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2023 Rallying thread (WRC, ERC, National, Historics, World RallyX)


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#1 BRG

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 10:38

The 2023 season is go.  Over the weekend, the Janner Rallye in Austria - traditionally a snowy one - ran as a tarmac event untroubled by the white stuff and it looks like the Monte Carlo Rally which starts in 10 days will be the same.  Whilst North America groans under many feet of snow, the Alps are sadly bare.  

 

I cannot see anyone matching Rovenpara this year.  Neuville and Evans are quite quick enough and Tanak in a Puma is going to be a threat.  Yawn....



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#2 ArnageWRC

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 10:38

9th January, and still no thread, so here goes.

 

One hopes it will be an interesting season, and we can get more comments than we usually see - but as ever, the sport is mainly behind a paywall, and that isn't helpful for comments.

 

The Jannerrallye was the weekend gone, with live coverage on YouTube, won by Adrien Fourmaux in a M-Sport FIesta R2.

 

In the WRC it's hard to see past Toyota and Rovanpera, with support from Evans, Ogier & Katsuta; Hyundai will once again be all behind the often fast, but fragile Belgian, Neuville - and can Tanak work his magic on the Puma R1?

 

 

https://dirtfish.com...nner-rally-win/

 

 

https://dirtfish.com...s-2023-shakeup/

 

 

https://dirtfish.com...ufacturer-boom/


Edited by ArnageWRC, 09 January 2023 - 10:41.


#3 Risil

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 11:39

Amazing, two OPs literally at the same time



#4 ArnageWRC

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 12:21

Amazing, two OPs literally at the same time

 

I replied on the Rally 2022 thread, and suggested someone start one....



#5 BRG

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 15:33

Two cars started on the same minute.  A definite rallying no-no!

 

block.jpg

 

And a little something to remember the sadly late Ken Block.



#6 messy

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 15:42

I'm pinning everything on Tanak "doing an Ogier" on his return to M-Sport and taking the fight to Kalle but I don't really see it. How many events is Ogier doing in 23?

Beyond them Neuville will be quick right up to the point where he goes into a ditch, Evans, Katsuta, Breen and co will continue to solidly do a job and Rovanpera will keep winning. I don't see much more drama that that, although we might get lulled into thinking it'll be close if Kalle struggles in Monte Carlo again.

Edited by messy, 09 January 2023 - 15:42.


#7 noikeee

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 16:42

Is Kalle's middle name "Seb" by any chance? Because I can see him doing the next few years what Loeb and Ogier did: make all of this very boring.
 
Hope I'm wrong.


#8 messy

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Posted 09 January 2023 - 22:47

It’s annoying, isn’t it, that the WRC in the modern era always seems to have a dominating force.

Before Loeb arrived I remember the days when Sainz, McRae, Makinen, Kankkunen, Gronholm etc were all pretty much tied in the ‘greatest of all time’ lists on 24/25 wins apiece. Look at the stats now! Over to Kalle.

#9 BRG

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Posted 10 January 2023 - 09:46

Part of that is that the WRC car formula has led to a dominant car.  Pre-Loeb, you could conceivably just buy a Evo VIII or whatever, rock up and win.  Now there are only a dozen at most who can win, and most of those are in the wrong car, and the chosen one in the best car wins everything.  It is exactly what wrong with the path they have taken with the WRC



#10 ArnageWRC

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Posted 10 January 2023 - 10:28

Part of that is that the WRC car formula has led to a dominant car.  Pre-Loeb, you could conceivably just buy a Evo VIII or whatever, rock up and win.  Now there are only a dozen at most who can win, and most of those are in the wrong car, and the chosen one in the best car wins everything.  It is exactly what wrong with the path they have taken with the WRC

 

Yeah, and so few manufacturers think the WRC offers enough value for the costs involved. Only one manufacturer seems willing to spend big, and the others make up the numbers. Rinse and repeat. It's over 20 years since the high point of 6-7 manufacturers with 3-4 drivers each. 

