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Is Fernando Alonso equally responsible for bad Ferrari cars?


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#51 Birelman

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 05:47

ASFA2011, on Mar 31 2012, 04:27, said:

You are contradicting yourself in your own post , so is Alonso a developer or a designer ? Make up your mind please

How did I contradict myself? I merely stated his fans and everyone within Ferrari wanted him to join Ferrari doing the impossible even buying Kimi out of his seat because they said Alonso could develop the car better. So far, it hasn't materialized, at least, at Ferrari.

I don't have to make up my mind about anything between developer, or designer, I think he's neither, at least not in the astronomical way his fans and Ferrari thought.

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#52 Birelman

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 05:51

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 06:07, said:

What prejudice way of writing you are talking about???

It is quite clear that Alonso was/is bragged about as a perfect "Development" driver by Domi/Ferrari.
It is also very clear that the car has simply gone from good (2010), to bad (2011) to slow and ugly (2012).

If you are taking offence that Alonso is being highlighted by me, then I have no damn choice but to use him as a benchmark.... simply based on the fact that Fernando Alonso is the only driver amongst the top teams where all the focus, money, and attention is devoted to what & how he wants the car to behave by a 600-strong staff at Maranello.

And the car still fails. :rolleyes:

Lol :up:

#53 bourbon

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:14

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 04:33, said:

Alonso is better at development than Raikkonen, says Ferrari boss
http://www.jamesalle...s-ferrari-boss/

Ferrari team principal Stefano Domenicali has shed a little more light on the decision to drop Kimi Raikkonen and hire Fernando Alonso, saying that Alonso is a better development driver, more in the mould of Michael Schumacher and that is what the team needs.



Then hire Schumacher.

Quote

Referring to Raikkonen he said, “In a car that is capable of winning, he was and is perfect. But if the car needs to be developed and the team fired up, Alonso is better.”


And if developing cars and firing up teams was the goal, that would be fantastic. But it isn't. In addition to doing those things reported above, Michael also won championships for Ferrari. Isn't that what Ferrari really needs?

Quote

Alonso has always talked up his ability to develop a car, famously during his time at McLaren, claiming to have brought almost a second per lap to the car.


It wasn't almost a second per lap, it was a definite second overall - to Lewis.

Quote

Domenicali described Raikkonen as “very fast, but also very closed”. This is a criticism of Raikkonen that one heard from the team throughout his time there.


He wasn't closed - he had fallen asleep, probably while being interviewed by James Allen. :D

Edited by bourbon, 31 March 2012 - 06:20.


#54 as65p

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:17

I knew the moment it happened Malayisa would bring pain to many people, but so far it has exceeded all expectations! :cool:

#55 bl-f1

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:22


This thread is about bashing Alonso. As soon as he is up there, if only temporarily, the haters start their hate rolling.

Just one word of caution: there are many races left in the championship and the car could get better. What will you say then?

So far it is looking like a very disputed championship. Why can't some just enjoy it?

Be well.



#56 mursuka80

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:23

No he isnt. :down:

#57 HoldenRT

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:27

There was a major regulation change in 2009, Redbull were quick out of the blocks, McLaren and Ferrari a little slower. McLaren have caught up alot quicker, and Ferrari have been inconsistent and still trying to catch up. Nothing to do with Alonso.

#58 kartinhero

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:29

Yes he is..

#59 iotar

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 06:58

1. Mods should make their lives easier and introduce limits (monthly, daily) for the threads started.

2. I can't believe people are trying to give serious answers to this drivel.

3. Since you asked:

Alonso is only trying to correct mistakes made by Raikkonen in 2009. See, it was such a disastrous feedback in 2009 that they started way behind RB and still can't catch up. 2009 was very important first year of the new regulations and very costly to Ferrari.

It was basically so bad that they stopped development, fired Raikkonen even though it cost them a lot money, and waited for Alonso for fear of messing it up even further.

Makes sense from your perspective, doesn't it? God bless modern technology. In the old days people used to write threads like this one on their walls with excrements, now there;s internet!

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#60 walkindude

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 07:08

Threads like these give me so much joy when Fernando stamps his authority as the best driver out there again and again.Well done.Keep up the comedic value.

#61 Trust

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 07:20

How is thread surviving this long?

