21 replies to this topic

[island]

Hi!
He looked strong in the blue ex-Allen T300
early in 1972 and even led Matich at the
Oran Park Gold Star. Just a competent driver
or in the Matich class? Who saw him race?

[Ray Bell]

Well, I guess you could say I saw him race. He was in one of those CB Vees I mentioned somewhere, and he did fairly well. Then he got a Rennmax ANF2 car, then upgraded it with an FPF and then a Waggott engine. One day I was watching him at Warwick Farm timing Max Stewart in a Rennmax with a Waggott engine. Suddenly I realised this bloke was into the big time.
He then bought the Mildren 'yellow submarine' and ran it for a while, but he was always playing catch-up until he got the Lola T300 Niel had crashed. It was beyond him financially, but his wife helped out at times (once he gave her a sheepish look at Calder and instantly a spare diff was purchased from the Warwick Brown spares!).
He didn't score many wins, that Oran Park Diamond Trophy race being a stand-out, but the other players all knew he was on the circuit and a serious contender.
He faded away and still sells cars on Parramatta Road as far as I know.

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[Ray Bell]

I think it's time to expand on this subject...

One reason I feel that is because this photo reminded me of his tigerish attitude:



Thanks for that, Lynton!

Greg Mackie might add something about Bob's introduction to racing in the Cee Bee (nee Rennmax) Formula Vee. Was that in 1965 or 1966?

Just thinking about the many cars he's run, there was the Rennmax I incorrectly remembered above as fitted with a twink first up, but in fact it had the 2.5-litre FPF in it, then the Waggott TC4V, but did he go straight to that from the Vee?

He raced the Mildren monocoque 'Yellow Submarine', the Terry Quartly-owned Lotus 32, and also Terry's Rennmax BN7, but that was interspersed with F5000s like the Lola T300, a few drives in the Matich, I think there was a T330 in America, the Birrana 274 belonging to Bob and Marj Brown which took him to England to race for a while.

Later he had an XD Falcon touring car. Have I missed many?

I think I'll have to make a few phone calls to Bob to give more credibility to all of this, but in the meantime, please add your recollections...

[john winfield]

I'm sure Motoring News ran a short profile of Bob, maybe during his 1975 Formula Atlantic season in GB, maybe earlier. Anyway, I can't find it. I saw him a couple of times in '75 - he sometimes qualified quite well in the Birrana but, looking at Allen's site, he rarely finished. Allen has the car down as a 273 but I wouldn't know whether that differs substantially from a 274.

[Dale Harvey]

He also raced a Lotus 23B. Yellow in colour.

Dale.

[TerryS]

I believe the blue Lola T300 he ran was probably the most beautiful F5000. It looked magnificent. Prepared by Reg Papps and Sons.

In recent years he was running a Reynard F3 fitted with a Lexus V8.

He is now 78.

[eldougo]

A couple of people i meet in Europe mentioned his name when we talked about my country of origin .Both driver were impressed with BobMuir driving during his short stint on the other side of the world.

He was one of many Aussie driver s to have a go in the BIG time,at least he did not sit at home and wonder what could have happened ,like others out here.

[john medley]

I thought he was terrific.

Two oblique stories: 1971 my first race meeting Warwick Farm in the misfiring Morris Austin shortly after the dyno man said laconically "she wont wheel stand on me dyno will she, mate?" I retired hurt to the shower, where Bob Muir was showering himself. I am somewhat larger. I decided then that half his performance surely came from power-to-weight advantages. I was probably wrong on that, too.

                                One of the Army Falcon spanner guys told me that small BM was very quick at Oran Park practice , piquing large co-driver Ian Geoghegan's even quicker response and "F-f-f-f-fat blokes can be quick, too"

[Ray Bell]

Dale, thanks for that...

I did neglect the 23B, ex-Niel Allen as well, which he drove between the Vee and the Rennmax. Denis Geary had bought it from Niel and raced it a few times before crashing it, Bob bought the wreck in June, 1967.

And, of course, he took it to what must have been his second home, Rennmax Engineering's little lean-to shed in a Croydon Park backyard for repairs.

He raced it under his own name until early 1969, increasing the size of the engine to 1860cc along the way. He then sold it to Derry George and continued to drive it, sharing the car with Peter Larner.

[Ray Bell]

Bob's racing interest began with his father...

He grew up in Central Western NSW and his father competed in the RedEx Trial and a multitude of other events. And he built Ford V8 engines for competitors at Bathurst.