 

The easy conclusion is that the sport had been mismanaged in those 20 years.....



#11 Jvr

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Posted 10 January 2023 - 12:21

Toyota has an upgraded aero package and those ugly hybrid air intake scoops are gone.  Looks much better.

9ab50b84c7bfa77f8bd8d40413c5d83d.IMG-202



#12 BRG

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Posted 10 January 2023 - 12:54

Yes, that is better,  Now if they could get rid of the stupid Carlos Fandango rear wing.....



#13 FLB

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 11:06

New Team Principal announced - Hyundai Motorsport Official Website

 

hmsgofficial sur Twitter : "We are pleased to announce that Cyril Abiteboul will join Hyundai Motorsport in the role of Team Principal. Read more about his appointment on our website https://t.co/RcrYnJ9t6H #HMSGOfficial https://t.co/aniRhqgRpH" / Twitter



#14 BRG

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 11:21

The Arctic Lapland Rally is just underway.  An almost totally Finnish entry, but I see Kovalainen has jetted in from Japan and it will interesting to see how he gets on.

 

Anyone know if there is any snow around?  Europe seems to be very green at the moment (maybe not that far north though!) and we are facing a tarmac Monte Carlo Rally and a gravel Swedish Rally.



#15 Myrvold

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 11:45

and a gravel Swedish Rally.


60-100cm snow in that area of Sweden now.
It's even 20-40cm snow where Rally Swedeb usually were held.

#16 Jvr

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 12:37

There's plenty of snow in Arctic Lapland Rally.

Heikki Kovalainen has moved back to Finland and will be competing the full Finnish Rally Championship season. His co-driver will be a media personality Janni Hussi.



#17 Myrvold

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 14:15

There's plenty of snow in Arctic Lapland Rally.
Heikki Kovalainen has moved back to Finland and will be competing the full Finnish Rally Championship season. His co-driver will be a media personality Janni Hussi.


Miikka Anttilla in Lapland though.

#18 Jvr

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 14:48

Miikka Anttilla in Lapland though.

Oh, that's a good choice.

Have not checked the entry list but Kovalainen/Hussi pairing was announced in the media.



#19 BRG

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 15:37

Is he done with Super GT in Japan then?



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#20 Jvr

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 16:59

Is he done with Super GT in Japan then?

I think he was done with Super GT already after the 2021 season.
https://www.motorspo...per-gt/6832936/



#21 BRG

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Posted 12 January 2023 - 23:44

He was in Japan in 2022 though as he contested the Japanese rally championship.



#22 Jvr

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Posted 13 January 2023 - 09:26

There's seems to be a live (and free) Youtube stream from Arctic Lapland Rally. 

Link found from the rally home page:
https://arcticrally.fi/fi/etusivu/



#23 Jvr

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Posted 14 January 2023 - 14:45

Arctic Rally Lapland update:
1. Heikki Kovalainen did not have speed yesterday during first two stages. On the third one he hit a tree and broke front suspension arm forcing a retirement. He's not really been on the pace thereafter, either. 

2. Jari Huttunen was leading comfortably the rally until the super stage 7 this morning when he hit the snowbank and buried the car losing over 6 minutes and 40 seconds.

3. Final stage is just about to start with Teemu Asunmaa leading Juha Salo by only 0.6 seconds with the 31.51 km stage left.


Edited by Jvr, 14 January 2023 - 15:08.


#24 Jvr

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Posted 16 January 2023 - 13:47

Rally Sweden entry list has been published.
 

Sad state of the affairs is that there's only 52 cars participating.

 

Breen makes his return with Hyundai.

Rally2 entry list looks competitive and should be interesting with Solberg, Veiby, Lindholm, Suninen, Huttunen, Linnamäe, Kaur, Gryazin, Pajari, Virves, Joona and Bulacia (x2) among the competitors. 

 

https://www.wrc.com/...-Entry-List.pdf



#25 Myrvold

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Posted 16 January 2023 - 16:38

Rally Sweden entry list has been published.
 

