255 replies to this topic

[Slartibartfast]

Fatality, on Sep 19 2009, 10:04, said:

Because its the same driver, so the same reference point. You are comparing both Massa and Alonso to the same Fisichella reference, so we can make a comparision. Do you know what comparison means? How can you compare telemetry taken from different cars and regulations? What are you comparing? in relation to what? You cant. I know you said you can but you didnt give any reasoning.

I notice the only people who dont agree with cross team mate comparisions are the ones who dont like the results.

If your method had any validity then any given pair of drivers would have the same margin between them at every race, let alone every season. This is demonstrably not so.

[Headspin]

I know you've explained it before but don't remember it so could you please tell us how JV - HHF - JH comparison went? I also noticed you didn't touch the FA - JT - RS - JPM - KR. Why?

[grunge]

Fatality, on Sep 19 2009, 11:05, said:

, so im not sure what hughes is even reffering to when he talks of 'devasting high speed precision'.

he's talking about kimi's unmatched fast corner speed which is well known all over the oaddock...his telemtries at pouhon each year are practically unmatched.

from an old 2002 article

Quote

But Raikonen’s style is rather different form Schuey’s in the faster stuff. He’s more conventional, tending to use later, more geometrically correct lines. He doesn’t much use his slow corner braking induced axis pivoting technique on faster corners, unlike Schuey.

Instead, he uses his superb feel for flicking the car into the side zone early and balancing there for the rest of the turn. This is incredibly difficult to do in an era where the grip drops off dramatically at a fairly small tyre slip angle. The oversteer has to be shallow, but consistent, requiring phenomenal balance and feel. He lives in a red-tinted oversteer world that is completely natural to him, very like his predecessor, Mika Hakkinen. As a consequence of this and their similar Scandinavian emotion-free approach, they are similarly immune from pressure.

On fast corners, Schumacher keeps his car on the edge from turn in to apex by his long and precise trade-off between braking and cornering force – just as Kimi does on slower corners. But on faster turns. The Finn’s trade-off from a later turn in is more sudden, demanding more of his car control – which never lets him down. He will deliberately take entry speeds that induce a tail slide, then surf his way through.

This contrasts with Juan Pablo Montoya who, from a similar turn in point, doesn’t induce a slide, but will take just enough in so that the car is on the very edge. Inevitably it sometimes goes over and it’s then that JPM’s famed reaction save will come into play; his car control is used to bring the car back from sudden, catastrophic lack of grip.

Raikkonen induces the rear into the slide earlier, losing some time there perhaps, but trying to make up for it by balancing that tightrope for longer. Raikkonen’s lateral G traces on the telemetry will probably be less spiky than JPM’s, with lower peaks but higher lows."

[RodrigoL]

"He doesn’t much use his slow corner braking induced axis pivoting technique on faster corners, unlike Schuey."

Now that's a sentence and a half

[grunge]

RodrigoL, on Sep 19 2009, 15:39, said:

"He doesn’t much use his slow corner braking induced axis pivoting technique on faster corners, unlike Schuey."

Now that's a sentence and a half

from the same article

"

Quote

Car control is at the heart of Kimi Raikkonen’s prowess. Lots of drivers have had great car control, but it’s the way that he uses it that marks him out. It has allowed him to adopt a highly spectacular style – well suited to the grooved tyre / traction control era – while having one of the very lowest incident rates of all. He hardly ever goes off, despite frequently appearing to be on the verge of doing so.

His slow corner technique is highly distinctive. He is brilliant at inducing a controlled rear end slide with the brakes, getting it so that the momentum is just right; not so small that it becomes a time-consuming twitch, not so big that it delays being able to get on the throttle. Typically the slide will be just melting away as the apex is reached and the axis of the car will now be perfectly in line with the corner, enabling him to get fully on the power when other drivers are still scrabbling out wide, waiting.

The technique is similar to that employed by Michael Schumacher, which these days tends to be less visible, because the Ferrari’s trick transmission seems to take care of much of that

[Spunout]

Headspin, on Sep 19 2009, 11:10, said:

I know you've explained it before but don't remember it so could you please tell us how JV - HHF - JH comparison went? I also noticed you didn't touch the FA - JT - RS - JPM - KR. Why?

I think Arrow did accept rookies and "old" drivers counting as exceptions - thus, explaining JV-HHF-Hill case. Obviously, he doesn´t use the rookie card for Alonso vs Hamilton in 2007.