1114 replies to this topic

[Skinnyguy]

garoidb, on Nov 8 2012, 20:29, said:

Yeah. He hasn´t done enough to stay in Ferrari according to everyone except Ferrari.

Don´t believe it? Make a poll. Starting with you: would you have renewed AGAIN Felipe Massa after not only this year, but after the last 3 seasons he has done? Really?

[garoidb]

Skinnyguy, on Nov 8 2012, 20:25, said:

Don´t believe it? Make a poll. Starting with you: would you have renewed AGAIN Felipe Massa after not only this year, but after the last 3 seasons he has done? Really?

That was not the original statement, though, was it? Ferrari have renewed him. Therefore, he has done enough to retain his Ferrari contract.

[Jejking]

I wouldn't have, that's for sure. But it seemed Massa picked up the pace really well the last 3 months or so. But based on 11 and also 10, I had tossed him out.

[Skinnyguy]

garoidb, on Nov 8 2012, 22:45, said:

That was not the original statement, though, was it? Ferrari have renewed him. Therefore, he has done enough to retain his Ferrari contract.

No, but you already pointed out it was wrong, and I already corrected it. I´m well aware that Ferrari renewed him, and you were well aware that I didn´t meant that he was not renewed by Ferrari, but that he did not make enough to get that for most. So you were just being picky instead of adding anything.

Now you´re back with what was already settled when you have a question to answer. The evasive move is a good hint on your answer but... Could you tell us what you think about the topic now? Would you sign Felipe again?

[garoidb]

Skinnyguy, on Nov 8 2012, 22:07, said:

No, but you already pointed out it was wrong, and I already corrected it. I´m well aware that Ferrari renewed him, and you were well aware that I didn´t meant that he was not renewed by Ferrari, but that he did not make enough to get that for most. So you were just being picky instead of adding anything.

Yes, OK. I was reacting to the excessively negative comments on here about Massa.

Skinnyguy, on Nov 8 2012, 22:07, said:

Now you´re back with what was already settled when you have a question to answer. The evasive move is a good hint on your answer but... Could you tell us what you think about the topic now? Would you sign Felipe again?

If he had not pulled it together in the last third of the season, then no. But, given that his issues seem to be resolved to an acceptable degree, and that the available driver options were not as attractive as they might be next year, I understand why they did it. If there is any possibility of Vettel coming aboard for 2013, it makes even more sense. Even without that, there is no guarantee that the available drivers would do any better next year. The only one I might have risked is Hulkenberg, and they can probably get him next year if Vettel won't come.

Even having said all that, if he has a good season next year, there is no reason why it has to be his last a Ferrari. He has to start it well, though, and be on Alonso's level.

[Jejking]

2014*

I'm sure they will not extend the contract when better options are available. He is (coming) good, don't get me wrong on that, except last race which was a bit off, but unless he stays right behind Fernando in the WDC (and thus giving Ferrari a healthy chance on the WCC) I don't see him at Ferrari in 2014, if the car is up for it next season.

[Skinnyguy]

garoidb, on Nov 9 2012, 08:48, said:

If he had not pulled it together in the last third of the season, then no. But, given that his issues seem to be resolved to an acceptable degree, and that the available driver options were not as attractive as they might be next year, I understand why they did it.

Forget about 2014, there ARE more attractive available options than Felipe for 2013. How would it hurt to sign Hulkenberg, Perez, Kovalainen, Pic... for one year? You really think any of these guys stuck on the midfield or even the back of the grid would not accept it? Don´t you think they could do what Felipe is doing, and with a good chance to improve it?

I don´t think Ferrari can afford another year with one driver carrying all the weight of the team, and I can´t see Massa keeping reasonable shape for a full season anymore. Why no trying something different? And don´t take it as a rant for Massa, it goes for Webber, Button, or Grosjean too. The other 3 have as a saving grace that they have done a good season recently or that it has been his first full year, but Massa´s credit has ran out long ago.

[kosmos]

Skinnyguy, on Nov 9 2012, 16:07, said:

Forget about 2014.

That's you expressing your own whises, you don't know if he is going to have a good, bad or amazing 2013 season.

