109 replies to this topic

[sandy]

If mention has been made of this book previously then sorry about bringing it up again, but I have just found a copy today and did not know it was in print. It is called The Hill, the Drivers, the Cars - A History of Rob Roy Hillclimb 1937 - 1961. I first went to Rob Roy, on the outskirts of Melbourne, in the late 50's, by hitch-hiking as being in my mid teens I couldn't have a car and there was no public transport. Rob Roy was the friendliest of race meetings and you really could mingle with the competitors and enjoy and be part of the whole atmosphere of the event. The competition was fierce and all of the great local drivers of the time would attend and have a go. The book provides great year by year coverage with plenty of good photos - 1907 18 litre Mercedes; 38 / 250 Mercedes Benz; K3s, Altas, Bugattis etc galore; the Maybach Special is featured; and of course plenty of Specials.

Author: Leon Sims. First published 2005 by Research Publications. Retail from Tony Johns Books, Melbourne. Hard cover and 312 pages.

Fascinating and a good fun read.

[Derek Pitt]

Melbourne Cup Day November 1960

FTD and new course record - G. W. Patterson T51 Cooper Climax 1960cc ...

Now, to see Bill Patterson, coming up to his Gold star Year, attack that hill in his GP Cooper would have been worth the hitch-hike !

Derek

[Ray Bell]

I believe you were not alone hitch hiking out there...

My memory tells me that Peter Brock did the same.

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt
Melbourne Cup Day November 1960

FTD and new course record - G. W. Patterson T51 Cooper Climax 1960cc ...

Now, to see Bill Patterson, coming up to his Gold star Year, attack that hill in his GP Cooper would have been worth the hitch-hike !

Derek

is he still alive?

[Derek Pitt]

As far as I am aware Bill Patterson is still alive..he certainly was about 3 years ago.

Those who never saw him with the red mist lowered missed a treat....a total tiger, fearless and very very fast.

If you have Youtube, search for Fangio, then watch Fangio Brabham 1978, and you will se Bill Patterson in action, albeit 13 years after he retired. The commentator makes comment and it can be seen that Patto had lost none of his old tiger.

Derek

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt
As far as I am aware Bill Patterson is still alive..he certainly was about 3 years ago.

Those who never saw him with the red mist lowered missed a treat....a total tiger, fearless and very very fast.

If you have Youtube, search for Fangio, then watch Fangio Brabham 1978, and you will se Bill Patterson in action, albeit 13 years after he retired. The commentator makes comment and it can be seen that Patto had lost none of his old tiger.

Derek

just wondered,for years he had a pleasure boat down at the St Kilda marina.
Does he still own the Holden dealership?

[Ray Bell]

Bill is a shadow of his former self...

After the court case, which released him (as an 82 year old in frail health) in the care of his wife rather than incarcerate him, he had almost nothing left. He'd sold the dealerships years earlier, gone into a little air service to the Bass Strait islands that lost a bundle and went bad and had very little left.

A few years ago he bucked himself up when he was able to buy a Commodore ute to drive around.

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Bill is a shadow of his former self...

After the court case, which released him (as an 82 year old in frail health) in the care of his wife rather than incarcerate him, he had almost nothing left. He'd sold the dealerships years earlier, gone into a little air service to the Bass Strait islands that lost a bundle and went bad and had very little left.

A few years ago he bucked himself up when he was able to buy a Commodore ute to drive around.

what was the court case over?

[Ray Bell]

I'm not totally sure, but it was something similar to Pete Geoghegan's episode...

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
I'm not totally sure, but it was something similar to Pete Geoghegan's episode...

oh yep,it was well known at the St Kilda marina.

[Ray Bell]

Speaking of Patto and Rob Roy... he didn't start out there in a Formula 1 Cooper...



And I have a couple of other Rob Roy pics:

This car I don't know, but it looks very neat:


This is Peter Manton in the Campbell McLaren (ex-Harry Beith) Terraplane, November 1948, looking pretty active too:


Frank Kleinig on his record run in the Hudson Special in 1948:


From memory, all of those photos were given to me by Campbell McLaren. Maybe not the Kleinig pic.

[Dick Willis]

Is car no 30 the JSR ?

[Ray Bell]

I simply don't know, Dick... I just scanned it out of Campbell McLaren's album...

