560 replies to this topic

[cdrewett]

Martin Brundle was speculating today whether the returning Schumacher will demonstrate a greater degree of sportsmanship than in his first F1 career.
I have two questions.....will he?.....and should he if he wants to win?
Chris

[Tim Murray]

Leopard ... spots ...

[Allan Lupton]

It's not the taking part that's important - it's the winning

[eldougo]

Like he said he is out there to win .

[Stoatspeed]

Interesting question, Chris ..... my view is that he will be facing a grid full of (mostly) young drivers, many of whom have not raced against him in the past and all of whom will be out to put one over on the "old master" ..... therefore, if he does not exhibit the old fire (aka "lack of sportsmanship"), he will find it hard to succeed. I forecast more than a few on-track clashes with the young tigers, and consequently some off-track words about sportsmanship and its relevance to top-class motor racing.

It would be good for all the other drivers to remember that whatever may have been said in the past few days about MS's love of the sport and lack of concern for taking records, he races to WIN .... and reaching a career tally of 8 or 9 WDC's will be sounding pretty attractive to him and his new employers right now!

[Gabrci]

Also I have just noticed that is he wins just one more race, he will have won as many races as Senna and Prost put together.

[Doug Nye]

This thread's title certainly includes two words one would not naturally combine. The old man - according to former team-mates - has no existence outside racing. I have no knowledge of whether that's true or not. But as with ageing drivers throughout motor racing history, should he find he can no longer achieve the fine edge of performance which once came so naturally, his natural reaction might well be to stick his elbows out even further than he did at his best.

Will the young lions be as readily intimidated `as some of his peers once were? I very much doubt it. By midway through next season we will either see just how good the Schumacher phenomenon really is - or a demeaned and wounded former superstar in genuine pain. Meantime I wish him and his a Happy Christmas.

DCN

[Phil Rainford]

There is no doubt he has not come back just to make up the numbers.

The old master returns in order to show the young protagaonists just who is the " The Boss " I for one cannot wait......... there will be fireworks


PAR

[Stephen W]

This thread's title certainly includes two words one would not naturally combine. The old man - according to former team-mates - has no existence outside racing. I have no knowledge of whether that's true or not. But as with ageing drivers throughout motor racing history, should he find he can no longer achieve the fine edge of performance which once came so naturally, his natural reaction might well be to stick his elbows out even further than he did at his best.

Will the young lions be as readily intimidated `as some of his peers once were? I very much doubt it. By midway through next season we will either see just how good the Schumacher phenomenon really is - or a demeaned and wounded former superstar in genuine pain. Meantime I wish him and his a Happy Christmas.

DCN

Couldn't agree more. One wonders if the Schumacher magic has gone will he walk away mid season rather than bumble along in midfield?

[Phil Rainford]

Couldn't agree more. One wonders if the Schumacher magic has gone will he walk away mid season rather than bumble along in midfield?

Exactly......that is why we will all be watching on the 14th March


PAR

[Tim Murray]

He will become, I think, the oldest driver to race in a World Championship GP since Mansell in 1995. It's interesting that after his F1 comeback Mansell could still cut the mustard when given a competitive Williams, but lost all motivation in the uncompetitive 1995 McLaren. I don't believe that Schumacher will have lost any of his skills, but I do wonder how he'll react if the 2010 Brawn - sorry, Mercedes - turns out to be slower than the competition.

Edited by Tim Murray, 24 December 2009 - 11:32.

[Gabrci]

He will become, I think, the oldest driver to race in a World Championship GP since Mansell in 1995. It's interesting that after his F1 comeback Mansell could still cut the mustard when given a competitive Williams

Frankly, I think he was very far from his old self, he was even slower than Hill, who has clearly never been anywhere near the category of an on-form Mansell.

It'll be indeed very interesting to see how Schumacher can deliver, and as Doug said, if he can realize it early enough if he can't do it anymore.

[Tim Murray]

Frankly, I think he was very far from his old self ...

I think you're being a little unfair. He'd been away from F1 for over a year. The cars were very different, followin the banning of the electronic aids, and I suspect he wouldn't have been able to do much testing. In spite of this he qualified 2-3-4-1 in the four races he did, and won in Australia. Granted, he was generally slower than Damon, but Damon had far more experience of the car, and the whole team would have been focusing on Damon's bid for the championship.