[Skinnyguy]

kosmos, on Nov 9 2012, 16:13, said:

That's you expressing your own whises, you don't know if he is going to have a good, bad or amazing 2013 season.

Same for any other driver on the grid And that´s no reason to keep signing someone underperforming.

[kosmos]

Skinnyguy, on Nov 9 2012, 16:17, said:

Same for any other driver on the grid

And that's the reason why you can't say that Massa will not drive for Ferrari in 2014

[Skinnyguy]

kosmos, on Nov 9 2012, 17:50, said:

And that's the reason why you can't say that Massa will not drive for Ferrari in 2014

There´s a reason I can´t say that for sure he´ll not keep the seat. But it is not the doubts I have about what he´ll do next year, it´s the fact that he´s being renewed by default no matter how he does. But it won´t last forever.

[halbvoll]

Skinnyguy, on Nov 9 2012, 14:59, said:

But it is not the doubts I have about what he´ll do next year, it´s the fact that he´s being renewed by default no matter how he does. But it won´t last forever.

It seems contract renewal is Massa's only ambition nowadays.

[mkoscevic]

Massa is storming through the Texas dust.

[ed24f1]

Excellent drive from him today! Particularly as he was only 10th after Turn 1.

Nice for him to have an extremely strong drive again after his form dipped a bit in India and Abu Dhabi.

[molive]

Withou that gearbox "change" Massa would have that podium spot, he was much faster than Alonso this weekend.

[Massa]

I think the gap with Alonso would be pretty big if he start in front of him. Massa was so much faster today.

[Claudiu]

I hope Massa has a good next year and stays beyond 2013, I really like him, he is fantastic ... it's just that he is very sensitive to the car, but when he dials in he is a hell of a driver.

[ConsiderAndGo]

I think Massa would have given the front two something to think about today had he put the same lap in as he did in Q2 and not been put back. He was awesome today.

[Henrik B]

Have to borrow a few tweets from Sniff Petrol:

'Smedley clearly sounds unsure about how to tell Massa he's going well. "Erm, Felipe, I think we've got a problem with the telemetry. It, errrr, it says you're going really fast. Ha ha ha ha ha"'.

Well done to him, clearly faster than Alonso this race.

[ed24f1]

ConsiderAndGo, on Nov 19 2012, 08:08, said:

I think Massa would have given the front two something to think about today had he put the same lap in as he did in Q2 and not been put back. He was awesome today.

Yeah definitely. But of course the irony is that Massa's grid penalty and not fulfilling potential in qualifying made his race look even more impressive. If he had qualified 4th and had to hold back just to stay with Alonso it wouldn't have looked so good.

Edited by ed24f1, 18 November 2012 - 21:16.

[pUs]

Easily the better Ferrari driver today, I'll give him that. He's been horrible for a good part of this year but today he was quick.

[STRFerrari4Ever]

Massa was blindingly fast today, who knows what he could've achieved had he started higher up. It will be interesting to see how he performs in Brazil where he is always super fast.

[Disgrace]

If Massa could replicate this in the early part of the season, Ferrari would not revert to number one and number two, they've shown it in the past.

[Mr.Wayne]

Disgrace, on Nov 18 2012, 16:57, said:

If Massa could replicate this in the early part of the season, Ferrari would not revert to number one and number two, they've shown it in the past.

Funny he didn't before... The questions imo should be "why are the upgrades (or lack of, as Alonso would put it) have helped more Massa than their #1 driver?" and "is it a coincidence that Massa's pace has reappeared now that the team actually *needs him* to help in the fight with the bulls?"

[Massa]

I don't think we will see the best Massa in brazil, because Alonso will need to have Massa right behind him for the WDC. The only way to see a fast Massa, or a Massa " allowed " to go as fast he could, it's to see Massa on pole for a 2006-like race, where Massa secure the first place. For the WDC, Alonso need to be on podium and Vettel 5th at best.

If Massa couldn't take the first two row, his race will be compromised like at India or Korea, where Ferrari told him to slow down because he was faster than Alonso.