#62 ViMaMo

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 07:36

This thinking goes completely against logic. F1 these days has seen a lot of changes regulations wise, or sometimes other teams have found some radical solutions (Double decker diffuser, EBD, F Duct, Etc). I dont know how they go about a new car but I certainly do not think they ask their drivers to sit down at the table with coffee mugs, " Lets start with you Fernando, how do you think we should make changes for 2012? ".

Wiser ones have always attributed the success of the car to the team rather than a individual, which is the fact. But it is true that certain drivers have been known to provide clinical and accurate information to the engineers, that undoubtedly helps DEVELOPE a car compared to drivers who dont have that knack. (Maybe Fernando's win didn't mean anything to you)

This year's car has problems with the interlinking braking system if you have been following this thread or following Ferrari's problems. I guess you just follow Ferrari's/Fernando's failures.

Edited by ViMaMo, 31 March 2012 - 07:42.


#63 flyer121

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 07:37

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 05:40, said:

5637637[/url]']
Yeah baby, the car has "developed" into a big, bad "CLIFFORD" thanks to Alonso's mega "development" skills.. :lol: :lol:

Lol




#64 flyer121

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 07:41

walkindude, on Mar 31 2012, 08:08, said:

5637690[/url]']
Threads like these give me so much joy when Fernando stamps his authority as the best driver out there again and again.Well done.Keep up the comedic value.


How so ...
It can't be denied that Ferrari are going thru a mini crisis in develoPmentAnd they have the great development driver at the helm

#65 toroRosso

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:12

Replace Alonso's name with let's say Heidfeld driving the same results for Ferrari and you'd have a diffrent angle. Massa is not on his own level, not even close, so count him out. Counterargument isn't convincing.

I have noticed this ONLY because I hear such like Domenicali talking about his mad feedback skills. Then I start thinking with my own brains. Develpoment... hmm.. wasn't he in renault 08-09. Didn't that car reach P20 in Abu Dhabi 2009 practice.. Interesting.. Doesn't seem like there was much development there in two years. The developement hassle might be just a point of view of though. Alonso is more outspoken and that makes him a better developer for Ferrari. Meanwhile other teams might value more of a precisie feedback and fewer words and more to the point when it comes to detecting a problem and leave all the 'hey this guy knows how to talk to the engineers, he's a tribe leader' stuff secondary.

In the end I think it's the head engineers (deciding the strategy of building a car) that are slacking hard, and those are hired by management. Im not a big fan of the management.

I'd love to see Felipe come out of the Ferrari closet and start talking what's up over there in his point of view. His mouth is shut for long time now, might even be brainwashed. I mean one can't be happy for 3 crappy seasons in a row with a team like Ferrari. Poor baby Felipe.

Edited by toroRosso, 31 March 2012 - 08:14.


#66 Nivra

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:17

iotar, on Mar 31 2012, 12:28, said:

1. Mods should make their lives easier and introduce limits (monthly, daily) for the threads started.

2. I can't believe people are trying to give serious answers to this drivel.

3. Since you asked:

Alonso is only trying to correct mistakes made by Raikkonen in 2009. See, it was such a disastrous feedback in 2009 that they started way behind RB and still can't catch up. 2009 was very important first year of the new regulations and very costly to Ferrari.

It was basically so bad that they stopped development, fired Raikkonen even though it cost them a lot money, and waited for Alonso for fear of messing it up even further.

Makes sense from your perspective, doesn't it? God bless modern technology. In the old days people used to write threads like this one on their walls with excrements, now there;s internet!

:lol: :lol: Now "Raikkonen 2009" is at fault for "Clifford 2012".... :lol:

PS- the disastrous feedback for 2009 was mainly given by Massa, as the team were more focused on his desires due to his 2008 showing. After Massa got cracked due to the spring, Kimi Raikkonen's feedback led to the team winning at Spa as well as becoming the 2nd top scorer after Hamilton in the 2nd half of 2009. It's not very hard to figure out you know.

Alonso has developed sh!t so far it Ferrari. Personal victories matters a jot to Ferrari.... they want to win Championships... and Alosno's development skills was part of the bargain for bringing him into Ferrari. So far, he has been excellent, but his feedback has been utter cr@p to say the least. What more do you want, the whole damn team is "Only" focused on him for developing the car, and so far Alonso is failing in that department big time. Pat Fry is blamed for when the car is bad... but the driver plays an equal part, especially in the current Alonso-focused development program.