(I never dreamed I'd ever find myself standing up for The Great Whinger. )

Edited by Tim Murray, 24 December 2009 - 12:08.

[Stephen W]

I never dreamed I'd ever find myself standing up for The Great Whinger.

Worry not, it is the Season of Goodwill to all men!

[Duc-Man]

Going back to the title of the topic.
Schumacher and sportsmanship?
He was for sure one of the best drivers of all time.
He never was a sportsman at all. When he was involved in a crash he allways blamed the others. When he had a bad race he blamed the car. He never admitted any mistakes.

So it can only get better...

[Bjorn Kjer]

Are you a mind reader , you took all my words...........

[Duc-Man]

Are you a mind reader , you took all my words...........

Mind reader? Not at all. It's called observing and counting one and one together (a.k.a. common sense).

[Gabrci]

He never was a sportsman at all...

May I ask if you ever practiced any sport? Perhaps on a competition level? Do you happen to have the slightest idea of what it takes to be competitive in such a demanding sport, or indeed in any sport even on the national stage? Have you ever trained to physical exhaustion every day for decades? Have you ever had the pressure of a whole nation on your shoulders to deliver? Have you experienced first hand that success only comes when you commit yourself totally to it and don't care whether the others like it or not?

You may find it fortunate to think this through before you say that someone who delivered this sort of performance for 15 years - oblivious to whether they tried to take out Villeneuve in a desperate maneuver or rammed Prost off the track as a deliberate move - "is not a sportsman".

Not really important alongside this, but it's also nonsense that he always criticized the car or whatever. If someone never said a bad word in public about his team, that was him.

Edited by Gabrci, 24 December 2009 - 15:39.

[D-Type]

May I ask if you ever practiced any sport? Perhaps on a competition level? Do you happen to have the slightest idea of what it takes to be competitive in such a demanding sport, or indeed in any sport even on the national stage? Have you ever trained to physical exhaustion every day for decades? Have you ever had the pressure of a whole nation on your shoulders to deliver? Have you experienced first hand that success only comes when you commit yourself totally to it and don't care whether the others like it or not?

You may find it fortunate to think this through before you say that someone who delivered this sort of performance for 15 years - oblivious to whether they tried to take out Villeneuve in a desperate maneuver or rammed Prost off the track as a deliberate move - "is not a sportsman".

Not really important alongside this, but it's also nonsense that he always criticized the car or whatever. If someone never said a bad word in public about his team, that was him.

Anyone who deliberately drives into another driver is not a sportsman. Whether he won any other races is not relevant.

[Stephen W]

Anyone who deliberately drives into another driver is not a sportsman. Whether he won any other races is not relevant.

... and when he does it more than once ............

[Allan Lupton]

May I ask if you ever practiced any sport? Perhaps on a competition level? Do you happen to have the slightest idea of what it takes to be competitive in such a demanding sport, or indeed in any sport even on the national stage? Have you ever trained to physical exhaustion every day for decades? Have you ever had the pressure of a whole nation on your shoulders to deliver? Have you experienced first hand that success only comes when you commit yourself totally to it and don't care whether the others like it or not?

You may find it fortunate to think this through before you say that someone who delivered this sort of performance for 15 years - oblivious to whether they tried to take out Villeneuve in a desperate maneuver or rammed Prost off the track as a deliberate move - "is not a sportsman".

Not really important alongside this, but it's also nonsense that he always criticized the car or whatever. If someone never said a bad word in public about his team, that was him.

There is quite a relevant saying that you don't have to be able to lay an egg to know when one is bad.

What we are remembering is that MS was (and probably still is) a highly talented racer who did not need to behave as he sometimes did when he drove others off the track, or deliberately collided with them. That's not sportsmanship, and even though he won cleanly more often than not, it's the "not" that we regard as unsporting and unacceptable.

I really don't think that fanboy last sentence needs a response from me.

[David McKinney]

Gabrci does not tell us his nationality (or age), so perhaps does not understand what "sportsmanship" means

What he seems to be describing is single-minded determination, brilliance even. I'd happily apply either of those terms to MS. But not "sportsmanship"


Edit - Touché Allan

Edited by David McKinney, 24 December 2009 - 17:03.

