure"

Once again - hardly the sort of thing you display to the world if you're conspiring against Andretti and think Mika can do no wrong.

Ben

That was a great series. Just imagine if McLaren would have made something similar in 2007, this would be an absolute cracker.

BTW, just watched 1991 Indy 500, before the start there was a shot from the pits where Mario and Michael were chatting with young-looking Ron Dennis, whom the American commentators were unable to recognize

Marco is obviously not very clever young man.

[Jerome]

You know, the story of McLaren and Michael Andretti is like a lovestory with a bad ending. Two people start a marriage, and it goes sour. In these situations, with very few exceptions, it takes two to tango - or to make the tango fail. If you have two sensible persons in a failed marriage, they will both understand that they both made the marriage fail. If one of them, or both are immature, they will blame the other one. 'He' showed no respect, 'she' always nagged.

Whatever the details of a marriage are or were, you know that if one of the jilted lovers talks about 'sabotage and abuse', you know that he or she is not recognising his or her own part in the failure.

I sincerely wish that Marco one day will acquire enough wisdom to avoid the mistakes his father made. And I am not talking about signing with McLaren or crashing into an ambulance. No, I am talking about the fact that Michael obviously never learned to ask: what did I do to make the bad things happen in my life?

And....









....I really would like to see what Mario Andretti would say about this. I just can't imagine him being as childish like Michael, whom I blame more for this story than Marco. Marco is just projecting the stories told by his father)

[Ligier26]

Quote

Originally posted by Jerome
....I really would like to see what Mario Andretti would say about this. I just can't imagine him being as childish like Michael, whom I blame more for this story than Marco. Marco is just projecting the stories told by his father)

Marco: "Daddy, some of the guys from Yerp say that McLaren are, like, one of only a coupla teams that ever win in Formula One. Now they'll never sign me up... I really screwed up shoutin' off my mouth like that".

Michael: "Don't worry son, I'll get your grandaddy to call up his old buddy Colin Chapman... he'll give you a drive at Lotus".

[Go_Scotty_Go!]

Quote

Originally posted by Elspeth
The Andrettis are the biggest bunch of whiners I have ever seen and heard.

Michael didn't want to live in Europe so he only had limited testing time due to his own choice. I don't think he had much of a commitment, and I think he expected everyone to make way for him because he was an Andretti.

All Michael has ever done is whine about everything. I guess he raised his son to be the same way.

Mario accomplished alot in racing; he's the only Andretti worth his salt.

It really is true - I have tremendous respect for Mario - pound for pound, he's one of the greatest, if not the greatest, race car driver ever. Certainly the most accomplished, he won in everything.

It really is sad to read about what Michael and Marco think about 1993, because its all very well documented, there is no mystery there. The sabatoge allegation in Marco's comments is just very sad...it taints the Andretti name...

Very very sad and pathetic young Marco. What a putz you are.

[BMW_F1]

Quote

Originally posted by Go_Scotty_Go!


Very very sad and pathetic young Marco. What a putz you are.

he is probably trying to divert the public from the fact that Danica is a better race car driver than him.

[Dudley]

Quote

Originally posted by Josta


Andrea Moda and Perry McCarthy.

He said "Multi" million.;) I'd be surprised if Moda spent 1.

[Ghostrider]

That some people still believe that teams by purpose make one of their cars slower is beyond my understanding....

This Marco Andretti just sounds stupid or at least very uninformed.

[EvilPhil II]

Quote

Originally posted by Ghostrider
This Marco Andretti just sounds stupid or at least very uninformed.

thats... 'ill-informed'

[LB]

Quote

Originally posted by Dudley


He said "Multi" million.;) I'd be surprised if Moda spent 1.

Post 66 *cough*

;)

[Chui]

Sour grapes that the kid didn't pick.

Michael was simultaneously undergoing a horrible divorce and wasn't focused very well at all (and who would be?) - not that he'd have had anything on Ayrton. But he was surely better than he showed.

That article is utter bollocks...

[FastMex]

Quote

Originally posted by GT Racing Online Magazine
That's complete cack. I mean it's his dad, ok, the guy who he probably sees as his nr.1 hero, but come on... what was Marco at the time 5 years old? it is not as if he has some insight into what went on...

I don't even want to go there but Marco should ask his mom how she contributed to the downfall of Andretti's grace in the McLaren garage...

Pedro Rodriguez... great avatar!

[Jackie]

Can I please just stick up for Sandra Andretti for a moment? She is a lovely lady. I wouldn't like to be judged (or have my son judged) by my actions from many years ago and I don't think Sandra should be either - especially in a public forum.

Thank you!

[Vilenova]

Michael Andretti was an excellent driver in his day but you can't just arrive and drive an F1 car.

[AyePirate]

Quote

Originally posted by BMW_F1


Danica is a better race car driver than him.

The facts do not seem to reflect your perception. Danica hype machine, anyone?;) Marco's lower formula performances were fairly impressive. He actually won races, Danica's lower formula career netted zero wins. Danica's sole race win at Motegi came from on fuel strategy not by being quickest. Marco won on a road course by being faster than everyone else. Never has an athlete gotten more attention based on less merit. Imagine the acclaim of Tiger Woods, then subtract all of the Grand Slam event victories, all the tournament wins except for one- this gives you an approximation of the CV of Danica Patrick

Marco and Danica are running neck and neck in the petulant-brat-throws-their-toys-around-the-pram-when-things-don't-go-my-way dept. though ;)

Too bad Indy 500 Winners have to go on a Ballroom Dancing show to get as much attention as these two.

