40 replies to this topic

[69seven]

This screen grab is from a video posted on YouTube by Classic Team Lotus. The video shows the car at various locations during 1954. I have had a guess at most of them, but I don't know what circuit is shown in the film between 2'58"  to 3’30”. The other places shown are (I think)

 

Start to 0'30" outside Lotus works in Tottenham Lane , Hornsey

0'30"  to 0'38" running in (no windscreen).

0'38"  to 1'15" outside Tarporley Motor Co. garage (en route to Oulton Park for Daily Dispatch British Empire Trophy Meeting, 10.4.1954, following accident)

1'15"  to 1'46" Goodwood, Second Easter Handicap for Sports Cars, 19.4.1954 This event was out of sequence in the video, as it occurred after the Oulton Park race.

1'46" to 2'27" Oulton Park Daily Dispatch British Empire Trophy Meeting 10.4.1954

2'27" to 2'45" driving on A425(?) - the grey Morris Minor was probably Colin Chapman's, and the vintage car possibly Tony McCusker's A.C. The car does not appear to have the racing number circles painted on, was this before the trip to Oulton Park?

2’45” to 2’47” looks like a circuit on an ex-airfield.

2’47” to 2'58" - Any ideas - car has been towed by Colin's Morris Minor. AC (?) saloon also seen at Oulton Park at 2’03”, with the Morris and the Lotus VI

2'58"  to 3’30” – Racing circuit, but doesn't look like a race meeting as the cars do not have racing numbers. 3’07” Lotus VI, Richard Hardy, VI-6, 453 AMD – one of the Lotus volunteers.

3'31" VPD 97 is the John Coombs VIII #38 - presumably at Brands Hatch 3.10.1954

3'41" - Brands Hatch 3.10.1954 - SAR 5's race ended with a broken half-shaft.

 

Edited by 69seven, 30 October 2024 - 12:01.

[tampaguy]

I have a numbered photo of SAR 5 by Louis Klemantaski if anyone is interested. I located it in the Joe Sheppard family photo album. Joe and Chapman co-drove an Eleven together at Sebring in 57. 

[Rupertlt1]

"cars do not have racing numbers" — isn't the Lotus VI #3 or #9?

Ref Aston Martin, TPB 641: https://supercarnost...-db3-chassis-10

The races for this car in 1954 are listed which should narrow the field?

Do we have an event(s) where the two Lotus and the Aston appeared together? 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 31 October 2024 - 09:34.

[LittleChris]

Boreham ?

[69seven]

"cars do not have racing numbers" — isn't the Lotus VI #3 or #9?
Ref Aston Martin, TPB 641: https://supercarnost...-db3-chassis-10
The races for this car in 1954 are listed which should narrow the field?
Do we have an event(s) where the two Lotus and the Aston appeared together?
RGDS RLT

Thanks for identifying the Aston. Regarding possible dates, SAR 5 had been painted by the Silverstone race on the 15th May (see https://library.revs...stone.../394724) so any film of the unpainted car will be before this date (assuming that it's all of the same car).

[cooper997]

Seeing The Autocar signage made me think Snetterton and there's a date that slots between Oulton and Silverstone.

 

There's 24/4/54 Aston Martin OC Snetterton meeting and although I don't have access to the entry list, TNF's 68targa might? Given the ERA entry list posted back in August was that meeting.

https://forums.autos...ces/?p=10694132

 

Is the Lotus VI that appears next to the VIII in the opening post's youtube link (but not appearing in the screen grab in that same post) llikely to be Peter Gammon? Because the film clearly relates to the birth of Team Lotus.

 

 

Stephen

Edited by cooper997, 01 November 2024 - 04:05.

[Rupertlt1]

Dick Hardy/Jabby Crombac appeared at the Bol d'Or, Montlhéry, 29-30 May 1954 in Lotus-Ford, 453 AMD.

A Middlesex registration.
The only other possible known appearance is at Ibsley, 8 May 1954?

https://www.racingsp...d-Hardy-GB.html

But Chapman and the Aston not there?

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 01 November 2024 - 08:25.

[cooper997]

Rupert, Colin Chapman was at that Ibsley with the Emeryson F1 for a couple of laps (before retirement).

 

 

Stephen

[Rupertlt1]

Any connection?