[Formula Once]

Schumacher apparently is a man many love to hate. I don't love him and don't hate him and, having only met him once or twice, don't know him. But I do respect his achievements, not in the least because he played an instrumental if not crucial role in turning around the fortunes of two teams, something not all champions can claim. Sportmanship? Were you at Zandvoort where Andretti won the race (and all but the title) because Peterson wasn't allowed to pass him? Where you at Rio when Williams (I feel many regard them sportsmen) ordered Reutemann to let Jones past? Were you at Kyalami when Piquet powered his rocket fuelled BMW to the title? Were you at Suzuka when Senna drove Prost of the track? In F1 the definition of sport and sportsmanship seems to have varied since the late seventies.

Having worked with many people who worked with Schumacher, their stories about his commitment to his job never failed to amaze me. Ironically, while some of you question his sportsmanship, this is the best thing that can happen to F1 after all the controversies the sport has been through over the past 2, 3 years. Globally, nothing F1-related has this year generated more publicity than his comeback.

Lauda has proved one can comeback after 3 years (and he hadn't as much as sit in a car), win races even if you are not in the best car and contribute to developing a car into the best and win the world title again. Anyone doubting if Michael could to do something similar apparently knows something I don't. Nor, I guess, Ross Brawn.

Lest we forget, he was pretty sensational when he did some testing for Ferrari a few years ago and when he joined Kubica,Nico Rosberg, etc. for some karting in Italy recently, he beat them all. If that may sound trivial, try out a pukka racing kart first.

As for former team-mates claiming he has no existence outside racing, I can't help but notice that apart from Eddie Irvine none of them seem to have been able to have a life without it either...

In my opinion this is very good news for F1 and I hope it will be good for him too. I find it very interesting the man is coming back and if anything it proves he didn't want to stop in the first place. I for one think he will do well. Very well indeed.

Edited by Formula Once, 24 December 2009 - 17:13.

[Allan Lupton]

Gabrci does not tell us his nationality (or age), so perhaps does not understand what "sportsmanship" means

He sent "Christmas Greetings from snowy Budapest" so he's probably Hungarian

[Allan Lupton]

Were you at Zandvoort where Andretti won the race (and all but the title) because Peterson wasn't allowed to pass him? Where you at Rio when Williams (I feel many regard them sportsmen) ordered Reutemann to let Jones past? Were you at Kyalami when Piquet powered his rocket fuelled BMW to the title? Were you at Suzuka when Senna drove Prost of the track? In F1 the definition of sport and sportsmanship seems to have varied since the late seventies.

No we are not writing about team orders or anything normal like that. Nor are we saying that MS had a monopoly of bad behaviour -but it's MS not Senna that's coming back to racing.
Please look back a few posts so see what we actually regard as his unsporting behaviour

[Duc-Man]

May I ask if you ever practiced any sport?

I used to play cricket cut throat (darts). So I do know what sportsmanship is. I also know what fair play is.
May I quote the wikipedia about sportsmanship?
'Sportsmanship is conformance to the rules, spirit, and etiquette of sport....Being a "good sport" involves being a "good winner" as well as being a "good loser".'

[BrmBoy]

I am already making bets about MS and how many penalties due to "driver conduct" he will win over the year. The methods he used in the past are not likely to go un-punished in the current era.

Will he be up to the job if he has to stay within the current "rules of combat" ? Over the last couple of years drivers have been penalised for much less than some of the methods used by MS in the past.

[Rosemayer]

He will become, I think, the oldest driver to race in a World Championship GP since Mansell in 1995. It's interesting that after his F1 comeback Mansell could still cut the mustard when given a competitive Williams, but lost all motivation in the uncompetitive 1995 McLaren. I don't believe that Schumacher will have lost any of his skills, but I do wonder how he'll react if the 2010 Brawn - sorry, Mercedes - turns out to be slower than the competition.

Just remember who will be getting the good Mercedes engines and who will get the ones that go KABLAMMO.

[Gabrci]

Gabrci does not tell us his nationality (or age), so perhaps does not understand what "sportsmanship" means

What he seems to be describing is single-minded determination, brilliance even. I'd happily apply either of those terms to MS. But not "sportsmanship"

I'm happy to tell you - I'm 25, Hungarian, have been competing for 16 years (on amateur level) and am a qualified coach, so I guess I also have a reasonable idea about sportsmanship. While I'm certainly no world-class athlete, I have trained with World and European Champions, so at least I have seen world class athletes from very close.

