544 replies to this topic

[Beri]

Its 2024 and in a matter of weeks Williams will kick off its season with their Season Launch. Not a car reveal. No, its a Season Launch.

 

 

Likely this will include a car wrapped in the new color scheme and the event being filled with hopes and dreams of the likes of Vowles, Albon, Fry, Sargeant and I suspect even Chadwick and Block will likely get their couple of minutes of fame.

 

Well, to be short as a lifelong Williams fan; I was over the moon with last years 7th placing. After years of shame and agony, Albon dragged that Williams through some of the best drives of any driver I have seen in a while. He performed on merit and then some. So if this continues and with the addition of Fry, someone I hold in high regard, there might even be a possibility that Williams can jump up a spot. Or maybe 2. But sadly and realistically, 2024 will also mark Williams' 12th winless season in a row.

 

So there is a lot to discuss. About the team and the car. About whether Sargeant is a good fit. If Dorilton continues with their good investments. If Vowles is making even a better and bigger mark for himself on the team.

 

So without further ado; the floor is yours. What will this season bring us as Williams fans?

Edited by Beri, 02 January 2024 - 13:20.

[DogEarred]

Firstly, the launch/reveal bullshine will be in New York.

[Beri]

Firstly, the launch/reveal bullshine will be in New York.

 

Catering more to the American market with an American owner, two American drivers (Block will drive for Williams in the F1 Academy) and two major American sponsors (Kraken and Duracell). Launching in New York is not a move that one must underestimate when considering these mentioned points. Albeit I'd rather had seen Williams their launch at Grove or to keep it close by; at the Oxford University campus.

[Beri]

I would like those better anyways: show up on track, present the car and drivers and then buckle up for testing the car days on end to prepare for the season.

 

In my mind this is exactly how it played out in the olden days:
 

 

 

But I seem to have forgotten that even those launches got a more "glamorous" event surrounding this:
 

 

So season launches like we know it today are not a new thing in that regard.

[KWSN - DSM]

Before the season I am naive (dumb?) enough to give all teams a chance to be the surprise of the season, and at a minimum be as good as they were the season prior. I agree that Albon had a very strong 2023, so strong that he could be drafted in by one of the bigger teams next time he is a free agent, alas I continue to have a low opinion of Sargeant as a F1 driver, and realistically expect only slight if any improvements by him.

 

Albon is the most valuable cog in the Williams wheel, the stories of the inadequate tools at base dripping into public the past 14 months or so is depressing, as I recall the Vowles interview some months back he more or less assured that they would still have inadequate tools in 2024. If last half of last season mean anything then hanging on to 7th will be a tall order.

[PayasYouRace]

That was just a livery launch in 1994 too. That’s the FW15C Damon and Ayrton are standing with.

 

Last chance for Sargeant. He’s better pick up his performances this year.

[Viryfan]

That was just a livery launch in 1994 too. That’s the FW15C Damon and Ayrton are standing with.

Last chance for Sargeant. He’s better pick up his performances this year.

FW15D, passive version of the FW15.

[Beri]

Otherwise known as the preseason test car for 1994 before the FW16 was ready. And also not really a livery presentation, as the drivers actually took the FW15D onto track that day.

[Burai]

Otherwise known as the preseason test car for 1994 before the FW16 was ready. And also not really a livery presentation, as the drivers actually took the FW15D onto track that day.

 
Something which the current regulations prohibit teams from doing, unfortunately.
 

Williams doing the same thing in 1995:

 

[southernstars]

I think this will be the season Sargeant flourishes. He is no longer at such a stark disadvantage to a lot of the other drivers, having a full season under his belt, the only track he and Oscar haven't raced at before is Shanghai, where everyone will be rusty; he's comfortable in the team setup and Vowles has undoubtedly given him an enormous confidence boost with his public backing. I think this is where we are more likely to see the fast, talented kid we saw rocketing around junior formulae. Albon seemed to really adopt him in the last part of the season too and probably sees a little of his own career in him.

