1006 replies to this topic

[gowebber]

Well may as well start off the new thread for 2024. Happy New Year all!

 

So Racing Bulls and two American sponsors rumored to be Visa and Cash app. Should be very interesting times ahead for the team in 2024 with all the changes including new personnel in new CEO Peter Bayer and team principal Laurent Mekies from Ferrari.

 

Also some comments from Bayer recently too on Ricciardo.

 

"Bayer, though, was impressed with what Ricciardo brought to the table in his short time with the team, with his strengths coming to the fore to such an extent that even Tsunoda suggested the Perth man was a reference for him.

 

Yuki Tsunoda used Daniel Ricciardo as a reference during their time together in 2023

 

Bayer agrees, citing that for the team, Ricciardo made “a big difference, in many respects”.

 

“First of all, he’s a very experienced driver,” said Bayer. “He helped us with setup – tremendously! His feedback on setup is very precise.

 

“It’s not like he would say ‘I have an issue with the balance’. He will tell you there’s an issue with the rear in turn x, y, z, that he’s hitting the pedal and there’s something that doesn’t feel right, and asking the engineers to have a look.

 

“They will immediately look at the data and see there’s something with the differential or something like that, so he’s helping us a lot, and we can then translate that onto Yuki’s car, and it usually helps him.

 

“They have a slightly different driving style but in terms of the setup of the car, it’s helpful.

 

“He’s also helping on the strategic side. He will see something on track, that he’s stuck in a DRS train or something, that the car is not performing in a certain situation, and he will ask to pit to get some free air, so that experience is also helping us.

 

“He has also brought a lot of positive new energy to the team. He will cheer everyone up. He has been brilliant with that.

 

“Also, what I think is personally very, very important is that he is a true reference for Yuki.

 

“I also think, and maybe I shouldn’t say it, but Yuki needs that because he’s not yet a number one driver, and I think it helps him to have a more experienced driver with him."

 

https://speedcafe.co...oulder-in-2024/

Edited by gowebber, 03 January 2024 - 05:17.

[YamahaV10]

Is that really the name ? That is so bad. What a downgrade from Torro Rosso and Alpha Tauri

[gowebber]

Is that really the name ? That is so bad. What a downgrade from Torro Rosso and Alpha Tauri

 

Yeah not the best name I agree but thats what has been stated from a few sources. Might need to rename the thread if not, but almost a certainty apparently.

 

https://www.gpfans.c...e-racing-bulls/

 

https://twitter.com/...290928459894859

 

https://www.pitdebri...om-2024-onwards

 

https://www.racefans...ments-indicate/

Edited by gowebber, 03 January 2024 - 05:02.

[southernstars]

We're all gonna look a bit silly if it's not Racing Bulls, lol.

 

Tsunoda needs to deliver this year. It's year four. He's outgrown Tost's "rookies need three years" now. There is no longer any argument about how inexperienced he is.

 

This year will answer the real question for Ricciardo among his wider circle of critics. The Racing Bull is slated to be a much better car and he will have had a full off-season of preparation. He showed plenty of his old self last year but he will need to show more if he wants to snaffle Perez's seat.

[Risil]

Racing Bulls has strong 1990s F1 game with fake team names energy

[Hrco42]

Wait that's the actual new name of AT? When I saw the thread, I thought it was a joke name for Red Bull.

 

Who the hell thought that having two teams named Red Bull and Racing Bulls was a good idea?

[Beri]

Yeah not the best name I agree but thats what has been stated from a few sources. Might need to rename the thread if not, but almost a certainty apparently.

 

https://www.gpfans.c...e-racing-bulls/

 

https://twitter.com/...290928459894859

 

https://www.pitdebri...om-2024-onwards

 

https://www.racefans...ments-indicate/

 

There is not a source that 100 percent confirms it. So I think its a bit preliminary.

[Burai]

Wait that's the actual new name of AT? When I saw the thread, I thought it was a joke name for Red Bull.

 

Who the hell thought that having two teams named Red Bull and Racing Bulls was a good idea?

 

We've had Alfa Romeo and AlphaTauri co-existing for the past four years and everyone managed just fine.