BTW, i don't think we will see a Ferrari on the front row. Anyway, it's good for next year, i hope Ferrari will give him a car easier to drive, even if the car is not the fastest, if it's easy to drive, Massa will be fast and will challenge much more Alonso.

[Mr.Wayne]

STRFerrari4Ever, on Nov 18 2012, 16:55, said:

Massa was blindingly fast today, who knows what he could've achieved had he started higher up. It will be interesting to see how he performs in Brazil where he is always super fast.

He will move out of the way as early as possible to leave the track clean for Alonso.
Massa is not racing anymore, he is simply there because Ferrari needs to put two cars on the grid. As he said today "It is not easy to find a driver like me"

[Disgrace]

Mr.Wayne, on Nov 18 2012, 23:01, said:

Funny he didn't before... The questions imo should be "why are the upgrades (or lack of, as Alonso would put it) have helped more Massa than their #1 driver?" and "is it a coincidence that Massa's pace has reappeared now that the team actually *needs him* to help in the fight with the bulls?"

Massa taking points off Red Bull is just as valuable at the beginning of the season as it is at the end of the season, so that argument is just nonsense.

[Mr.Wayne]

Disgrace, on Nov 18 2012, 17:03, said:

Massa taking points off Red Bull is just as valuable at the beginning of the season as it is at the end of the season, so that argument is just nonsense.

Actually, at the beginning of the season is not that good because it doesn't allow the team to establish a clear 1-2 policy to justify bs like the one we saw today... Not that it affected them back in Germany'10, though...

[Callisto]

pUs, on Nov 18 2012, 21:16, said:

Easily the better Ferrari driver today, I'll give him that. He's been horrible for a good part of this year but today he was quick.

[Massa]

Mr.Wayne, on Nov 18 2012, 23:01, said:

Funny he didn't before... The questions imo should be "why are the upgrades (or lack of, as Alonso would put it) have helped more Massa than their #1 driver?" and "is it a coincidence that Massa's pace has reappeared now that the team actually *needs him* to help in the fight with the bulls?"

Massa is fast since Monaco. But after Monaco, he was fast when it dosen't matters, and always made mistakes in Q3 or in the race ( Canada for exemple ).

And if Massa isn't racing anymore, it's only because he was **** before Spa. It's his fault and not Ferrari fault. After Melbourne, Ferrari made a new chassis for him because he say that the car had a strange behaviour at Melbourne.... And then, at Malaysia, Alonso won and Massa was nowhere.

[Disgrace]

Mr.Wayne, on Nov 18 2012, 23:04, said:

Actually, at the beginning of the season is not that good because it doesn't allow the team to establish a clear 1-2 policy to justify bs like the one we saw today... Not that it affected them back in Germany'10, though...

How would you explain Ferrari not moving Massa over in Australia '10, Turkey '10 or China '11? At the beginning of the year, the Ferraris have always been free to race. Massa has not been anywhere near Alonso this year for it even to be an issue until far, far too late.

Edited by Disgrace, 18 November 2012 - 22:07.

[fatd]

Mr.Wayne, on Nov 19 2012, 05:02, said:

He will move out of the way as early as possible to leave the track clean for Alonso.
Massa is not racing anymore, he is simply there because Ferrari needs to put two cars on the grid. As he said today "It is not easy to find a driver like me"

I don't object Ferrari's decision, it's very logical that they have to maximize everything for Alonso to keep the WDC hope alive in this stage of championship, but still it's somehow a pity to hear such comment from Massa. It's as if his biggest value is his obedience instead of his speed and on-track performance.

[Skinnyguy]

Credit when it´s due: impressive race and weekend.

If he can do this over a year as he used to sometime ago, he´s as strong as anyone. Can´t see it happening anymore, but you never know. Great job, Felipe.

[hello86]

Great race today but overall a very weak character!

[MikeTekRacing]

hello86, on Nov 19 2012, 00:43, said:

Great race today but overall a very weak character!

he needs more performances like this one to be a strong guy.
he also knows very well that the only reason he still has a drive is that ferrari were patient with him. he is paying it back now, that's a sign of maturity. no point in being a smartass now, he's got nothing to win
felipe needs to focus all his energy in getting a VERY strong 2013 start of the season. he needs to be there among the front runners and collect as many points as possible.