 

Of course, that all depends also on how the car turns out.

[IrvTheSwerve]

I think this will be the season Sargeant flourishes. He is no longer at such a stark disadvantage to a lot of the other drivers, having a full season under his belt, the only track he and Oscar haven't raced at before is Shanghai, where everyone will be rusty; he's comfortable in the team setup and Vowles has undoubtedly given him an enormous confidence boost with his public backing. I think this is where we are more likely to see the fast, talented kid we saw rocketing around junior formulae. Albon seemed to really adopt him in the last part of the season too and probably sees a little of his own career in him.

 

Of course, that all depends also on how the car turns out.

I’m hoping for his sake that he hits the ground running this season. If he’s pointless by ten races in and Albon is in double figures, Sargeant is toast.

[TomNokoe]

It's been a long time since Williams have started a season with genuine upward trajectory. Really hope Vowles can get it right.

[Beri]

I’m hoping for his sake that he hits the ground running this season. If he’s pointless by ten races in and Albon is in double figures, Sargeant is toast.

 

I am one of the few people that advocated in favor of Sargeant all season long. Luckily he gets his second season. But no matter how much I was standing behind Sargeant, you are absolutely right.

[aportinga]

I would like those better anyways: show up on track, present the car and drivers and then buckle up for testing the car days on end to prepare for the season.

 

In my mind this is exactly how it played out in the olden days:
 

 

 

But I seem to have forgotten that even those launches got a more "glamorous" event surrounding this:
 

 

So season launches like we know it today are not a new thing in that regard.

 

I remember loving that outfit Senna is wearing.

 

My roomate worked at the Mech Exchange in Chicago and one of my jobs was at Mark Shale - so I hooked us both us. for my gals sorrority parties (bud went with her best friend).

 

We looked like gods vs the younger frat boys in khakis and deck shoes.

 

It paid off 

[DW46]

I remember loving that outfit Senna is wearing.

My roomate worked at the Mech Exchange in Chicago and one of my jobs was at Mark Shale - so I hooked us both us. for my gals sorrority parties (bud went with her best friend).

We looked like gods vs the younger frat boys in khakis and deck shoes.

It paid off

Fell out with a one eyed (literally) bouncer for calling out my “deck shoes”, in the North of England they are called Pumps or Converse, alas he couldn’t see the issue with the right amount of depth and perspective.

[PayasYouRace]

FW15D, passive version of the FW15.

I wasn’t sure if they did a normal suspension version just for testing. Cheers.

[Nathan]

That Coulthard quote is interesting as in fact he had signed his McLaren deal two months prior, so he actually wasn't talking $#it.

[Jellyfishcake]

£1.90 for Autosport back then too!

[Beri]

I wasn’t sure if they did a normal suspension version just for testing. Cheers.

As far as I know, the D also featured the new geometry of the rear suspension, that would be implemented on the FW16, which made it possible for the driveshaft to be enclosed around the gearbox.

[CrushedDreams]

Off Topic: Anyone remember the name of the importer/reseller of Autosport in the US (I believe before they were in 'stores')? They were in New Jersey (my memory is fading  )

Edited by CrushedDreams, 03 January 2024 - 18:50.

[Beri]

So, according to Decalspotters, Acronis, Financial Times and Bremont have been removed from the website. Meaning these sponsorships have come to a conclusion.

[Francesc]

Also, technical partnership with Mercedes extended until 2030.

[KWSN - DSM]

Once again today an article about how behind Williams was and is compared to all other teams, indicating this goes 20 years back, why do Williams think this is a boastable issue?

[JordanIreland]

Once again today an article about how behind Williams was and is compared to all other teams, indicating this goes 20 years back, why do Williams think this is a boastable issue?

 

I suspect, previous management was in total denial and believed they were a front running team using out of date methodologies. Frank is particular did not keep up with the times and as such his management style was not fit for purpose. They did well to keep things ticking over, but everything else was falling behind.