[Bleu]

We've had Alfa Romeo and AlphaTauri co-existing for the past four years and everyone managed just fine.

 

At least they can be abbreviated AR and AT but when talking about RB it can be either Red Bull or Racing Bulls.

 

Also interesting to see how they call the chassis.

 

Red Bull has been RBxx

Toro Rosso was STRxx

AlphaTauri was ATxx

[Anja]

You can add three letters at the end of the name to make it make more sense. The first is H, the second is I... 

[FirstnameLastname]

They are all the same team essentially anyway. What’s the fuss.

Should have been braver and called them Redbu11 Racing & Redbu22 Racing

[danmills]

I think Yuki will be off to Aston before the end of the season so they can drop Lawson in.

[southernstars]

I think Yuki will be off to Aston before the end of the season so they can drop Lawson in.

 

I don't think Aston will make any changes mid-season. I suspect we will see Stroll step away to "pursue the Valkyrie project" at the end of the year and perhaps Tsunoda gets shifted across for next year; but if Lawson comes in at all this year it will be to fill the seat Ricciardo leaves vacant when he replaces Perez at Red Bull.

[PayasYouRace]

I think Yuki will be off to Aston before the end of the season so they can drop Lawson in.

It’s only the 3rd January and we’re already expecting a driver change mid season?

[DW46]

It’s only the 3rd January and we’re already expecting a driver change mid season?

At least we can just reuse the Checo thread.

[gowebber]

There is not a source that 100 percent confirms it. So I think its a bit preliminary.

 

Maybe not 100% *yet* but that trademark of the Racing Bulls name by Red Bull is certainly interesting. Guess we will find out soon

 

 

https://twitter.com/...094209495318772

Edited by gowebber, 03 January 2024 - 22:15.

[gowebber]

More about Ricciardo joining AT. Initially Red Bull didn't want to let him drive for them. Bayer kept enquiring and eventually Marko had final say and approved it after seeing how he went in the test.

https://www.mirror.c...atauri-31801778

Edited by gowebber, 03 January 2024 - 22:23.

[gowebber]

Racing Bulls has strong 1990s F1 game with fake team names energy

 

A'la like from one of these?    Man how games have progressed over time!

Edited by gowebber, 04 January 2024 - 02:02.

[loki]

Kick Red Bull…

[WouterF1]

Maybe not 100% *yet* but that trademark of the Racing Bulls name by Red Bull is certainly interesting. Guess we will find out soon

 

 

https://twitter.com/...094209495318772

Maybe, I say maybe this has something to do with this:

 

https://www.gpblog.c...-sport-too.html

[WouterF1]

Some quotes from a long interview with Peter Bayer, CEO AlphaTauri.
Translated with GT.

The whole interview in German.

 

 

More success despite less money? AlphaTauri boss Peter Bayer in an interview

'Team Faenza' is facing the biggest upheaval since the takeover by Red Bull. Peter Bayer is supposed to set the course for a new AlphaTauri. He presents his vision to MSM.

What does it look like on the driver side? Is it still part of the concept to train young drivers for Red Bull Racing?
Yes, Young Drivers Development is a very clear part of the philosophy that remains. But there is now also the opportunity to look at the whole thing again in detail: How do you do that at the moment? How deep do we go? I find it interesting that if you look around the market a bit, many of our competitors are already starting to secure talent in the karting area.

Kimi Antonelli is perhaps one of the best examples of top talents at this level being intercepted. We also have pilots in karting who are becoming very good. I think you have to look at, is the pyramid needed? At the moment we are extremely broadly positioned and have a large number of drivers in all series. But they know how it works. Helmut Marko is in charge.

This helps us as a team that can make a fresh start. We actually have the best conditions because we can build on everything that Franz Tost has built, on his life's work, which is a very strong foundation. At the same time, we have external consultants who support us and Salzburg who stand behind us and help us with global activation etc. Hence this repositioning within the market, in which we will get closer to the Red Bull family again.

Who ultimately makes the driver decisions at AlphaTauri?
The ones I noticed were discussed intensively with us. Everyone really sits at the same table. There were discussions in which Oliver Mintzlaff was involved, Franz Tost was of course involved in a leading role, but Christian Horner was also at the table at one point. Ultimately, the decision is made by Helmut Marko.