[LiJu914]

I thought his new contract was undeserved - but i have to say, he´s starting to earn that "retroactively".

WDC-standings of the 2nd half of the season (between the Top-Teams):

SV 163 Pts.
RAI 108 Pts.
ALO 106 Pts.
HAM 98 Pts.
BUT 95 Pts.
MAS 84 Pts.
WEB 47 Pts.
GRO 35 Pts.

[choyothe]

Good weekend for him, clearly beat his teammate overall. He just needs to perform like this more than 3 times a year.

Edited by choyothe, 18 November 2012 - 23:01.

[Alx09]

Well done to Massa this weekend - glad to see him like this (and trust me, I'm not a Massa fan)

I wonder if it has to do with the way the tyres act versus his driving style.

Edited by Alx09, 18 November 2012 - 23:06.

[ed24f1]

hello86, on Nov 19 2012, 09:43, said:

Great race today but overall a very weak character!

What should he have done? Had a big tantrum? I think accepting the decision and then demonstrating his speed in the race with a great fightback drive was a good example of how his character and confidence has risen in the past few months.

[Jolkins]

ed24f1, on Nov 19 2012, 01:25, said:

What should he have done? Had a big tantrum? I think accepting the decision and then demonstrating his speed in the race with a great fightback drive was a good example of how his character and confidence has risen in the past few months.

I agree, today he clearly did a better job. Also it's silly to say that he lacks character considering the situation he's in at the moment. Sadly for him - either do what you're told or pack the bags.

I certainly hope it changes for him as I'd love to see a repeat of 08'(with a better ending mind you )

[Frankbullitt]

Sweet helmet for this weekend.

[DESCHAIN]

I like the green neon helmet more. But this one is good too.



Massa Sr.'s helmet:

[ed24f1]

Excellent qualifying for Felipe - depending how championship goes - it would be amazing to see him on the podium tomorrow in front of his home crowd!

[PretentiousBread]

Interesting to see Felipe in such a vein of form. To be honest, prior to the start of the 2010 season I thought we'd be seeing a lot of these sorts of performances where Alonso genuinely has no answer to Massa on a given weekend. I was surprised and disappointed at just how regularly and routinely Alonso was able to beat him, and by huge margins.

At least weekends like Austin and this show that he was genuinely a class driver during 07-09, it wasn't all just an underrated car and a massively underperforming Kimi, he could pull out fantastically fast qualifying laps.

[pingu666]

felipe has taken awhile to fully recover his form, or getting close to maxing it out now i guess. or alonso is slowing down, which i dont think he is.

been 3 years since his accident?

[expert]

Filipe has finally got a better understanding of the tyres, in combination with the teams in general understanding the right setup for the ŧyres to allow the drivers to push. Filipe's driving style did not cope well with the "raw eggs".

I worry for start of next season though when Pirelli will no doubt introduce some new compounds designed to unsettle everything again and Filipe will lose all his gains and be on the back foot to Alonso at the beginning again.

[BackOnTop]

DESCHAIN, on Nov 23 2012, 18:58, said:

I like the green neon helmet more. But this one is good too.



Massa Sr.'s helmet:

I just feel happy for Massa's dad and the support he shows his son. Good form by Massa.

He is capable of beating Alonso without team priority. So hopefully he ends this season on a good note... and I think Ferrari will definitely put more focus on him for next year.

I think Massa & Smedley are finally getting a foothold in Ferrari since ALonso arrived... and should be able to get what's best for them in 2013 season.

[ed24f1]

What an incredible finish to the season for Massa! Considering what happened at Korea and Austin, he really should have had 4 podiums in last 6 races.

Fingers crossed he can take this momentum into 2013, if so, he can certainly have a go at the championship.

[Nonesuch]

I've been critical of Massa during the season, but he's finishing the year on a high. He's had good races since F1 went to Asia, and I hope we see this Massa again next year.

[DutchQuicksilver]

Impressive end to the season for Massa. He's beginning to remind me of the Massa from 2008 and early 2009. Now I only hope he can start a season like this, then he can give Alonso a serious run for his money.