So got to go to Bathurst as a youngster and it's natural that his interest developed from there.

Some time in the early sixties he bought a Sprite to race. "I was in a Le Mans start race at Catalina Park, my first race," he told me, "and I was about twentieth in the line-up. So I ran to the car, it started first shot and I was third as I headed for the first corner."

What came next belies the spirit of the Bob Muir we were to see racing just a year or two later.

"I got to the braking area with all these faster cars bearing down on me and said to myself, 'What do I do next?'. I ---- myself and let them all past!"

After that he ran the car in a hillclimb or two, but then he learned it was heavily encumbered and he had to part with it - and a lot of his own money as well.

"It took me a long time to get back on top," he says. But he had a used car yard at Greenacre and made it back into the black. "Then I was talking to John Harvey one day and he told me about this new Formula Vee class that was starting up. He took me to meet Bruce Burr and I liked it, so I went to Bob Britton's place day after day and watched as the car was built."

He reckons that it would have taken a lot longer if he hadn't been there, with Stan Smith and Britton working to keep up with orders and car repairs, but eventually the second Cee Bee Vee was on the track.

"But it wasn't any good until I fitted a compensator bar," Bob recalls. "Jack Bono was winning everything in those early Vee days and he kept telling me I'd get nowhere until I put a compensator bar on the car."

The design of the Rennmax didn't lend itself to that, but Bob worked out a way and took the car to Oran Park for a test run. "I found three seconds a lap!" he recalls.

"That's what got me interested in chassis tuning the cars..."

[Lola5000]

Did he also do the 1986 Bathurst 1,000 with John Goss in a Citi bank sponsored Jaguar XJS ,perhaps the old Goss group C car converted to Group A,which I think Goss still owns made out in the TWR winning colours of 1985?

[ellrosso]

Thought I'd put up some photos of Bob's various cars for those who aren't aware of Bob's career. The Calder 1972 meeting was an interesting one (Matich A51? and Muir's Lola T300) as both Neil Hammond and I were in the pits that day, snapping away (pretty sure I've posted both our shots of the Lola T300 in the past, but good excuse to repost as they would have disappeared from the archive by now). No one got even close to Matich as he blasted the lap record below the 40 second mark - 39.9. Always hard to compare drivers from the F5000 era as half the time the cars weren't quite right or whatever, but certainly Muir (or anyone else) couldn't touch Matich on this day. Bit like Alan Jones at AIR in 1977 - on another level.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Lola5000
Did he also do the 1986 Bathurst 1,000 with John Goss in a Citi bank sponsored Jaguar XJS ,perhaps the old Goss group C car converted to Group A,which I think Goss still owns made out in the TWR winning colours of 1985?

Yes, he did co-drive the Citibank-backed entry, they finished 24th on 140 laps.

Going back, Bob's Bathurst drives were:

1985 - co-driver to Ken Matthews, Commodore, 15th outright, 13th in class, 148 laps
1984 - co-driver to Joe Moore, Falcon XE, retired (gearbox) 110 laps
1983 - co-driver to Christine Gibson, Nissan Pulsar EXA, retired (mainshaft) 14 laps
1982 - co-driver to Brian Callaghan, Falcon XE, disqualified, 150 laps
1981 - with Ian Geoghegan as co-driver, Falcon XD, 28th and last finisher, 92 laps
1980 - with Kingsley Hibbard as co-driver, Falcon XD, retired (head gasket) 7 laps
1970 - co-driver to Bob Beasley, Falcon GT HO, retired (head gasket) 6 laps
1969 - co-driver to Bob Beasley, Falcon GT HO, 7th, 127 laps (of 130
1968 - with Gary Cooke as co-driver, Fiat 125, 47th outright, class 14th, 69 laps




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Edited by Ray Bell, 15 February 2018 - 11:05.

[Lola5000]

Yes, he did co-drive the Citibank-backed entry, they finished 24th on 140 laps.

Going back, Bob's Bathurst drives were:

1985 - co-driver to Ken Matthews, Commodore, 15th outright, 13th in class, 148 laps
1984 - co-driver to Joe Moore, Falcon XE, retired (gearbox) 110 laps
1983 - co-driver to Christine Gibson, Nissan Pulsar EXA, retired (mainshaft) 14 laps
1982 - co-driver to Brian Callaghan, Falcon XE, disqualified, 150 laps
1981 - with Ian Geoghegan as co-driver, Falcon XD, 28th and last finisher, 92 laps
1980 - with Kingsley Hibbard as co-driver, Falcon XD, retired (head gasket) 7 laps
1970 - co-driver to Bob Beasley, Falcon GT HO, retired (head gasket) 6 laps
1968 - co-driver to Bob Beasley, Falcon GT HO, 7th, 127 laps (of 130
1968 - with Gary Cooke as co-driver, Fiat 125, 47th outright, class 14th, 69 laps

1968 Falcon GT HO?

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Lola5000
1968 Falcon GT HO?