I think the bottom line of this discussion is one thing, and that is that people who have never experienced what it really takes to be a competitor of such level (and this is not a problem, it's simply that they haven't seen it), might have a fairytale vision about world class athletes, thinking that they are nice, smiling, innocent men, dreaming about the fair play prize, who are always careful not to be too close to the limit of this so-called sportsmanship.

In reality, this is not the case in modern sport. I'm not talking about cycling or weightlifting, where if someone is in the top 1000 then they can be taken for granted to have taking doping for years, let's stay with motor racing. Sir Jack Brabham, a really lovely, charming and modest old gentleman, used to go slightly off the road to spray dust and stones into the face of the driver behind. Schumacher's move on Villeneuve, while not likely to win the fair play prize, didn't really endanger the health of anyone. Would any of us look Jack Brabham in the eye and tell him that he was not a sportsman? I don't think so. Mike MacDowel wrote to me last year that "the car I "shared" with Jack Brabham...", so I guess team orders have a lasting impression on those who are on the receiving end, too. Shy and smiling Mika Häkkinen couldn't have cared less about breaking DC's career, which at the time looked more promising than his own, in two by taking the wins in Jerez and Melbourne from him.

The point I'm trying to make is that with respect to the very, very rare exceptions, only the selfish, ruthless bastards can become world-class sportsmen today. They can be nice people when not working - Schumacher, Hamilton or Alonso are all very decent guys. But when racing, they must make the most of every little opportunity they have.

I think there is no way that someone is a world-class athlete for 15 years in a sport as fast and furious as this one and never crosses the line of sportsmanship. Therefore I find it difficult to understand how can we say that someone, who yes, behaved unsportingly once every 5 years, but delivered a level of performance never imagined before for a time as long as never imagined before, "is not a sportsman".

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by Gabrci
May I ask if you ever practiced any sport? Perhaps on a competition level? Do you happen to have the slightest idea of what it takes to be competitive in such a demanding sport, or indeed in any sport even on the national stage? Have you ever trained to physical exhaustion every day for decades? Have you ever had the pressure of a whole nation on your shoulders to deliver? Have you experienced first hand that success only comes when you commit yourself totally to it and don't care whether the others like it or not?

Frankly, I think that you've taken something out of context here...

"The pressure of a whole nation on your shoulders to deliver"? If it's that important, then it's no longer a sport at all.

I think that starts to get to the point of the discussion about 'sportsmanship'.

[D-Type]

Sportsmanship has nothing at all to do with being a successful or unsuccessful sportsman, it is all about attitude of mind and how you compete.

[Gary C]

Bang on, Duncan, couldn't have said it better myself.

[Gabrci]

Sportsmanship has nothing at all to do with being a successful or unsuccessful sportsman, it is all about attitude of mind and how you compete.

None of the very successful drivers from recent times is a sportsman then?

[D-Type]

None of the very successful drivers from recent times is a sportsman then?

Sportsman: One who competes in sport - Yes
Sportsman: One who displays sportsmanship - Probably not

Edited by D-Type, 24 December 2009 - 22:31.

[Phil Rainford]

Sportsmanship has nothing at all to do with being a successful or unsuccessful sportsman, it is all about attitude of mind and how you compete.

Perfect

The point I'm trying to make is that with respect to the very, very rare exceptions, only the selfish, ruthless bastards can become world-class sportsmen today. They can be nice people when not working - Schumacher, Hamilton or Alonso are all very decent guys. But when racing, they must make the most of every little opportunity they have.

I think the misunderstanding here is due smewhat to the nuance of the English language …. a sportsman is described in the first quote while the second quote describes a "winner" As pointed out only extremely rarely do the two become one


PAR

[Gabrci]

Sportsman: One who competes in sport - Yes
Sportsman: One who displays sportsmanship - Probably not

If the competition is so fierce that you can only afford to display sportsmanship in 95% of the cases and in the rest you need to be ruthless, you do that in order to win, surely.

Jack Brabham wasn't a sportsman either then?

[Gabrci]

I think the misunderstanding here is due smewhat to the nuance of the English language …. a sportsman is described in the first quote while the second quote describes a "winner" As pointed out only extremely rarely do the two become one

I understand that, but when someone decides to become a professional sportsman, they do it in order to win. If this can be achieved by always displaying sportsmanship, too, then it's a nice bonus - hardly ever possible today -, but if not, so be it. That's what Jack Brabham did 50 years ago, and good for him, and that's what they do today.