And that will remain so?
It will stay that way. The partners mentioned represent the ecosystem. You can explain it using Daniel Ricciardo as an example. When I started, I always looked a bit and thought to myself: If Nyck de Vries doesn't make it in terms of performance, then Daniel would be a great solution for us.

[Beri]

Maybe not 100% *yet* but that trademark of the Racing Bulls name by Red Bull is certainly interesting. Guess we will find out soon

 

 

https://twitter.com/...094209495318772

 

As WouterF1 has put out; the Racing Bulls can also mean its linked to something else.

Marketing wise seen, Racing Bulls is a weak name to have in Formula One. You cater the same niche market that Red Bull Racing is also doing. And sharing a large portion of your name, doesnt give you any good brand identity on your own. And since this has been the main reason as to why the Alpha Tauri name is dropped, I cant see Racing Bulls as a valiable option.

[William Hunt]

I can already imagine people, after they had a poor race, writing / saying 'Racing Bullshit' if  the name will be Racing Bulls. That alone, apart from other reasons, is a very good reason not to name the team Racing Bulls.

[Ragamuffin]

Wyld Stallyns would have been better.

 

[William Hunt]

They should have named it ... Minardi again and used the yellow-black colour scheme. Or why not name it 'Team Faenza', anything better as Racing Bulls....

[Beri]

The problem is that they are moving slowly but gently away from Faenza. With most of its design office already housed at the Red Bull campus in Milton Keynes.

[PayasYouRace]

They should have named it ... Minardi again and used the yellow-black colour scheme. Or why not name it 'Team Faenza', anything better as Racing Bulls....

Minardi’s colours were yellow, blue and white. It was a very dark blue, so I can see why you thought it was black.

[Beri]

Minardi’s colours were yellow, blue and white. It was a very dark blue, so I can see why you thought it was black.

 
Despite I know some pictures exist that do underline your opinion, I once stood next to an M189 and M185 and those were not blue. Those were black without the slightest doubt. So those pictures must give a false interpretation. Also on all the Minardi Forums, and all the other sources you can find, everyone is talking about black liveries.

 
Albeit I do agree that the original logo is blue and not black. Also in Formula 2 I am of the opinion that they indeed ran a very dark blue livery. But never in Formula One. Hence why you might have mistaken this for being the livery color. It is even said so, that the logo is blue, on the official Minardi website:
 
 

Furthermore, in those years the Minardi Team had also changed its logo in the light that the one used up till then was not suitable for fixing onto the nosecones. Gian Carlo therefore decided to take an old family coat of arms made up of a lion with a two pointed tail (which was also the symbol of the city of Faenza) and a green sword pointed down on a black background and started to modify it. The background then became blue, the yellow griffin with the tip of the blade pointed upwards, he added a tricolour underneath and all this was enclosed in a trapezium with the widest side at the bottom.

 
 
But, as said, the liveries were black in my humble opinion.
 
Edit for pictures underlining my statement:

Edited by Beri, 04 January 2024 - 13:10.

[le chat noir]

Chances of it becoming Alfa Romeo?!

And then in 2026 it can become Ford.

[Nathan]

The problem is that they are moving slowly but gently away from Faenza. With most of its design office already housed at the Red Bull campus in Milton Keynes.

 

As in, more than the aero team and whatever customer parts they are allowed to buy from RB1?

 

I think Yuki will be off to Aston before the end of the season so they can drop Lawson in.

 

What is happening with Alonso?

[midgrid]

 
But, as said, the liveries were black in my humble opinion.

 

 

 

From the same webpage, on the Minardi M185:

 

The objective of the first season in the highest series was naturally to qualify the yellow and blue car number 29 for the grand prix and to bring it the most times possible to the finish in order to acquire the experience needed to continue to improve and grow.

 

 

 

Although I agree that it certainly looks black in the photos!  Perhaps a truly black F1 car is reserved for a potential team entered by the Roman Catholic Church:

 

[PayasYouRace]

It’s definitely dark blue. Obviously can look black in a lot of light conditions and in photos.