R. Hardy & Son, 55 Marylebone High Street, London W1 — Wolseley and Morris Agents

Prescott, 8 September 1956: Dick Hardy's Hardy Annual (nee Sumner-J.A.P.)

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 01 November 2024 - 08:48.

[cooper997]

if one reads page 49 of Ian H Smith's Lotus book, Snetterton was visited for some practice on the way home from the adventures 'Team Lotus' had before and during the 10/4/54 Oulton meeting.

 

The following page mentions them taking SAR 5 to the Nurburgring the weekend after Easter Goodwood. So that dismisses my earlier 24/4/54 Snetterton reference. The car was now BRG for its German trip.

 

 

Stephen

[69seven]

Seeing The Autocar signage made me think Snetterton and there's a date that slots between Oulton and Silverstone.

 

There's 24/4/54 Aston Martin OC Snetterton meeting and although I don't have access to the entry list, TNF's 68targa might? Given the ERA entry list posted back in August was that meeting.

https://forums.autos...ces/?p=10694132

 

Is the Lotus VI that appears next to the VIII in the opening post's youtube link (but not appearing in the screen grab in that same post) llikely to be Peter Gammon? Because the film clearly relates to the birth of Team Lotus.

 

 

Stephen

As cooper997 points out (whilts I was writing this reply) if it's Snetterton, it could possibly be the day after the Oulton race (i.e. 11th April). The road section of the video, 2'27" to 2'45" driving on A425(?) may also be on the day after the Oulton race, as the A425 is around that part of the country.

 

I don't think that Peter Gammon's car appears in the video, the VI seen with SAR 5 and the Aston is probably Richard Hardy's VI-6, 453 AMD. Gammon's car was MG engined, and had a bonnet bulge and the exhaust on the driver's side of the car. 

Edited by 69seven, 01 November 2024 - 09:10.

[68targa]

As cooper997 points out (whilts I was writing this reply) if it's Snetterton, it could possibly be the day after the Oulton race (i.e. 11th April). The road section of the video, 2'27" to 2'45" driving on A425(?) may also be on the day after the Oulton race, as the A425 is around that part of the country.

 

I don't think that Peter Gammon's car appears in the video, the VI seen with SAR 5 and the Aston is probably Richard Hardy's VI-6, 453 AMD. Gammon's car was MG engined, and had a bonnet bulge and the exhaust on the driver's side of the car. 

I think this fits quite well. Although the Aston DB3 (Stevens) was at Snetterton on 24 April there is no mention of Chapman. My first thought on seeing the mysterious clip on the video is that this was not at a race meeting it seems too quiet. There would surely be a lot more activity.

 

Watching that first part of the video that Lotus VIII looked like a spaceship amidst the mundane and grey atmosphere of early 1950's UK.

[Rupertlt1]

The only snag is I can't find this building at any English circuit?

RGDS RLT

[69seven]

The only snag is I can't find this building at any English circuit?

RGDS RLT

No, I thought that it would be easy to identify, but couldn't find any similar images online. It looks like an old RAF building (e.g. the window frames) but that doesn't narrow it down a lot!

[Rupertlt1]

There is this at Silverstone:

https://library.revs...verstone/392090

Snetterton:

https://library.revs...national/414344

RGDS RLT

[69seven]

There is this at Silverstone:
https://library.revs...verstone/392090
Snetterton:
https://library.revs...national/414344
RGDS RLT

Looking at the Snetterton picture, it looks a lot like this
from video at about 3'12"

Zoomed image from the Revs Institute picture

Three windows, one door to LHS, stairs up to roof and chimney all similar.

Thanks!

[Rupertlt1]

Buildings visible from 2:11 in this film:

https://youtu.be/fL52jAEguwQ

Nailed it!

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 02 November 2024 - 06:54.

[Rupertlt1]

Dick Hardy appears to have had a very brief career with the Lotus (it was damaged at Montlhéry at the end of May 1954).

Does anybody have an entry list for Ibsley, 8 May 1954?

RGDS RLT

[69seven]

There's a report of the 1954 Bol d'or mentioning the Crombac/Hardy Lotus VI entry in MotorSport July 1954.

[cooper997]

Rupert, relating to your request and this thread, best I can do.