Edited by Nivra, 31 March 2012 - 08:20.


#67 robefc

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:28

CF22, on Mar 31 2012, 01:37, said:

Apart from Schumacher Alonso has to be the best driver supporting the development of the car[/b]. Drivers are no engineers, though they do give feedback as to what they prefer, how the car handles etc.

Just recently this came up on the official F1 website:

"Following Fernando Alonso's advice, Ferrari have introduced to the F2012 a concept used by their driver's former team, Renault, as long ago as 2001. Designed to make the rear end of the car stiffer, an arm (red arrow) has been added connecting the gearbox and chassis. Note also the oil radiator mounted on top of the gearbox and cooled by the second small inlet in the engine cover (blue arrow)."



http://www.formula1....12/865/948.html


That's exactly the sort of comment that inspired this thread. Personally I think he's as responsible for this car as he has been for any of the good cars he's driven.

What he can do, as a driver who has been in a few teams, is bring ideas from previous cars/teams, that's always handy and obviously something that Lewis, for example, can't do - but then Lewie still managed to add 3 points of downforce in 2010 I think it was :p

I think he's brilliant at inspiring and getting the team around him - that might be a quality considerered that of a team leader although whether that is better for the team or the individual is open to question , particularly looking at massa's recent form and what happensed to Piquet.

Edited by robefc, 31 March 2012 - 08:30.


#68 Nivra

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:31

toroRosso, on Mar 31 2012, 13:42, said:

Replace Alonso's name with let's say Heidfeld driving the same results for Ferrari and you'd have a diffrent angle. Massa is not on his own level, not even close, so count him out. Counterargument isn't convincing.

I have noticed this ONLY because I hear such like Domenicali talking about his mad feedback skills. Then I start thinking with my own brains. Develpoment... hmm.. wasn't he in renault 08-09. Didn't that car reach P20 in Abu Dhabi 2009 practice.. Interesting.. Doesn't seem like there was much development there in two years. The developement hassle might be just a point of view of though. Alonso is more outspoken and that makes him a better developer for Ferrari. Meanwhile other teams might value more of a precisie feedback and fewer words and more to the point when it comes to detecting a problem and leave all the 'hey this guy knows how to talk to the engineers, he's a tribe leader' stuff secondary.

In the end I think it's the head engineers (deciding the strategy of building a car) that are slacking hard, and those are hired by management. Im not a big fan of the management.

I'd love to see Felipe come out of the Ferrari closet and start talking what's up over there in his point of view. His mouth is shut for long time now, might even be brainwashed. I mean one can't be happy for 3 crappy seasons in a row with a team like Ferrari. Poor baby Felipe.

Exactly!!

All this Alonso is Mega at developing the car now seems to me like a big-fat-two-faced-lie by Ferrari management making excuses to give "Santander-paid Boy" some undeserved credit!!

It's fine to do that, but it's annoying when they tried to compare it down to their "Current World Champion" & making it sound like Kimi Raikkonen is useless at it. And it gets even more annoying when Alonso fanboys drive it home further! Now I see the same fanboys claiming "Drivers don't develop cars" to hide Alonso's shortcomings :rolleyes:

It doesn't work like that. Domi, if you have big'd up one driver over the other.... then it better show... or else criticism and being called a dick is not too far off.

Edited by Nivra, 31 March 2012 - 08:35.


#69 motorhead

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:48

Atreiu, on Mar 30 2012, 22:35, said:

Where is the 6 tenths joke?


It is not a joke, it is the truth. Alonso said it himself :cool:

#70 Supersleeper

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 08:59

This is just an "I hate Fernando Alonso" thread. It's an embarrassment to these forums.

#71 Sheik

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:05

Trust, on Mar 31 2012, 00:48, said:

This thread is one of the most shittiest I've ever seen.


:up:

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 06:40, said:

Yeah baby, the car has "developed" into a big, bad "CLIFFORD" thanks to Alonso's mega "development" skills.. :lol: :lol:


That Clifford so far won 50% of this years races. And with that Im not saying its a good car, Im just saying that this fact must hurt to start such shitty thread.

