64 replies to this topic

[Annoying Twit]

I don't think that Le Mans needs 'big names'. If there weren't manufacturers, then the existing teams would become 'big names' due to the exposure of doing well in races. That's how it used to work in motor racing, and I think it could still work again if there were no manufacturers. 

[tormave]

I really like endurance racing, but haven't really cared much WEC for a long time. 4 categories is just too much. GT3 and some kind of prototypes would be plenty. Bathurst, Blancpain, IMSA are just better, with huge GT3 car variety compared to the tiny field in GTE. Sure there was drama in Le Mans, but it was mostly related to attrition.

[Montie]

In order for the LMP1 to survive they need to get rid of the hybrid technology.

[RCH]

Annoying Twit; It's the big manufacturers that draw the crowds. Casual followers of F1 are Hamilton or Vettel etc. fans with Ferrari being the exception, that's where Ford made their mistake when they pushed Jaguar as an F1 team. Casual followers of sports cars are Audi or Porsche or Toyota fans. Remember the ACO claiming 30 to 50,000 more spectators when Jaguar were competing and the track was lined with Brits waving flags.

 

To the true enthusiast it matters not but the paying crowds keep the race going.

 

Sorry folks, probably me being dense but I cannot get the quote function to work.

[V8 Fireworks]

Class 1: LMP2 with different engines, including manufacturer teams with some kind of engine (non-hybrid) BOP'ed to match the Gibson V8?

Class 2: GT3 using Blancpain GT BOP settings (whether the manufactures like it or lump it)

 

Simple? 

[V8 Fireworks]

RCH, on 25 Jun 2017 - 07:56, said:

Annoying Twit; It's the big manufacturers that draw the crowds. Casual followers of F1 are Hamilton or Vettel etc. fans with Ferrari being the exception, that's where Ford made their mistake when they pushed Jaguar as an F1 team. Casual followers of sports cars are Audi or Porsche or Toyota fans. Remember the ACO claiming 30 to 50,000 more spectators when Jaguar were competing and the track was lined with Brits waving flags.

 

To the true enthusiast it matters not but the paying crowds keep the race going.

 

Sorry folks, probably me being dense but I cannot get the quote function to work.

 

There are lots of manufacturers in WTCC, yet it's still not popular...

[RCH]

Don't get me on touring/saloon cars! You need names to stir the soul, Jaguar, Alfa Romeo, BMW.... Lada, Vauxhall (despite having rallied both) don't really cut it for me. Also I'm afraid I lost interest when the world suddenly decided that touring cars started and finished at 2 litres. Also not really races to stir the imagination are they?  Six hour duration minimum needed.

[Nonesuch]

RCH, on 25 Jun 2017 - 07:56, said:

Casual followers of F1 are Hamilton or Vettel etc. fans

The etc being key. A lot of people simply latch on to who is successful, and these two guys have won all but two of the titles in the last 10 F1 seasons.

 

When Vettel and Hamilton are gone there'll be new guys to be "fans" of. Hopefully the selection will be a bit more diverse by then.

[Vielleicht]

Interesting read:

http://sportscar365....gen-lmp1-rules/

 

Common platform between WEC and IMSA now looking achievable?

 

- Single, low power hybrid system

- ‘Off-the-shelf’ hybrid powertrain for small-volume manufacturers/privateers.

- Target annual budget of 20-35 million Euros.

- Possibility of mandating the customer sales of all factory prototypes

[Nonesuch]

It'll be interesting to see what comes out of it this time. IMSA runs only one prototype class this year, but they've run multiple before.

 

Let's hope they can come to some middle-ground. While both had good reasons for going their own LMP2-way, it was still a bit silly and a wasted opportunity.

[Ben1445]

Vielleicht, on 09 Apr 2018 - 12:42, said:

- Single, low power hybrid system

- ‘Off-the-shelf’ hybrid powertrain for small-volume manufacturers/privateers.

- Target annual budget of 20-35 million Euros.

- Possibility of mandating the customer sales of all factory prototypes

This all sounds reasonable to me.

 

Said it before but hybrid is here to stay, like it or not. There's just too much (current and/or  future) manufacture desire for them they'd be shooting themselves in the foot not to. 

 

Would really love to see teams still pushing the very limits of hybrid tech but we've done that already and budgets went into stupid mode, so pulling it back to a sensible level budget wise but keeping hybrids in the mix is probably good. Better to allow the smaller manufacturers and privateers to buy a spec system rather than keeping them as non hybrid. 

 

Also big fan of mandating customer sales. The number of times I've heard about how glorious all those customer Porsche 956 and 962s were 'back in the day'... 

[thegforcemaybewithyou]

Ben1445, on 09 Apr 2018 - 13:35, said:

Would really love to see teams still pushing the very limits of hybrid tech...

 

Looks like Porsche is doing exactly that right now with an upgraded LMP1. 1200hp, skirts, DRS, wider wing.

 

http://www.dailyspor...919tribute.html

http://www.dailyspor...919-hybrid.html

 

Faster than the 2017 F1 pole according to this report: http://www.endurance...9-hybrid-a-spa/

[Nonesuch]

An impressive time - even if it's not really an LMP1 car if they just throw the regulatory restrictions aside.

[Vielleicht]

Ben1445, on 09 Apr 2018 - 13:35, said:

Would really love to see teams still pushing the very limits of hybrid tech but we've done that already and budgets went into stupid mode...

A golden era that I shall look back on fondly.

 

But yes, a more sensible future is needed and I think the ideas so far are looking like they might be able to provide that.

[TF110]

Nonesuch, on 09 Apr 2018 - 14:37, said:

An impressive time - even if it's not really an LMP1 car if they just throw the regulatory restrictions aside.

Back in 2015, the power was already at those levels. It's actually around 1100ps which is less than the rumored 1200hp. Some skirts, bigger front and rear wings, diffuser, slightly less weight (still heavier than 2018 private lmp1's), no fender holes or lights and no lift and coast- lap record. Lmp1 would be doing these types of laps or close to them without the constant slowing of the cars. They were significantly slowed from 2015, then slowed even more from 2016 and yet still the record at Le Mans was shattered by the Toyota. Too bad these cars don't get to go all out because they'd be second to none. I think that's exactly why they're not allowed to continue to develop as-is, not just safety. 

 

As for the future of the class, if customer cars come back it could be like GT1 of the late 90s with them running in more than just the WEC.