Sad state of the affairs is that there's only 52 cars participating.

 

Since 2010, when Rally Sweden stopped the tiny alternating WRC round with Norway. 2010 (55), 2018 (66) and 2019 (61) is the only years with more entrants. In fact, a majority of the years it was under 50 cars. With 2014 being the worst year, with only 39 cars entered. So it's not a bad year in terms of entrants.

 

What's more striking is the lack of interest in the event from Norwegians and Swedes. It points to the rally being far away from the vast majority of the ones who does rally in both countries. In 2020 there was a couple of Norwegians, and 7 "local Swedes" participating, but it was a year where there was talk about Covid already, and not much snow at all.

In 2019, a year with proper snow and no risk of cancellations, there were a couple of extra Norwegians there, but 17 "local Swedes".

In fact, this year there are more Japanese entrants than Swedes. And there are more Spanish drivers than Norwegians and Swedes combined! 

This might be what makes it hard to run Rally Sweden up in Umeå for a long time, especially if they lose JWRC some time in the future. It's less accomodation, more expensive, and thus less interesting for locals to bring their sponsors and partners to the event as a showoff.

There's a lot more hotels and cabins in between Elverum - Arvika - Karlstad - Torsby than it is up north. Just way more accessible.

It's actually going to be interesting to see the European Championship "Royal Rally of Scandinavia", that are likely to use much of the WRC-roads from "old"/"classic" Rally Sweden, but during summer. Summertime Colins Crest?



#26 BRG

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Posted 16 January 2023 - 17:04

Is the Swedish Rally entry list closed?  Monte Carlo starts this Friday and has 75 on the list.  Still a far cry from the 200+ it used to attract in the past.



#27 Jvr

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Posted 16 January 2023 - 19:20

I think the Swedish Rally entry list closed last Friday. Hence it was now published.



#28 noikeee

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Posted 19 January 2023 - 19:45

The Monte is live!

#29 BRG

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 09:53

Ogier and Evans bossing it so far.  But that won't last.



#30 Hellow

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 11:58

Ogier and Evans bossing it so far.  But that won't last.

Jinxed for Evans. Without technical problems this should be Ogiers win.



#31 noikeee

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 13:13

Don't recall Evans having been this impressive in a long time, nevermind in the Monte of all places, slightly odd.

On WRC2 Gryazin looks super impressive.

Edited by noikeee, 20 January 2023 - 13:17.


#32 BRG

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 16:23

Don't recall Evans having been this impressive in a long time, nevermind in the Monte of all places, slightly odd.

He led the 2021 Monte for a few stages and finished 2nd.  Behind Ogier of course.

 

And he won Finland in 2021, taking half of the stages in the process, which is reasonably impressive, I'd say.



#33 noikeee

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 16:28

He led the 2021 Monte for a few stages and finished 2nd. Behind Ogier of course.

And he won Finland in 2021, taking half of the stages in the process, which is reasonably impressive, I'd say.


I was referring to a bad 2022 (and to him not being particularly well known as a tarmac driver). I do think Evans is a good rally driver and was developing into quite a tidy front runner in previous seasons.

I only follow WRC on and off here and there, so might be missing a fair bit of context, or course.

#34 BRG

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 16:49

Evans had an indifferent 2022 (at best) although he did take four 2nd places.  



#35 Jvr

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 18:55

Looks like there was a lot of tarmac cleaning from dirt.

 

Second runs through the stages were easily 10 - 15 seconds faster than the earlier run. Of course it was also later in the day so the temperatures were up but still.


Edited by Jvr, 20 January 2023 - 18:56.


#36 messy

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Posted 20 January 2023 - 20:45

Evans is odd, half the time you look at him and think he’s pretty average then he does something amazing. I’m still gutted he lost the 2020 title because he had one hand on it and would have been only the third British champion behind McRae and Burns. I was willing him to close that out at Monza and, yeah, didn’t happen. But last year I thought was deeply unimpressive, Latvala at VW level unimpressive. Just like 2018 was really unimpressive when he was promoted to the second M-Sport seat alongside Ogier. Which version are you going to get year on year?