But it does look like it has the proportions of a TC, don't you think? Engine placement, carbies on the right, that sort of thing.

[Dick Willis]

If I could find a pic of the JSR I would know, I saw a write up of it in a mag some time ago but can't remember which mag, old timer's disease !

[sandy]

Here is a photo of Bill at Fishermna's Bend mid to late sixties

[sandy]

I mean mid to late fifties.

[sandy]

And what is that car beside the Minor, Humber Snipe or Hawk?

[Derek Pitt]

Same car, same hill, different driver - circa 1992




Derek

[Derek Pitt]

Sandy,

Is Super Snipe.......Mk3

Derek

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt
Sandy,

Is Super Snipe.......Mk3

Derek

its a MK4.

[Derek Pitt]

Unknown open wheeler climbing the hill...i havent got a clue who or what it is though..anybody have any ideas?




Derek

[Lola5000]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt
Unknown open wheeler climbing the hill...i havent got a clue who or what it is though..anybody have any ideas?




Derek

Leo Bates.

[Derek Pitt]

A Cooper Bristol on the hill..

[sandy]

I saw an interesting thing at Rob Roy which is where the timing device consisted of two contacts on the end of a pole which was placed under the front wheel and as the wheel moved over it the contacts were compressed onto each other thus starting the time sequence.

On this particular occasion the car was a front wheel drive Citroen and the spinnng wheels tore up the pole and contacts and threw them across the track. Consternation at first then hilarity.

[Ray Bell]

Yes, the old 'hockey stick' gave rise to those issues...

But just imagine what it was like for someone holding one of those when Paul England's 4WD Ausca came up to the line!

[Wilyman]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt
A Cooper Bristol on the hill..

The Cooper Bristol was a racing car to be sat on not in. Mike Hawthorn an example as was Syd Negus at Caversham.

I got to see a gaggle of Cooper Bristols in action at Silverstone in 1983. The drivers "all arms 'n elbows" with the transverse springs all wound up translating to odd wheel angles. Magic.

[Derek Pitt]

yes Wilyman,

The lack of driver protection of which you speak and as evidenced by that photograph really is quite scary !

They were brave guys

Derek

[Derek Pitt]

A rare sight at Rob Roy - a genuine Tasman car with a famous driver - unfortunately the nose cone did not like the sudden changes in vertical alignment of the roadway!!





Derek

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Derek Pitt

Now there's a photo that needs a caption!

[Dick Willis]

I ran at Rob Roy last year and was adised to remove the nose lest it be wiped off in the dip which turned out to be good advice but it didn't do anything for the appearance of the car.

[Derek Pitt]

Dick,

That Brabahm would be a potential FTD on slicks at Rob Roy would it not?


Derek

[Dick Willis]

It was Derek, just managed FTD but in retrospect it would have been even quicker if I had wound up the suspension from its circuit setup ( it had been to Phillip Island the previous weekend ) it was bottoming fairly badly over the dip so just as well the nose was off or it would have been ripped off.

[bradbury west]

There are 22 photos of cars at Rob Roy from 1946 to 1947 on e bay being sold by a trader russtygold. I lost the link but just googled Rob Roy on e bay to get them back. I cannot post the link
Roger Lund

[Ian G]

I found a Badge and a Book,photos didn't show.....

 

http://www.ebay.com....iPIjjVutRGaumuQ

 

http://www.ebay.com....VMAAOSwcBhWXCr9

 

Edit...found one...

 

http://www.ebay.com....3YAAOSwwbdWHHtg

Edited by Ian G, 11 December 2015 - 10:52.

[bradbury west]

Ian , pls see PM as I have sent a link to the  listings

Roger

 

Edit

 

It is very interesting to see  Lynden Duckett in 1946 in the  18ltr 1909 Mercedes. I assume that that car's subsequent history is well known, or do we have the prospect of another "discovery"?.

Edited by bradbury west, 11 December 2015 - 12:58.

[Ian G]

Thanks Roger,link works,that guy certainly has some varied photos/gear for sale.

 

http://www.ebay.com....=p2047675.m4096

[cooper997]

Many, if not all of those Rob Roy photos would have appeared in period AMS reports. Might be a little early to be Dacre Stubbs photos, other TNF members might confirm this one way or the other.