#72 Starlight

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:09

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 13:40, said:

Yeah baby, the car has "developed" into a big, bad "CLIFFORD" thanks to Alonso's mega "development" skills.. :lol: :lol:


How do you know whether he does/doesn't have these developmental skills? Do you have inside information from the team? Do you interact with him while he is at the factory speaking with the engineers? Or do you communicate with him while he is driving and testing the car?





#73 Massa

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:10

Why this thread is not closed ?

#74 iotar

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:24

Massa, on Mar 31 2012, 10:10, said:

Why this thread is not closed ?

Weekend.

#75 puxanando

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:36

:rolleyes: OMG...what a thread!
You can't even find anymore to make Alonso bad??

#76 GSiebert

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 09:43

iotar, on Mar 31 2012, 07:58, said:

2. I can't believe people are trying to give serious answers to this drivel.


Fact is, when the car is bad, its not Alonso's fault cause he's not an engineer, and the day it'll be fast, he'll get all the rewards for his awesome developpment and motivating skills.

#77 BruisedLee

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 10:36

Nivra, on Mar 31 2012, 00:12, said:

Lets question the elephant in the room- Is Fernando Alonso equally responsible for bad Ferrari cars under him??

Big elephant you found there, uh? :rolleyes:

He is not responsible for good or bad Ferrari cars. Just like he is not responsible for Renault cars, McLaren cars, Minardi cars, Fiat cars, GM cars, boats, trains, airplanes, wars around the world, Eastenders, etc.

Open a thread about Lex Luthor in a comic forum, that may be get you somewhere.





#78 fieraku

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 10:44

Nivra, on Mar 30 2012, 17:12, said:

Lets question the elephant in the room- Is Fernando Alonso equally responsible for bad Ferrari cars under him??

Fernando Alonso is one of the great modern day Championship winning competitor, along with the other 5 World Champions on the grid. He is definitely no greater & definitely no less than all other F1 World Champions. His driving skills and intelligence is unquestionable. So it's not an Alonso bash... but just a simple honest question.

I mean, one of the big reasons given by Domi for replacing Kimi with Alonso was the driver feedback.... and that Alonso would be more hand's on with the engineers and help develop fast cars season after season. Also, when Domi & some media/parties & fanboys with vested interest drilled in that point repetitively, they were fully aware that in-season testing was banned, so they definitely knew that driver's still make the most difference as to how the car gets built around. Or else why lie about it like two-faced dicks.

It's obvious that this aspect needs to be looked at from a neutral & Ferrari team fans perspective, and not through Fernando "my god" Alonso fanboys. We all know Alonso is great & Selfish and not a team player in any case, so we are rest assured that the car is 100% built around the feedback/data he delivers to his engineers & design team, both for upgrades & next years car!

That's Alonso's problem,he is so good God like almost in his driving abilities so when he designed his latest creations he had one thing in mind...."Make Kimi look like a fool"...how?...by beating Massa to a pulp in a **** car while winning races himself and looking like a god in the process. So imagine if he was in those 07-08 Ferraris that Kimi designed :eek: He'd had won every race.

So we can rest assured Kimi is a great designer and a crap driver whilst Alonso is a crappy designer and a driving Messiah.
It's not a Kimi bash just an honest answer to an honest question.


#79 puxanando

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 10:52

fieraku, on Mar 31 2012, 10:44, said:

So we can rest assured Kimi is a great designer and a crap driver whilst Alonso is a crappy designer and a driving Messiah.
It's not a Kimi bash just an honest answer to an honest question.


:up: +1


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#80 iotar

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 10:52

GSiebert, on Mar 31 2012, 10:43, said:

Fact is, when the car is bad, its not Alonso's fault cause he's not an engineer, and the day it'll be fast, he'll get all the rewards for his awesome developpment and motivating skills.

It's the wrong perception. So what? Is the answer to blame him for Ferrari designs? If you want to follow this bizarre logic - the problem is we have no clue if without Alonso Ferrari wouldn't have looked even worse. See, you can't prove or disprove it.

As was explained by OP, it was Massa who was responsible for 2009 Ferrari not Raikkonen. So maybe Massa can be blamed now, too. :drunk: You can't win, they make new rules as they go along.





