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3-litre Formula One on OldRacingCars.com


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#1 Allen Brown

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 16:18

I would be very interested in TNFers' comments on a new area of OldRacingCars.com that I have started to publish today.

 

People have asked why it isn't possible to access full Formula One results on OldRacingCars.com, despite being able to see each car's results when you look at its race history.  After years of making unconvincing excuses, I have started today publishing the full results of each season, starting with 1966.  My intention is to show each and every car that was present at each race weekend, whether it was a race car, a T-car, or even an unused spare.  In a few cases, it has even been possible to identify cars that were brought along just for display purposes.  For each car, I have tried to make sure the engine is correctly identified, something that is a greater challenge in 1966 and should get simpler as I go further through.

 

Quite a few of you here share my interest in this period, so I would welcome any comments, corrections and additions.  

 

It starts here:

https://www.oldracingcars.com/f1/1966/



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#2 jcbc3

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 16:41

I would be very interested in TNFers' comments on a new area of OldRacingCars.com that I have started to publish today.

 

...

Quite a few of you here share my interest in this period, so I would welcome any comments, corrections and additions.  

 

 

 

I have no corrections or additions but I do have a comment.

Wonderful. Keep at it!



#3 Doug Nye

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 17:46

Hmm "World Drivers Championship".  What's a World Driver?  They are Formula 1 car drivers.  It's the Formula 1 Drivers World Championship.    :smoking:

 

Otherwise - as above - wonderful.

 

DCN



#4 Michael Ferner

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 18:25

Oh no, Doug :eek: Don't open THAT can of worms again! :eek: :eek:

 

 

Allen, it's a great idea, and should be an excellent resource. I have one suggestion: in the championship points table, I would list only the top ten like you do with the other series you cover - looks more tidy, and no one will come to your site to find out who was 14th in points in 1966, anyway.



#5 Allen Brown

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 20:05

OK, technically the World Championship of Drivers.  I went for the more commonly-used expression, and should probably change that. But definitely not called the Formula 1 Drivers World Championship, not in 1966.  I think Doug may be being mischievous.  

 

Yes, Michael, top 10 only might be better, but there were so many interesting car/engine combinations further down, I just kept going.   



#6 E1pix

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 20:18

Kudos for developing this... and to Rob Ryder!

#7 10kDA

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 20:27

 in the championship points table, I would list only the top ten like you do with the other series you cover - looks more tidy, and no one will come to your site to find out who was 14th in points in 1966, anyway.

I don't know about this. I was looking for Bob Anderson's place in the 1964 standings a couple of days ago. 11th, same as Lando Norris in 2019.


Edited by 10kDA, 11 January 2021 - 20:33.


#8 10kDA

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 20:31

After looking at the 1966 page I can say only - Well done, Allen! Thank you for your efforts, and thanks to all others involved as well.



#9 Tim Murray

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 20:44

This is tremendous stuff - thank you Allen and team.

On championship points tables: I prefer always to see them listed in full, as then it’s fairly simple to check for errors by adding up all the scores and seeing if the total matches the number of championship rounds multiplied by the total points available per round.

#10 Allen Brown

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 21:11

This is tremendous stuff - thank you Allen and team.

On championship points tables: I prefer always to see them listed in full, as then it’s fairly simple to check for errors by adding up all the scores and seeing if the total matches the number of championship rounds multiplied by the total points available per round.

 

Then I do hope you'll enjoy the SCCA National tables, where drivers' best six results out of nine or ten or eleven races counted, but they could include within that two races from outside their division.  :)



#11 Michael Ferner

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 21:19

... or the 1973 European Championship for Formula 2 Drivers (a title Doug will like...  ;)). If I recall correctly, a driver could collect points in about a dozen "Grade A" events, and in the first four "Grade B" events he started, provided they were all held in a different country!!



#12 10kDA

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 22:23

... or the 1973 European Championship for Formula 2 Drivers (a title Doug will like...   ;)). If I recall correctly, a driver could collect points in about a dozen "Grade A" events, and in the first four "Grade B" events he started, provided they were all held in a different country!!

FIA: "Article 6.5(f) In the event of a tie, a hand of Fizzbin will be played to determine a winner. Called it! 1-2-3 No Changes."



#13 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 11 January 2021 - 23:13

As has been said in no end of threads in these forums often the car listed was not the one that appeared. 

So a thankless can of worms. Though should be quite interesting, if just on official entries and results that should not cause any grief.

You are right is saying that many pieces of history that came and went in the last 45 years. Most totally [sometimes gladly] forgotten. Some with potential and little money.



#14 Lola5000

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 04:02

Wonderful reference Web site ,keep it coming .



#15 john aston

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 07:52

Nye syndrome has made my eyebrow twitch at 'qualifying ' - 'practice' ? But that's a minor nitpick - I am sure it will be invaluable. Over the last few years I've needed to find full results of many Grands  Prix i that era and it has been surprisingly difficult to find detail away from the winners. I like the  complete entry being shown too - after this passage of time I tend to glaze over about  the performance of a star like Brabham or Clark- it's the no hopers in eighteenth , an heroic 10 seconds off the pace in an awful car that are really intriguing 



#16 Stephen W

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 08:05

This is tremendous stuff - thank you Allen and team.