[Phil Rainford]

I understand that, but when someone decides to become a professional sportsman, they do it in order to win. If this can be achieved by always displaying sportsmanship, too, then it's a nice bonus - hardly ever possible today -, but if not, so be it. That's what Jack Brabham did 50 years ago, and good for him, and that's what they do today.

Fair point and I agree in today's world winning is everything.

However if you can win without compromising your principles then you stand head and shoulders above the rest.

In the UK footballer Ryan Giggs has just been voted " Sports Personality of the Year " .... yes he has won more medals than any other player before him. But the main reason people voted for him is how he has attained this success......the perfect role model for young footballers.

PAR

[Ray Bell]

Jack Brabham didn't do anything to harm others...

Certainly, by letting the tail drift right over the white line on an exit he would potentially impede their progress, but that wasn't his first purpose in doing that.

His driving style saw the tail out, his 'ragged edge' driving put the tail over the edge. Dust etc in the face of a follower was a by-product of his driving rather than the purpose of his driving.

A good example of this was seen in the '68 Tasman Cup race at Warwick Farm, where he had to come through from behind and seemed really determined to put in a good performance. Looking at the video of this today, we see him repeated coming onto Hume straight with the left rear wheel throwing up a plume of dust. And there's nobody behind him!

[dretceterini]

I am no fan of any of the drivers who's attitude was win at all costs to competitors.

[Zippel]

Schumacher's move on Villeneuve, while not likely to win the fair play prize, didn't really endanger the health of anyone.

Don't know how anyone could say that. Any racing maneuver that involves deliberately colliding with another is dangerous. Villeneuve described it as a hard shove after the race and it was enough to dislodge the battery. It could very well have ended up worse than the DC/Wurz incident of 2007 had Schumi approached it slightly different.

[Lee Nicolle]

Schumaker and Sportsmanship do not compute. Very good driver and a very poor sport.
And at his age he really will make a mug of himself. Why is he doing it?

[antonvrs]

Let's face it; F1 has long since ceased to be a "sport", it's strictly a business.
Anton

[Frank S]

I'm waiting for Gabrici to acknowledge his erroneous interpretation of "sportsmanship" as commonly used in this forum. Once he does that, the thread has run out of fuel and shows its true character: a troll by a fellow who has apparently invested a great deal in something he has yet to understand completely.

I hesitate to use the term "sociopath", but a clinical checklist might be revealing with regard to MS's character. Not that his profile is likely much different from many notorious persons who occupy center stage in the media.

[john aston]

He may be a panto villain-cries of 'oh no he isn't '- but MS is one of the best GP drivers in the history of the sport and I am seriously looking forward to his return.Few GP drivers are angels and if one thinks of some of the more muscular moves pulled by Mark Webber I do not think MS is the only streetfighter.
Nostalgia point- in the Independent yesterday Johnny Herbert was saying he thought it a pointless return and no driver had ever achieved anytyhing after coming out of retirement.Strange ...whilst Prost in 93 was certainhly not the Prost he was in a McLaren he did err,, win the championship..And Lauda's return was brilliant- will admit to bias as I saw his last victory at Zandvoort and to me he was always 'the Man'

[ensign14]

I'm waiting for Gabrici to acknowledge his erroneous interpretation of "sportsmanship" as commonly used in this forum. Once he does that, the thread has run out of fuel and shows its true character: a troll by a fellow who has apparently invested a great deal in something he has yet to understand completely.

Or that he is not a native English speaker dealing with a word that does not have a literal meaning?

I hesitate to use the term "sociopath", but a clinical checklist might be revealing with regard to MS's character. Not that his profile is likely much different from many notorious persons who occupy center stage in the media.

Given that someone as intelligent as Schumacher seems to have no interest in anything at all outside motor sport - if you were in your early forties, with more money than you could ever hope to spend, a gorgeous wife, children and time on your hands, surely there are other things you could think about?

I wonder if MS is deeply insecure. Hence him wanting another world title to beat Fangio, as 1994 certainly and perhaps 1995 as well were so tainted. On top of that, Mercedes gave him his break, so this is the chance to pay them back.