#81 Skellen

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:01

fieraku, on Mar 31 2012, 11:44, said:

That's Alonso's problem,he is so good God like almost in his driving abilities so when he designed his latest creations he had one thing in mind...."Make Kimi look like a fool"...how?...by beating Massa to a pulp in a **** car while winning races himself and looking like a god in the process. So imagine if he was in those 07-08 Ferraris that Kimi designed :eek: He'd had won every race.

So we can rest assured Kimi is a great designer and a crap driver whilst Alonso is a crappy designer and a driving Messiah.
It's not a Kimi bash just an honest answer to an honest question.


Very well played.

#82 se7en_24

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:06

Well not really very well played because we know both Massa and Ferrari are very different to a few years ago.

#83 mardmarium

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:07

GSiebert, on Mar 31 2012, 10:43, said:

Fact is, when the car is bad, its not Alonso's fault cause he's not an engineer, and the day it'll be fast, he'll get all the rewards for his awesome developpment and motivating skills.


How do you think Ferrari people feel after the last win? Do you think that they are demotivated?

I'm wondering if some people know what engineers do, what they have estudied, how they have to improve their knowledge during their life (I know what I'm talking about), because this thread seems to reduce all that to "the driver is useless because he can´t design=develop a good car"... I know that the F1 drivers are intelligent people, I know that Alonso is one of the most intelligent drivers, but even he would have to study during some years to obtain engineer´s knowledge. I'm thinking about all the time you can spend studying aerodynamics, but it seems that Alonso only needs to drive a car to know all the answers, if not, he isn´t a good driver because he isn´t a good designer/developer :confused:

this thread makes sense... as a joke. If that´s not the case, really, what are you talking about?... I suppose that hate is in the air :cool:

#84 fieraku

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:12

se7en_24, on Mar 31 2012, 06:06, said:

Well not really very well played because we know both Massa and Ferrari are very different to a few years ago.

Everything is different to a few years ago.

#85 se7en_24

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:14

fieraku, on Mar 31 2012, 12:12, said:

Everything is different to a few years ago.

Exactly, which is why these kind of comparisons are pointless.

#86 fieraku

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:17

se7en_24, on Mar 31 2012, 06:14, said:

Exactly, which is why these kind of comparisons are pointless.

So why disagree with my pointless post in a pointless thread?I was just making a pointless point.

#87 ensign14

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:20

Andy865, on Mar 30 2012, 23:53, said:

:rotfl:

This must be a wind up. What a thicko.

kvarbanov, on Mar 31 2012, 03:29, said:

One of the most funniest threads I've recently seen. Rated one star (no zero option).

walkindude, on Mar 31 2012, 08:08, said:

Threads like these give me so much joy when Fernando stamps his authority as the best driver out there again and again.Well done.Keep up the comedic value.

Trust, on Mar 31 2012, 08:20, said:

How is thread surviving this long?

Supersleeper, on Mar 31 2012, 09:59, said:

This is just an "I hate Fernando Alonso" thread. It's an embarrassment to these forums.

Massa, on Mar 31 2012, 10:10, said:

Why this thread is not closed ?

puxanando, on Mar 31 2012, 10:36, said:

:rolleyes: OMG...what a thread!
You can't even find anymore to make Alonso bad??

Just thought I'd quote some of the reasoned response to the OP. I was expecting McLaren to fall back in 2008 without the experience of Alonso to help with the car, they didn't, and Ferrari is not where it was back then...awkward facts that cannot be dismissed with mere abuse.

Dunder, if you're still reading this far, how far would (could) a team set up their model these days to suit one driver's style to the absolute detriment of the other? We've certainly seen in the past Ferrari is more willing to throw away the constructors' title for the drivers', is it possible that Clifford has been developed to Alonso's sensibilities to such an extent that Massa can't drive it - and that in seeking to follow Alonso's wishes Ferrari has somehow found itself down a difficult track?

#88 Skellen

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 11:28

se7en_24, on Mar 31 2012, 12:06, said:

Well not really very well played because we know both Massa and Ferrari are very different to a few years ago.

Check out the meaning of the word "irony" in your dictionary. Then you will find out what Fieraku meant.