On championship points tables: I prefer always to see them listed in full, as then it’s fairly simple to check for errors by adding up all the scores and seeing if the total matches the number of championship rounds multiplied by the total points available per round.

 

Beware making assumptions. Not all races had six finishers! 



#17 Tim Murray

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 08:14

Indeed, Steve, but obviously one will usually be aware of these anomalies when compiling or checking points tables.  ;)

#18 2F-001

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 11:15

I haven't had a moment to take a look yet** , Allen - but looking forward to a good browse...

 

I, too, baulked for a moment at Doug's comment - but then decided I had (probably) trodden in some irony.

 

(** Has anyone else found that, during these months of lockdowns, there simply aren't enough hours in the day?)  



#19 realracer200

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 11:33

Oh no, Doug :eek: Don't open THAT can of worms again! :eek: :eek:

 

 

Allen, it's a great idea, and should be an excellent resource. I have one suggestion: in the championship points table, I would list only the top ten like you do with the other series you cover - looks more tidy, and no one will come to your site to find out who was 14th in points in 1966, anyway.

 

What are you talking about? I for example am interesting who finished 14th in 1966.



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#20 Vitesse2

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 12:44

What are you talking about? I for example am interesting who finished 14th in 1966.

And we have a fascinating and informative thread about one who finished joint 17th.

 

https://forums.autos...hn-taylor-fire/



#21 Michael Ferner

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 13:16

Yeah, right, but that wasn't what I was trying to convey. I mean, people go to Allen's site because they want to know which car ran in which race, and the championship tables are "only" there to provide context. If you "just" want to know who was 14th that year, you're probably going to check with wikipedia or like sources, right? Of course, if you all think it's okay that the tables are complete, then who am I to protest - I just thought it looked nicer and tidier with a "short" list, that's all. :)



#22 Charlieman

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 13:35

In 1979, Jean-Pierre Jabouille's win was worth 13th place in the WDC. In 1980, his second career win was worth 8th place.



#23 Michael Ferner

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Posted 12 January 2021 - 15:21

Bah, humbug!

 

I respectfully disagree - a Grand Prix win is "worth" so much more than a 13th or even an 8th place in the WDC. Litmus test: Name any 8th place finisher without a GP win!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Still waiting...



#24 Stephen W

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 09:48

Bah, humbug!

 

I respectfully disagree - a Grand Prix win is "worth" so much more than a 13th or even an 8th place in the WDC. Litmus test: Name any 8th place finisher without a GP win!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Still waiting...

 

The waiting is over, Chris Amon.



#25 dgs

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 10:27

To have full results and practice times, plus alternative practice cars is just what is needed.

 

Its always better to have the full (and in this instance) accurate information



#26 Charlieman

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 10:38

I respectfully disagree - a Grand Prix win is "worth" so much more than a 13th or even an 8th place in the WDC. Litmus test: Name any 8th place finisher without a GP win!

Worth is one of those nuanced words, Michael. There's an English expression about people who know the price of everything and the value of nothing   ;)

 

My intended point was that a WDC table of the top ten would have omitted J-P J's win, significant and well deserved to him and historical historic as the first for a turbocharged F1 car.

 

Edited for correct English usage.


Edited by Charlieman, 13 January 2021 - 15:04.


#27 philippe7

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 14:04

Over the last few years I've needed to find full results of many Grands  Prix i that era and it has been surprisingly difficult to find detail away from the winners.

Allen is of course making a terrific job by embarking on this new venture, however for the record the ancient "silhouette" archive is still available online, and quite comprehensive ( clicking on the race initial at the top of each year's point table links you to detailed results of each Grand Prix )

 

http://www.silhouet..../1966/f166.html

 

 

edit : the main page is there http://www.silhouet....e/f1/title.html


Edited by philippe7, 13 January 2021 - 14:08.


#28 Doug Nye

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 14:51

WDC table?  WDC points?    :mad:

 

It should plainly - in English - be DWC - DWC - DWC...

 

NDC



#29 Michael Ferner

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 15:31

(...) 
NDC


:lol:

#30 Paul Taylor

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 16:08

ORC is a wonderful resource which I refer to often and this a great addition  :clap:  Yes, there are other sites where you can get race results, but to see the chassis numbers and the additional cars used/unused in practice along with their race result is a huge bonus for me.



#31 DCapps

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Posted 13 January 2021 - 19:12

As ever, excellent work from Allen and those he has enlisted for his team. Well done, Allen.



#32 Allen Brown

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Posted 14 January 2021 - 13:41

I have added one more season:

 

https://www.oldracingcars.com/f1/1967/

 

Thanks to everyone for their comments, both on this thread and directly.  One suggestion was that I detail the sources I used, so I have added the exact references for the principal sources for each race.  

 

1968 will take a bit longer as there is more to check before it's ready.  



#33 charles r

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Posted 14 January 2021 - 15:21

Fabulous Allen, thank you. 3 litre heaven and so much of it!