12 replies to this topic

[August]

I've seen some IndyCar fans saying races lasting 1 ½ to 2 hours are too short for the people on site, instead those races should be 2 to 3 hours long. On the other hand, some people are saying F1 races lasting over 1 ½ hours are too long for TV and should be just over 1 hour.

 

For me this depends on the profile of the series. In a premier championship with up to around 20 races, I'd like the races to be 2 to 3 hours, especially if I was attending the race. (Although even 1 ½ hours of F1 feels too much these days.) This is where I think NASCAR has got it wrong for me; with 36 races, a single race doesn't feel worth spending 3 to 4 hours watching it. 2 to 3 hours isn't really so long; a three-set tennis match goes usually above two hours and a round of golf usually takes around 4 hours.

 

Sports cars are a different case. IMSA's 2 hours, 40 minutes feels like the absolute minimum for a race with driver changes. I prefer the 3hr Blancpain endurance races way over the 1h sprint races. I find something between 3 and 4 hours ideal for a regular sportscar race; 6 hrs is already too much for a regular WEC round.

 

Flagship races should obviously be longer. 3 to 4 hours like Indy or Daytona 500 feels just about right; it's like watching a grand slam tennis match. Indy wouldn't feel the same if it was 300 miles completed in less than two hours. Though anything above 4 hours feels too long (Coke 600), unless it's an endurance race. 24 hour races have their own charm, though I kinda prefer 12hr races as they are easier to watch in their entirety but still feature some night racing.

 

MotoGP is still cool even though the races are only about 40 mins. It's a nice Sunday afternoon break, though the races are still more like episodes of a series rather than movies. For those attending the race, MotoGP at least has a great support package. Though watching from TV, I think there's too much time between the classes, taking too much of my time.

 

I said this depends on the profile of a series. I'm not sure I'd spend regularly 2 hours to watch DTM but like MotoGP it's a nice afternoon break with a relatively short race.

 

If I was attending a race, there should be a long headline race or a good support package if the headline race isn't that long. F1 obviously has a good weekend structure. In addition to the headline race, there's quite an interesting support package, and the qualifying is probably more important than in any other series. Also NASCAR has obviously a good package for a weekend, in addition to the Cup race there's an Xfinity or Truck race the previous day. IndyCar kinda lacks the big draw far Saturday unless it's a doubleheader race like Detroit or there's an IMSA race. In a way, shorter doubleheader races might be better for the people attending the race. On the other hand, it might mean there are races too often for TV viewers. It may work for DTM but not for IndyCar which wants to present itself as a major league.

[LuckyStrike1]

It's not broken. Don't fix it. 

[August]

It's not broken. Don't fix it. 

 

This is a good point. F1 fans wouldn't like races as long as in NASCAR, NASCAR fans wouldn't like races as short as in F1.

 

I kinda like variety of race formats. Obviously F1 and MotoGP have such standard race formats because of traditions. Though in other series I might like even more experimenting. If it's a venue where people come for the weekend, shorter doubleheader races might make sense. But if there's a strong co-headliner or the venue is located nicely for a one-day visit (like in the outskirts of a major city), then offer those one-day visitors as much as you can with a long race. That kind of variety would also show which formats work and which don't.

[PayasYouRace]

I think there's a reason that, in general, most forms of entertainment fit into the 1 1/2 to 2 hour length. Be they movies, concerts, sporting events, etc. Once you start getting beyond that you're into endurance territory, not just for participants but also for spectators, viewers, listeners, etc.

 

This also applies to the day-goers or campers at the track. If you're going to be at a venue for an entire day or more, the action needs to be varied or have suitable breaks, even if it's just for eating/toilet/sleep breaks. The only real exceptions are long endurance events, where it doesn't matter as much if you miss a bit while you take care of personal admin.

 

With MotoGP it's a bit different because there are the 3 classes to consider, all of which are essentially their own world championships. In recent years they've seemed to become seen more as feeder/support events but that wasn't the way it evolved. For F1, the Grand Prix has generally only been a single, big event for the big cars, and Indycar races have tended to be similar, given they ultimately have similar origins.

 

This touches on something I've often found weird about how we tend to do our racing nowadays. Sports car racing is almost always some sort of endurance event. Touring cars tend to be the short and snappy races, with multiple in a day. Stock car races are very long for no discernible reason other than tradition.