 

The Duckett Mercedes photo appears (slightly cropped) in the July 46 issue's report of the June (King's Birthday W/E) Rob Roy #10. The original caption mentions the car was owned by Lyndon's sister, Beverley. In the July 47 AMS, there's a Bob Shepherd illustration and feature of the car.

 

John Blanden's 'Historic Racing Cars in Australia' (1979 version) mentions that the car was sold in the 1960s and left Australia, beleived to the USA.  I don't know whether the later version of his book covers this car.

 

Some of the knowledgable enthusiasts from here might be of help http://vintagesportscarclub.org.au/

 

Also note that those ebay links will only have a short lifespan, unless someone wishes to somehow save the photos for future TNF reference.

 

Stephen

[Ray Bell]

What about this one?

http://www.ebay.com....CUAAOSwwbdWHHtl

Is that really an MG NE?

Great find, Roger, I'm going to do some checking about some of these cars, the one dubbed as an A-model doesn't appear to me to have an A-model front axle so it might not be so archaic.

[john medley]

Innis Special, based on ex Doug Shepherd Frazer Nash which then became the two supercharger Mackellar Ford 4. These days owned by Quinn family

[fnqvmuch]

Some were familiar from the state library of victoria - from whence copies may be downloaded - i.e.; 

http://search.slv.vi...tution=SLVPRIMO

Edited by fnqvmuch, 13 December 2015 - 00:50.

[Catalina Park]

There are some Ebay sellers that are stealing photos from online archives and passing them off as their own work. I don't know if that is the case here but it sure smells like it to me.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by fnqvmuch
Some were familiar from the State Library of Victoria - from whence copies may be downloaded - i.e.; 
http://search.slv.vi...tution=SLVPRIMO

Thanks for the link and the information...

I note that the ones I've looked at there are out of copyright, so there's nothing to stop us posting them here. Nor to stop our eBay seller printing them up and selling them.

Then again, we can download and print them ourselves, so his efforts should go for nought. We should thank him, though, he drew our attention to them.





.

Edited by Ray Bell, 13 December 2015 - 22:14.

[Ray Bell]

Innis Special, based on ex Doug Shepherd Frazer Nash which then became the two supercharger Mackellar Ford 4. These days owned by Quinn family

Thank you, John... presumably this is Reg Nutt driving?



The other nice thing about downloading from the library website is that there aren't an marks over the pics!

I did think it might be a Frazer-Nash because of the bodywork near the rear axle. But this car sports regular transmission by virtue of its Vauxhall 30/98 gearbox and shortened Hudson rear end, the chassis and front end are Frazer-Nash while the engine is a Fronty Ford.

[john medley]

John Crouch driving at Rob Roy. I have pics of RB Pritchett driving it at a Sydney airstrip meeting, plus earlier pics, before it became the Innis (or Innes) single seater, in two seat form at Bathurst hillclimb 1946 and Bathurst circuit 1938

[Ray Bell]

As you know, John, spelling inconsistencies are rife in issue of AMS of that era...

The specific story about that car, from the AMS March 1947, has the name as 'Innis' in its heading and in the story while later event reports have it spelled 'Innes'.

[cooper997]

For Rob Roy #14 held in November 1947 the programme entry has the following.

 

Class up to 3000cc Racing

32 J F Crouch, MacInnes

 

Earlier reference to the #36 Ford A Model ebay photo, would probably make this car the A O'Connor Ford A listed in the July 46 AMS report/results for Rob Roy #10.

 

Stephen

[GMACKIE]

After Reg Nutt rebuilt the Frazer-Nash as a single-seater, it was known as the Innis Special.

 

Not sure if it matters. but George Innes was the Sydney agent for Vauxhall, before Boyd Edkins.

[cooper997]

The Rob Roy 80th anniversary event was run yesterday by the MGCC. I spent more time chatting that taking snaps.

 

Also worth noting is that the property Rob Roy sits on could soon be on the market. Potentially putting the Hillclimb at risk of non-motorsport friendly type acquiring it. Let's hope the MGCC can secure its future.

 

Worth a look back into Rob Roy history 

June 1953 film here

 

and in beautiful living colour for June 1955s meeting

https://www.youtube....h?v=yCPaneiC7mo

 

Stephen

[SJ Lambert]

[SJ Lambert]