Not to mention co-driving in a Fiat in the same race...

It's fixed, Rob. Anything you want to add?

What I really would like to see is Greg Mackie giving some first-hand experience of Bob in the Vee days, while it would also be nice for Erol Richardson to chime in about the Lexus-powered Reynard.

And just to get all the corrections up to date, it was a Birrana 273.

[MarkBisset]

Great stuff Ray for reigniting the thread and Lindasy for the fantastic shots.

I wonder Ray if Dick's photo of the BN3 in 1970 @ OP is with the Waggott fitted- back to my obsession of last week?!

I missed Bob's early days as my first meeting was the '72 AGP @ Sandown but his T300 had me riveted to the spot with excitement on that day. Waxed lyrical here;
https://primotipo.co...ola-and-raquel/

To me he showed what he could do in the Bob & Marj Brown Birrana 273 in 1974- I saw the Calder and P Island rounds, the dice between Leo and Bob @ Calder was a pearler! That season with Leo, Bob, Bruce Allison, John Leffler, Ray Winter with the likes of KB, Max and others was wonderful. He was clearly quick!

I've not trawled thru the '75 Brittish Atlantic season in '75 but he did well in the two year old car- ditto in '72/3 in the US L&M races he did.

What says it all is a one-off Euro F2 run @ Mugello in July. Qualified on the front row, or was it row 2? Anyway that performance was in a Chevron B35 Ford BDA- no BMW M12 or Fenault V6. He was 16th in the race with dramas but Q2 0r Q3 in a field which included future F1 drivers Jabouille, Arnoux, Tambay, Binder, Brancatelli, Ertl, Rosberg, Leclere, Jaussaud, Sullivan, Robarts and sportscar stars Klaus Ludwig and Reinhold Jost. That's not bad i'd say.

That Matich asked him to drive the A53 after FM's boating accident despite having boofed the A52 (not Bobs fault he says) says a lot too.

So, it's a bit of a shame he didn't get a better supported drive earlier- but like so many Aussies he was paying his way, out of his own sky-rocket nut funded by 'Tinker Belle' or a South American or French oil company.

M

[Dale Harvey]

I wonder Ray if Dick's photo of the BN3 in 1970 @ OP is with the Waggott fitted- back to my obsession of last week?!

 

It may be, it looks like it is an injected engine and the exhaust is on the correct side.

Dale.

[GMACKIE]

Not to mention co-driving in a Fiat in the same race...

It's fixed, Rob. Anything you want to add?

What I really would like to see is Greg Mackie giving some first-hand experience of Bob in the Vee days, while it would also be nice for Erol Richardson to chime in about the Lexus-powered Reynard.

And just to get all the corrections up to date, it was a Birrana 273.

A vivid memory of Bob Muir has stayed with me. It was a very wet race at Hume Weir, June,1970. Bob was a 'late entry', driving a borrowed car - can't remember whose.

 

Driving right on Bob's tail, with water everywhere, I was suddenly aware of him spinning! A decision must be made instantly - do you go right or left...As it turned out, I fortunately went left, while Bob went backwards into the grass on the infield. It's a bit like the soccer goalie who must jump one way, or the other, to save a penalty goal.

 

That "Reynard" that Erol did for Bob was a great looking bit of work.

Edited by GMACKIE, 18 February 2018 - 21:00.

[Ray Bell]

He's not mentioned in the report...

You are, however, passing my old mate Turnbull! Bernie is mentioned, he had a spin, and Larry Perkins, and Gary Campbell as well..

Most of Bob's cars always looked a picture, it's true.




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Edited by Ray Bell, 18 February 2018 - 22:06.

[GMACKIE]

Lots of interesting thing aren't mentioned in 'Race Reports'.

 

Bob Prendergast had the best 'lose' I've ever seen. He went off - in the wet - before the control tower, around the back of the tower, then back onto the track!

[Ray Bell]

You mean out through the grid area?

That would have been spectacular.

And yes, I'm often disappointed by the lack of detail in Adrian's reports.

[cooper997]

July 1971 RCN and Bob Muir placed this advert

 

 

Stephen