[Chezrome]

I'm waiting for Gabrici to acknowledge his erroneous interpretation of "sportsmanship" as commonly used in this forum. Once he does that, the thread has run out of fuel and shows its true character: a troll by a fellow who has apparently invested a great deal in something he has yet to understand completely.

I hesitate to use the term "sociopath", but a clinical checklist might be revealing with regard to MS's character. Not that his profile is likely much different from many notorious persons who occupy center stage in the media.

Interesting remark about notorious persons in the center of the worldstage. Yes, they are all egomaniacs. But I think that Alonso, Hamilton are just like Schumacher. Not sociopaths, but normal human beings who have had the incredible luck of fulfilling their youths' dream. Very inflating for the ego. Look at Top-CEO's, same kettle of fish. It's like kids in grown up body's that have noone who says: 'No, you can't do that, you can't have that.'

So sociopath? No. Kidlike egoism? Yes.

[Gabrci]

I'm waiting for Gabrici to acknowledge his erroneous interpretation of "sportsmanship" as commonly used in this forum. Once he does that, the thread has run out of fuel and shows its true character: a troll by a fellow who has apparently invested a great deal in something he has yet to understand completely.

I'm sorry but after 16 years of competing I have a fair understanding of sportsmanship.

I try to explain it clearly: it's very easy for someone who hasn't been there and hasn't done it, and doesn't even try to understand, to sit back in the armchair and say about a move like that 'oh, how unsporting, what a devil, not a sportsman'. They do not want to understand that these people, ever since being a kid, thought about this all day, went to bed with this, dreamed about this and woke up with this one single target. When it is so close, will you say oh, thank you, it's not the most immaculate way, so I rather don't take it, thank you. Of course you don't. Please, at least try to imagine how deep dedication is needed to get to this level in anything.

Again: to think that it's possible to be the best in the world in a challenging sport like this and never cross the line of sportsmanship is believing in a fairytale.

Someone mentioned Ryan Giggs. In his 20 years of playing for MU, he has never once been sent off. But: "In November 2003, he was found guilty of improper conduct by the FA due to his behaviour following a game against Arsenal. In the same week, Giggs received a two-match suspension from international football for deliberately elbowing Russian player Vadim Evseev in the face."
So Ryan Giggs is not a sportsman, I guess.

I guess it's sometimes also a case of rose-tinted glasses. The great Fangio very happily used other drivers as #2, and why not if he could? It doesn't fit into sportsmanship to win because others aren't allowed to, does it ?

About why does he want to come back - if the fire is burning so strongly in someone that it gets him to this level for so long, you can't just switch it off like a TV.

So please get back to reality, and understand that the very essence of sport at this level is to push the rules as far as possible. You can always be very sporting when playing football with friends, but it's hardly ever possible on top level. So please don't say that someone who put his whole life in achieving a target in a sport, but goes over the top once every 5 years, is not a sportsman. Surely each of us make at least one big mistake in every 5 years, and we are not pushing limits to the maximum every day.

Edited by Gabrci, 25 December 2009 - 10:39.

[Michael Ferner]

It pains me to say, but I think our Hungarian friend is (at least partly) right here. Let's face it, F1 has become a contact sport. In ye olden days, no one would have dared to make deliberate contact with another car, because it was excessively dangerous. It's still dangerous today, but more and more, drivers get away with it. The powers that be failed to get a stop on these doings, and competitive natures are bound to exploit the limits. Would Fangio or Clark have employed such tactics in similar circumstances? We don't know, and we'll never find out. We'd love to think that they wouldn't, but who's to say? If the fire burns, it burns brightly.

It's a top-to-bottom phenomenon. The FIA did not enough to rein in Senna, and nothing about Schumacher. F1's become a contact sport, and it's much, much poorer for it.

[Duc-Man]

Gabrci, Mate, you don't get it.
It's not about playing fair.
It's not about pushing the limits.
It's not about making mistakes.
It's not about going over the top once every five years to use your words.

It's about making mistakes...and blaming somebody else.
It's about going over the top once every five years...and blaming somebody else.

Through Schumacher career I've never saw him admitting a mistake. No matter what the situation was.
He retired through an accident: it was the other drivers fault. PERIOD!

Just read this to get an idea what you're talking 'bout.
http://en.wikipedia....i/Sportsmanship

Edited by Duc-Man, 25 December 2009 - 11:00.