[Laster]

https://racingnews36...for-three-years
So much for those rumours of Marko being ousted.

[FullThrottleF1]

This team should be sold to someone other than Red Bull

[Beri]

It’s definitely dark blue. Obviously can look black in a lot of light conditions and in photos.

Well now I need to make it my goal to once more see the car(s) in the flesh to judge it for myself. Because I can't believe for one second that I have been deceived by my own eyes that much.

[loki]

What is happening with Alonso?

 

He’s still defying aging…

[loki]

This team should be sold to someone other than Red Bull

Geri Horner?

[gowebber]

Maybe, I say maybe this has something to do with this:

 

https://www.gpblog.c...-sport-too.html

 

Its possible it could be for another team of Red Bull in another sport but why register it around the time of talking of AT name change. All evidence points to it being the new AT name so far imo.

[Beri]

The AT name change was already rumored before the summer break. So thats 2 or 3 months prior to the registration of the Racing Bulls name.

[Rob G]

It’s definitely dark blue. Obviously can look black in a lot of light conditions and in photos.

 

It was certainly black. Any bluish cast was due to the reflection of the sky. Almost every photo on this page shows that it's black: https://www.google.c...9&bih=737&dpr=1

[kumo7]

This story of the team being renamed to Racing Bull,.... has it happened yet? what is beyond registering the trademark and "word mark"? Unanimous approval from the colleagues?

 

This team is going thorough changes, I assume, beigger than what it may appear from the outside.

This Identity changes, pressure from Mercedes and its colleagues on it being owned by one company, skepticism on the owner operating two budget in one pot and distributing the result to the two teams.

 Racing Bull name does not necessarily split the identities, nor declare that they are separate racing team. vis-a-vis, it creates ambiguity to me.

 

Never the less, good luck for the good racing season. both drivers and the team are expected to outperform its rivalries.

 

My prediction? A lot of politics, truly a lot of politics.

[gowebber]

The AT name change was already rumored before the summer break. So thats 2 or 3 months prior to the registration of the Racing Bulls name.

 

Racingbulls.com domain though was registered back in July.

 

https://twitter.com/...074156846751904

 

also

 

and same company who registered alphatauri.com did the domain registration for racingbulls.com

 

 

While its "possible' this may be for some other Red Bull managed team doesn't really seem likely given it all seems to line up towards the rumors with the AT rebranding.

Edited by gowebber, 05 January 2024 - 06:42.

[FirstnameLastname]

Could be their Formula Woman team?

[Beri]

Racingbulls.com domain though was registered back in July.

 

https://twitter.com/...074156846751904

 

also

 

and same company who registered alphatauri.com did the domain registration for racingbulls.com

 

 

While its "possible' this may be for some other Red Bull managed team doesn't really seem likely given it all seems to line up towards the rumors with the AT rebranding.

 

Still, thats no confirmation. Porsche had landed a website URL linking a return to F1. We all know how that worked out.

 

I guess we will see within the coming weeks. Yet my opinion remains; its a daft name if its really the name for the team.

[PayasYouRace]

Could be their Formula Woman team?

That should be Racing Cows, surely?

[DW46]

Can we take a moment to appreciate the most active team threads are Sauber and Minardi.

We may not like the attention grabbing methods but they must have some impact even if only an initial bump in interest.

[Beri]

What a name change can do for the psyche of people to feel obligated to vent their opinion on it.

[gowebber]

Still, thats no confirmation. Porsche had landed a website URL linking a return to F1. We all know how that worked out.

I guess we will see within the coming weeks. Yet my opinion remains; its a daft name if its really the name for the team.

Nope not confirmed but again seems quite likely given this info. I agree the name is not great. I guess wanting to create a so called sister team they thought they need to keep "bull" in the name somewhere.

[gowebber]

AlphaTauri: Bayer and Mekies to form ‘sparring partner’ leadership

 

https://f1i.com/news...leadership.html

[kumo7]

AlphaTauri: Bayer and Mekies to form ‘sparring partner’ leadership

 

https://f1i.com/news...leadership.html

 

It sounds like terrible idea. Bayer should take a back seat and give Mekies a right to handle. His job is to fire him, not involved in to who is smarter game.