#89 as65p

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 12:02

ensign14, on Mar 31 2012, 13:20, said:

We've certainly seen in the past Ferrari is more willing to throw away the constructors' title for the drivers', is it possible that Clifford has been developed to Alonso's sensibilities to such an extent that Massa can't drive it - and that in seeking to follow Alonso's wishes Ferrari has somehow found itself down a difficult track?


I can't believe you wrote that. How did you fool me for so long into believing you were one of the smarter guys around?



#90 se7en_24

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 12:03

Skellen, on Mar 31 2012, 12:28, said:

Check out the meaning of the word "irony" in your dictionary. Then you will find out what Fieraku meant.

Is he related to Alanis Morissette then?

I think you are mixing the word irony up with sarcasm. I care about this, lots.

Edited by se7en_24, 31 March 2012 - 12:04.


#91 flowerdew

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:18

se7en_24, on Mar 31 2012, 07:03, said:

Is he related to Alanis Morissette then?

I think you are mixing the word irony up with sarcasm. I care about this, lots.


No, he means irony.

#92 rabbitleader

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:34

If Alonso is said to be a leader by his fanboy followers, then perhaps he should take some responsibility for the mixed results he has had with Ferrari so far. Another poor season for Ferrari but that won't be down to Alonso will it. A crap car and Alonso has a perfect excuse to come 10th and some would still say he did a great job.

Being consistently faster than a truly crap team mate driver is not worthy of any praise.





#93 Andy865

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:44

Good lord, fanboys are awful.

All the driver does is set up and drive the car. The way some idiots go on here is that he spends 16 hours a day in the wind-tunnel refining its diffuser. Absolute shocking ignorance. How can people be so thick!??

Quote

If Alonso is said to be a leader by his fanboy followers, then perhaps he should take some responsibility for the mixed results he has had with Ferrari so far. Another poor season for Ferrari but that won't be down to Alonso will it. A crap car and Alonso has a perfect excuse to come 10th and some would still say he did a great job.

Being consistently faster than a truly crap team mate driver is not worthy of any praise.


Just, what? Why should he be responsible for a car being slow or fast? Crass, bigoted, biased, mouth-breathing ignorance.



How can people still be so bitter about Kimi getting fired and 2007? Nauseatingly stupid.

Edited by Andy865, 31 March 2012 - 13:49.


#94 2ms

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:48

Guys let's not get insecure and butt-hurt over an obviously valid question.

Edited by 2ms, 31 March 2012 - 13:49.


#95 SCUDmissile

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:50

the fact is that drivers test a lot less than before, and have a lot less influence. if there was more testing, we would see how well the drivers can develop a car.
but this thread just seems like a WUM.

#96 rabbitleader

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:51

Andy865, on Mar 31 2012, 14:44, said:

Good lord, fanboys are awful.

All the driver does is set up and drive the car. The way some idiots go on here is that he spends 16 hours a day in the wind-tunnel refining its diffuser. Absolute shocking ignorance. How can people be so thick!??



Just, what? Why should he be responsible for a car being slow or fast? Crass, bigoted, biased, mouth-breathing ignorance.



How can people still be so bitter about Kimi getting fired and 2007? Nauseatingly stupid.


Agree 100%.

Edited by rabbitleader, 31 March 2012 - 13:51.


#97 Reinmuster

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:53

Fernando just win at Sepang with the crap car. How's he responsible to this awfulness car Ferrari ever produce since 2009?




#98 SirRacer

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:54

Haters gonna hate

#99 goingthedistance

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:57

Peter Windsor made the interesting point in his podcast this week that due to the sophisticated telemetry they have these days driver feedback is of minimal use in setting the car up. So teams just want drivers that can knock in the quick laps. He made the point that this was part of why Williams was fine with losing Rubens last year, it just isn't as saleable a quality as it once was.

It may also explain why some teams are happy to throw in two rookies at once.


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#100 Octavian

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Posted 31 March 2012 - 13:59

Where have his six tenths disappeared to?;)
I think he really regrets saying that!

That being said, a driver only provides feedback and Alonso is known as one of the best in the business for providing incredibly detailed feedback - it's then up to the team to translate that in to something they can use to extract more performance from a design so a bad Ferrari car would never be Alonso's fault. He aids the team, not hinders it.