 

With the new management, they are simply saying, Williams from a baseline is so far behind (i.e. 20 years behind). As such, its going to take time and money to bring things back up to speed. Its a good strategy as it offers the team some time to grow.

 

I wouldn't say they are boasting about being so far behind, they are simply stating a fact, especially with James as the new team lead. It has worked already, as the cap on infrastructure for the lower teams has increased, so thats now an advantage for Williams. F1 is very much a business and a political midfield. Williams with James are starting to get active and that can only be a good thing in the longterm. 

[JordanIreland]

Nice interview with Pat Fry. No major revelations, but the culture at Williams seems really constructive and open:

https://www.formula1...9LTrpQ0GC5.html

[Beri]

Vowles and Williams were the main reason why the bottom 4 teams are now eligible to spend 20 million more on the CapEx budget. Meaning that Sauber, Alpha Tauri, Haas and Williams all are allowed to spend 65 million dollars over the period until 2025. Opposed to the 45 million dollars it was. Quoting:

 

 

For the 2025, 2026, 2027 and 2028 seasons the rolling four-year numbers then drop to $42m for the top group, $49m for the middle group and $56m for the bottom group.

 

By 2029 teams are all back on an equal footing with everyone on a total of $36m for that year and the three preceding it added together.

Source: https://www.motorspo...boost/10529470/

 

Dorilton has always said that they want to invest in the team. And the CapEx expenditure limit will be met. So its a good thing and Williams was certainly already in a transition phase. But now they are catching up as well. Vowles has hailed Williams' skill levels and production facilities. But he has outlined that there are significant issues that need to be addressed in order to maximize the potential. Like the absence of a dedicated and tailor made ERP system. Source: https://us.motorspor...owles/10505942/

 

All in all I am upbeat for the future of the team. Now lets hope that the drivers can take advantage of this (momentum).

[Beri]

So, a new font and brighter blue colors. Almost the Rothmans ones. Could we be in for a heritage livery?

 

[PayasYouRace]

Blue screen of death.

[Frood]

WILLIЯMS? WILLIaMS? Either way isn't great.

Edited by Frood, 17 January 2024 - 12:52.

[PayasYouRace]

Actually now I’m getting more ZX Spectrum vibes.

No problem with that A though.

[KWSN - DSM]

My heritage colors of Williams are white and green.

Edited by KWSN - DSM, 17 January 2024 - 14:19.

[DogEarred]

Actually now I’m getting more ZX Spectrum vibes.

No problem with that A though.

 

Everybody says how naff it is..

[Anja]

I thought the A was bad at first but it's instantly readable, at least for me. Just seems a bit out of place with the very ordinary rest of the font. That shade of blue is worse. 

[DogEarred]

Final crash test on first chassis passed today.

[Sterzo]

WILLIЯMS? WILLIaMS? Either way isn't great.

My question to Williams would be: why? Once upon a time, I worked for a company with 500 high street branches. Each branch had a projecting sign with the first letter of the company's name.  We spent nearly £1 million on changing the signs to a different font, followed by customer surveys. The most common answer was: "Didn't notice."

[DogEarred]

My heritage colors of Williams are white and green.

 

Happy Birthday, Kiss'em...

 

[southernstars]

If you haven't watched/listened to the High Performance Podcast with James Vowles, I highly recommend it. Apart from his lovely soothing voice (I had to put off listening to it until it was daytime because it was sending me to sleep), he gives such great insight into his mind, his attitude, and ultimately, where he wants to take and is going to take Williams.

 

After listening to that, I truly believe he will take Williams back to glory. It won't be quick. But if the board lets him do his thing, it will happen.

[cjm321190]

https://youtu.be/nYz...GKPNgGusUkgwz4W

Was about o post the same thing.

[absinthedude]

I passed a "Williams Racing" transporter truck on the motorway Friday evening. 

 

It had broken down and was being attended by a breakdown van. 