[Dalton007]

It's not broken. Don't fix it. 

 

Which is precisely why they will tinker with it.    

[Jovanotti]

This is a good point. F1 fans wouldn't like races as long as in NASCAR, NASCAR fans wouldn't like races as short as in F1.

At races like Silverstone or Monza I'd actually wish for longer races, one of the reasons why I enjoy Singapore is that it's often close to the 2 hrs limit and a real challenge, concentration wise, for the drivers.

[Cornholio]

I've got to admit I find it strange the moaning (although never from actual fans watching the thing, I notice) about the approx 90 min length of a Grand Prix being too long. A football match, other various ball sports, a film, all last similar lengths and those things don't seem to come under fire "because attention spans". T20 cricket is held up as some utopia in this regard but actually lasts longer, it's just shorter relative to a 5 or 1-day match.

 

Personally I tend to be the longer the better, within reason. A 24 hour race would be my maximum, and can appreciate it in a different way, I'm not exactly glued to the screen throughout, but I'll have it on while doing other things through the day, and is an excuse for an all-nighter, keeping tabs and almost subconciously absorbing how the race is developing. The 500 milers in IndyCar are probably my favourites, and while I very very rarely watch NASCAR, if I do watch one it's always a 500+ miler.

 

A Grand Prix is a nice middle ground, slightly shorter races (e.g. GP2, FE) are a bit meh but can still get into them. F3/GP3/F4 type lengths I can still watch, although it feels like those races often don't really get the chance to develop before they're over.

 

I've never gotten into drag racing however, and not because I'm one of these "there's no skill involved in driving in a straight line" types, it's just over too damn quickly. In the same way that if I watch the Olympics the 100m tends to be my least favourite event. I don't watch Rallycross for similar reasons.

 

But specific to Grand Prix racing, I wouldn't be up for lengthening the races, just not shortening them either, as I say, it feels like a good middle ground of a length, and can only echo the sentiments above of it not being broken.

[Sterzo]

I kinda like variety of race formats.

Exactly, and I think your opening post pretty much covers the subject.

 

The number of races also has an influence. Grand Prix racing has drifted from a small number of long races to a large number of shorter races. Not saying that's wrong - I think the two tend to go together. (Nascar being the exception to prove the rule).

 

British F3 has three twenty minute races per weekend, and other F3 series follow a similar pattern. I think that's pushing the limits a bit, because the three are spread over two days, and travelling for four hours for one twenty minute race on Saturday is not very enticing.

 

In the past I've enjoyed five lap races around the Silverstone club circuit, but those were for Vintage cyclecars, and a minute or two after watching them leave the grid I heard the "out in the country" commentator ask: "Have they started yet?"

[Nonesuch]

It's an interesting question, as the answers vary so much between series, and how the races are seen.

 

I have no problems sort-of following Le Mans live for 24 hours straight, but every time I've been at a WEC race there's been a moment - I guess around three hours or so in, that I had to 'take a break' from following the action.

 

For F1, I wouldn't mind if they changed the 305 kilometers to something like 100minutes+1lap, but that is quite a change in how the races are approached. It'd make Monza a much longer race, for one - and I'm not sure how well that works with the #SaveTheEngine style of racing these days. I like that F1's longer races open up various strategic options and 'stories' in a race, even if these days I prefer to watch the races in condensed form as a highlight or just by fast-forwarding through my own recordings.

Edited by Nonesuch, 04 August 2018 - 14:04.

[GrumpyYoungMan]

What’s wrong with the current F1 GP format?!

You could always do a sprint race of say half the GP distance and then a full GP distance?

Biggest problem to that is the expected lifespans of the components

Edited by GrumpyYoungMan, 04 August 2018 - 17:23.

[SirVanhan]

Nice try Liberty Media. You'll never have our approval for a sprint race.

[SonGoku]

Sprint races would be a disaster for F1, you only have to watch F2. Basically the first lap decides everything and you don't have any time as driver/team to change that, because there is no time to do something with the strategy. No thanks.

[jonpollak]

Like cornholio I love the 500 mile races for Indycar.

The F1 races are fine where they are.

It's NASCAR races that are way too long. Especially when they just tool around for 300 laps and then all hell breaks out in the last 20.

 

Jp