I still consider him, Tanak, Neuville etc the “youngsters” though and they’re all in their mid thirties.

#37 Jvr

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Posted 21 January 2023 - 10:05

Loubet out and now Tänak suffering a power steering failure. Not looking very good for M-Sport.

 

Will Serderidis become the top scoring Ford driver?



#38 BRG

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Posted 21 January 2023 - 10:32

Loubet out and now Tänak suffering a power steering failure. Not looking very good for M-Sport.

 

Will Serderidis become the top scoring Ford driver?

He doesn't get driver or team points if he finishes down in 30th place or so, where he lies at the moment, does he?



#39 Jvr

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Posted 21 January 2023 - 10:58

VW Polo GTI R5 on fire on SS9. Let's see if the rerun i.e. SS12 will get cancelled.

https://twitter.com/...750211967188993



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#40 noikeee

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Posted 21 January 2023 - 13:22

I honestly wonder if I'd do better than Serderidis and I've never set foot on a racing car.

Kalle has been slowly recovering on Ogier, we might still have a fight for the lead here.

#41 ArnageWRC

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Posted 21 January 2023 - 13:32

Kalle is fine where he is, no point chasing after Ogier who is only doing the odd round here and there. Would be stupid to put it off, like Elfyn did last year.....



#42 BRG

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 11:40

I honestly wonder if I'd do better than Serderidis and I've never set foot on a racing car.

Kalle has been slowly recovering on Ogier, we might still have a fight for the lead here.

Come on, Jourdan is only 26 minutes behind Ogier, that's pretty stellar.

 

As for Kalle, if he can recover 23.5 seconds from Seb on a 15km stage, they can just award him the 2023 WRC and cancel the rest of the rounds.



#43 noikeee

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 11:43

I wrote that yesterday with quite a few stages to go and when he was cutting the gap quickly.. Obviously he's not making it now (and probably not trying)

#44 BRG

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 12:15

So you did.  Sorry!

 

But news just in, Kalle fastest on Power Stage and takes 5 seconds out of Ogier, so he was still on it!  So maybe they should just give him the trophy and take the year off....unless Ogier can be persuaded to do the whole season.



#45 noikeee

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 12:18

I felt a bit sorry for Tanak there, just losing the power stage at the very end, still a great time, nice little reminder of his talent. Hopefully him and M-Sport get a tiny bit better and start getting into the mix.

#46 Vesuvius

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 12:41

Nice rally. Ogier was great again as was expected, Kalle is improving on tarmac all the time and without being first on the road on thirsday/friday he would have likely won or at least given much bigger threat.
Evans was great as well, Neuville and Huyndai dissapointments. Tänak is driving as well as always but Ford really has to improve their power steering, it has been issue for them for 10 years.

#47 ArnageWRC

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 13:59

Ogier wins the overall, but Rovanpera takes the 'WRC competitors class' win, and sends a message that he's not going anywhere. One hopes M-Sport can get some reliability, and Tanak can make it an interesting season.



#48 Amz964

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 14:23

Mr Monte does it again. Will say hopefully everyone can close up to the Toyota's and hopefully M Sport with Tanak can challenge here and there.

#49 Bloggsworth

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 14:40

How the world has changed, I recall when the various starting points were reported on the evening news, this time I didn't even know it was taking place...



#50 messy

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Posted 22 January 2023 - 16:23

I just think that event rammed home the fact that Rovanpera really doesn't have a great deal to worry about from any of them. Ogier isn't doing a full year, Tanak's arrival hasn't magicked the Puma into the complete package and he'll probably take half a season to get into the groove, Neuville and Evans nearly men as usual. Remember when Neuville blitzed into the lead in 2017 here? I just don't see that kind of potential anymore. I'd love this season to prove ultra competitive but I just don't see it going that way.