 

Still had the most recent logo on it. I am unsure what changing the logo is supposed to achieve. There tend to be two types of people with regard to logos. Most don't notice, and those who do were probably attached to the previous logo and don't like the change.

 

Still, if the car is fast and reliable people will like the logo. 

[cjm321190]

Just incase you have any friends new to F1, the Man United 90s glory hunter types.

Show them this:

https://youtube.com/...22WUQY3nezlfSDY

[FirstnameLastname]

Crazy to think two/three decades ago this would have been one of the most popular threads on the forum (if a forum existed in the 90’s)

And now it’s among the least popular

[Beri]

Crazy to think two/three decades ago this would have been one of the most popular threads on the forum (if a forum existed in the 90’s)

And now it’s among the least popular

 

This Thread would already have 10 pages of excitement, incredible drivers who were lined up for testing, a possible exciting new engine deal, a new color scheme, will Newey stay or will he go, etc..

[DogEarred]

True enough statement by FirstnameMiddlenameLastname.

 

But the new owners have discovered that there is a huge 'goodwill' nostalgic following around the world.

 

They are tapping into it by actively promoting & increasing 'The Brand' and 'The Heritage'.

 

This will become more apparent in the next few years. It should also become an extra source of income for the team.

 

Not necessarily aimed at us old gits who know the racing & technical history anyway but attracting the younger audience who will pay for 'Experiences' & merch.

[Beri]

True enough statement by FirstnameMiddlenameLastname.

 

But the new owners have discovered that there is a huge 'goodwill' nostalgic following around the world.

 

They are tapping into it by actively promoting & increasing 'The Brand' and 'The Heritage'.

 

This will become more apparent in the next few years. It should also become an extra source of income for the team.

 

Not necessarily aimed at us old gits who know the racing & technical history anyway but attracting the younger audience who will pay for 'Experiences' & merch.

 

Not only income in direct revenue. But I suspect goodwill and new fans as well over the course of time. The only thing would be; Williams needs to tap into this market. And where I see other teams having vast amounts of merchandise available and a true identity brand to sell, Williams is stuck on doing specials unrelated to the team and simply the team kit being sold. As an avid collector of the Williams team cap since the BMW days, I got every team cap that Williams has sold since 2005. But I would like to see more variation in the caps that Williams sells. McLaren offered around 20 different caps last year. Various designs that were driver related caps and team caps combined that is. This is something that needs to be addressed. I am buying Williams caps every year, but new fans might refrain from this due to the lack of choice. The 3 or 4 special caps that Williams presented, last year, were related to a certain Grand Prix event and not to the team. For instance; I would love to see Williams experiment with Gulf merchandise. Or bring out heritage caps. Have the white, blue and yellow Canon cap and replace "Canon" with a similar font "Williams" on it. Or the same with the Saudi, BMW or Rothmans ones. Because I can see a new fan getting drawn into this. The same way as McLaren gave the car its Marlboro design recently and tapped into this market with (limited) retro gear. And looking at Ferrari, they had their regular with black, the white, the complete red and the yellow team cap designs last year.

[KWSN - DSM]

If the Lotto grow to a couple of Billions after taxes, I will give Dorilton and offer they can not refuse, then rename the team and let Williams be resigned to the History books like Brabham, Tyrrel, Lotus and the like - And Scorpion Racing will start building a legacy.

[Beri]

If the Lotto grow to a couple of Billions after taxes, I will give Dorilton and offer they can not refuse, then rename the team and let Williams be resigned to the History books like Brabham, Tyrrel, Lotus and the like - And Scorpion Racing will start building a legacy.

And you were fuming about RB being a bad team name? 

[KWSN - DSM]

And you were fuming about RB being a bad team name? 

 

I most certainly was not.

 

Visa CashApp is a bad team name.

[DogEarred]

Reasonably big new sponsor to be announced tomorrow.

[Beri]

Reasonably big new sponsor to be announced tomorrow.

 

Source?

[Francesc]

I hope so! Would be cool to finally see the rear wing with an sponsor name over it.