[David M. Kane]

Has anyone asked Tony Kanaan what he thinks of all of this?

[HDonaldCapps]

Quote

Originally posted by Jackie
Can I please just stick up for Sandra Andretti for a moment? She is a lovely lady. I wouldn't like to be judged (or have my son judged) by my actions from many years ago and I don't think Sandra should be either - especially in a public forum.

Thank you!

Jackie, Always remember that this is simply an internet forum where 14 year olds -- those either physically 14 or who stopped developing intellectually beyond the age of a 14 year old -- mouth off with opinions or deliver ad hominum swipes at any and everyone they wish while hiding behind the cloak of anonymity. In other words, about 95-99% of whatever is posted here in this forum is utter hogwash and complete tripe and should be viewed in that light. Few here have ever met Sandy Andretti or have any clue as to her views on those days. Then again, I would venture that few here would even be interested, their minds already being made up long before they posted a single item.

[Jackie]

Thank you Don. You're right.

[Go_Scotty_Go!]

Quote

Originally posted by HDonaldCapps


Jackie, Always remember that this is simply an internet forum where 14 year olds -- those either physically 14 or who stopped developing intellectually beyond the age of a 14 year old -- mouth off with opinions or deliver ad hominum swipes at any and everyone they wish while hiding behind the cloak of anonymity. In other words, about 95-99% of whatever is posted here in this forum is utter hogwash and complete tripe and should be viewed in that light. Few here have ever met Sandy Andretti or have any clue as to her views on those days. Then again, I would venture that few here would even be interested, their minds already being made up long before they posted a single item.

Lets hear your defense of Marco's comments then jackass...all you ever do is make sweeping insults of everyone here - you're just an ass...

[Elspeth]

Hey Don Capps! I don't post here in RC very often, but it is nice to see your name again.

[HDonaldCapps]

Quote

Originally posted by Jackie
Thank you Don. You're right.

However, in all fairness, I will state very clearly for The Record that the five or so percent mentioned can be really, really worth the trouble and irritation. The problem is that most of the time it is "Fire, Ready, Aim!" since people are bubbling over to say something on the forum.

[Aquarius]

Quote

Originally posted by AyePirate

...Danica's sole race win at Motegi came from on fuel strategy not by being quickest....

I'm sorry, but I just wanted to say that winning on fuel strategy does not make her win any less worthy. She was there when it mattered and beat all her rivals to the finish line fair and square. Jean Alesi's first (and only) win also came at the expense of Schumacher's misfortune, but the point is that he was in position to capitalize on that. Lots of drivers (together with their teams) have won races by being more cunning than all the rest rather than by being all-out faster (Schumacher and Benetton in 1995 spring to mind) and it was a deserved victory. I'm not a victim of the "Danica hype machine" (the IndyCar series gets no coverage in Estonia, the Indy 500 was never mentioned in our local news outlets), I just think it's not fair to discredit her victory. As for her being petulant etc, that's another story.

As for Marco's comments about his father, I also think his comments are hardly objective and I for one cannot take them seriously. He obviously has a close bond with Michael and it's obvious he'll defend him. As far as I can see, Michael didn't take F1 seriously enough and was ignorant to assume he would be able to jump into an F1 car and be quick straight away. And I seriously doubt McLaren knowingly sabotaged him - they are a proud team and their main goal surely was to get as many points as possible. Why would a team with such a history and pride willingly sabotage their own drivers? I'd be willing to understand they grew tired of Michael's attitude towards F1 racing, but that's hardly an excuse. A team can only do so much. It was very much Ayrton's team in those days and they may have focused more on him, but I doubt they willingly made Michael look as bad as he did. Both parties should accept some of the blame, I think.

[Der Pate]

As far as I remember the 1993-season Michael Andretti came to F1 without too much testing...it wasn´t that the team wouldn´t have given him the time, but Andretti had the "problem" of time, because he travelled from Europe to USA and back the whole time...

I heard that Andretti´s biggest problem in F1 was braking...maybe therefore he finished the first races in crashes in the first laps...

I´m pretty certain, that Andretti did not receive the same material like Senna...but McLaren wouldn´t given him inferior material...never...

And the "fairy-tale" about Monza...if Andretti really received the same material like Senna for the first time, Andretti still lost 1,3 seconds to Senna...and he only became third, because there were so many DNF of the front-runners...

[BuzzingHornet]

Andretti wasn't that bad. But maybe he didn't apply himself as fully as he could, and with drivers like that, McLaren is probably the least supportive team on the grid. When you know your driver is coming up short and you've only got one set of development parts, its going on Senna's car basically.

Monza is also an 'easy' track to look good on historically. Its a power track and the better cars always shine there. Didn't Zanardi have a great race there once too, after underpeforming all year in the Williams? And not to take the shine off Vettel's amazing win, he didn't do that at any other track. The Ferrari engine on a power circuit had a little to do with it too.

And if I was going to be sacreligious I would perhaps throw Jim Clark 1967 into the mix too... god-like genius yes, but he had a great car that day. He must have... the track didn't have any corners to speak of, and still doesnt

McLaren are a cold hearted bunch of bastards though I respect them but don't like them.

[ehagar]

What Marco said is no different than what Mario or Michael have said. The truth probably lies somewhere in between what McLaren and the Andretti's position. I vaguely recall something to the effect of Michael not being paid for a while (a couple months?!?), is that true?