58 replies to this topic

[w1Y]

It's only going to work on a small number of tracks and where they are one stop. I mean it would be great for those at the back of the chain to undercut a large number of cars.

I say allow it but monitor how it is used. It shouldn't be where one driver is always sacrificed artificially. Its more a circumstantial situation like last Saturday.

I've always wondered why some drivers don't do this in places where it is impossible to.overtake. Like Baku in that tight section.

People have constantly said driver x should try and hold driver y up for their teammate and then get overtaken very easy. Where as in those sections thay can make the other driver lose multiple seconds.

Edited by w1Y, 12 March 2024 - 23:57.

[southernstars]

The issue is not the defensive driving. I agree that if it had been regular situation, I would have been cheering Magnussen on for it.

 

The issue is that he did it by crashing another car up against the wall then going off track to defend, got two penalties, and clearly that was not enough of a punishment. The heavier penalties were supposed to dissuade that type of thing, but instead it seems to have incentivised it for those lower down the grid.

 

Additionally, Magnussen didn't even receive the full consequences of his penalty because of the way time penalties are awarded when lapped traffic was involved. Sargeant, Tsunoda, and Ricciardo all should have been moved up a place, and probably Bottas as well, but they weren't, because they were lapped and Verstappen just hadn't got around to lapping Magnussen yet. THAT is a really big problem. He basically got away with it.

[pdac]

Just remember this mean you can never complain over penalties being given according to the rules anymore.

 

That's fine with me. Giving up places (more than one for serious transgressions) has always been my thinking. 

[Laster]

Reading through the responses from what I see no one has an issue with Magnussen holding up the pack. I don’t know why some keep acting like people are complaining about that. It is not the issue at all. It was fine when Hamilton did it to Rosberg, when Perez did it to Hamilton, when Alonso did it and when KMag did. It is perfectly fine for a driver or a team to try and gain an advantage by holding up the pack.

The complaint is about how KMag gained his position on Tsunoda by going off track incurring his second penalty and then holding him up and affecting his race from a position he should not have been in. If he had passed him legitmately and done it then that would have been fine. But he didn’t. That is the issue here. And that is the issue that Minardi are complaining about, not that a driver can hold up others, but that they can overtake off track take the penalty and then destroy the race of the person they passed. Allowing it is a very dangerous precedent, especially if it get employed by a team to affect a championship.

Edited by Laster, 13 March 2024 - 08:58.

[PayasYouRace]

what do you mean?
They were fighting for position and he actually finished in front of most of them

He was fighting cars 20 seconds ahead of him. Would be equivalent of holding up a car a lap ahead.

[Gareth]

Apparently this is the first time someone has backed up the pack. Never happened before, so a can of worms has been unlocked.

No that’s not right. This has always been a bit of a tactic when overtaking is difficult. We’ve even seen drivers use it to back their rivals into the pack. Remember Hamilton and Rosberg in Abu Dhabi?

I dont have any problem with that, or with Perez backing up Hamilton on the same track. I also loved the M. Schumacher at Spain defense on R. Schumacher that allowed Barichello to get through for the win, when M. Schumacher knew he would have to retire shortly. Agreed that’s all part of racing and legitimate teamwork.

I do think there’s a difference when you’re only in position at the front of the pack because you have illegally overtaken. That’s the key distinction here imo that makes this situation worth considering.

[Clatter]

I dont have any problem with that, or with Perez backing up Hamilton on the same track. I also loved the M. Schumacher at Spain defense on R. Schumacher that allowed Barichello to get through for the win, when M. Schumacher knew he would have to retire shortly. Agreed that’s all part of racing and legitimate teamwork.

I do think there’s a difference when you’re only in position at the front of the pack because you have illegally overtaken. That’s the key distinction here imo that makes this situation worth considering.

How about schumacher holding up hakkinen to gift Irvine the win on his return from breaking his legs. That was the first time I can remember seeing that tactic used.

Edited by Clatter, 13 March 2024 - 09:47.

[DW46]

Lorenzo in the 2013 MotoGP title decider trying to back Pedrosa into Marquez to force a scrap.

[lustigson]

Jarno Trulli used to back up the pack every race. It was ever thus.