 

 

 

Stephen,

[Rupertlt1]

There's a report of the 1954 Bol d'or mentioning the Crombac/Hardy Lotus VI entry in MotorSport July 1954.

 

The Lotus at Montlhéry described by Crombac in Autosport as 1100 cc sidevalve, owned by Dick Hardy.

Ran in the racing car class with cycle wings. Identifiably 453 AMD.

Fastest lap: R. Hardy, Lotus

Is this him?

G.N. Chassis and partly-constructed body

also good vee twin J.A.P. 998 s.v. 

air-cooled, plus spare flywheels, rods, barrels. £10

the lot. Hardy, Hampstead 4203, 2 Clorane Gdns.,

N.W.3.

Autosport, 16 July 1954, Page 93

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 04 November 2024 - 06:59.

[Rupertlt1]

O/T what is the #27 Cooper at Ibsley with the kangaroo on the side?

https://library.revs...national/405887

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 04 November 2024 - 10:23.

[cooper997]

Rupert, Reg Hunt doing a spot of racing back in his original homelands.

 

 

Stephen.

[Rupertlt1]

Rupert, Reg Hunt doing a spot of racing back in his original homelands.

 

 

Stephen.

Stephen, Many thanks.

https://forums.autos...ip-mr-reg-hunt/

https://library.revs...national/418542

Photo passing the scene of Ian Raby's accident.

RGDS RLT 

Edited by Rupertlt1, 04 November 2024 - 11:01.

[Rupertlt1]

Stephen,

I'm struggling to stand up Dick Hardy at Ibsley, 8 May 1954. Do you have an entry list for event No.2? Anybody?

Event No.4: #88 shown as A. C. B. Chapman, Lotus 1467 — what motor is that?

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 05 November 2024 - 10:23.

[Rupertlt1]

2’45” to 2’47” looks like a circuit on an ex-airfield.

2’47” to 2'58" - Any ideas - car has been towed by Colin's Morris Minor. AC (?) saloon also seen at Oulton Park at 2’03”, with the Morris and the Lotus VI

I think this is all Snetterton. See course markers:

https://library.revs...etterton/406009

RGDS RLT

[cooper997]

Stephen,

I'm struggling to stand up Dick Hardy at Ibsley, 8 May 1954. Do you have an entry list for event No.2? Anybody?

Event No.4: #88 shown as A. C. B. Chapman, Lotus 1467 — what motor is that?

RGDS RLT

 

Rupert, I've just sent you some info.

 

As for 1467cc my best guess is MG TF 1500 related. If so Colin must have had a contact at Abingdon, as the MG TF 1500 must have been pretty new at the time.

 

 

Stephen

[GazChed]

The engine in Colin Chapman's Lotus VIII is almost certainly an MG XPAG engine of 1467cc capacity. There are two other cars entered with MG engines, the number 73 J.A.G. and the number 76 Kieft and both are 1467cc. Any chance of as few more dodgy snaps of this programme Stephen ?

[Geoff E]

Photo from 1955, Chapman with MG engined Lotus

 

https://www.f1forgot...idoncha-22_840/

Edited by Geoff E, 05 November 2024 - 11:47.

[cooper997]

Look familiar.... just spotted in the William Taylor / Coterie Press 2015 'Lotus The Marque' book, relating to the MkVIII pages.

 

 

 

Stephen

[69seven]

Stephen,

I'm struggling to stand up Dick Hardy at Ibsley, 8 May 1954. Do you have an entry list for event No.2? Anybody?

Event No.4: #88 shown as A. C. B. Chapman, Lotus 1467 — what motor is that?

RGDS RLT

Is it possible that Hardy took over the Chapman entry in this event, as racingsportscars.com has him as #88? The Chapman entry would presumably been SAR 5, which had a bored and linered MG XPAG/Morris 10 based engine.

[69seven]

Rupert, I've just sent you some info.

 

As for 1467cc my best guess is MG TF 1500 related. If so Colin must have had a contact at Abingdon, as the MG TF 1500 must have been pretty new at the time.

 

 

Stephen

The engine was a modified XPAG/Morris 10 engine, rather than an XPEG TF 1500 (Peter Ross, Lotus, the early years, and Ian Smith, Lotus, the first ten years).

There were apparently some 1500cc XPAG engines produced by MG prior to the TF 1500 XPEG, Peter Gammon was advertising one for sale in 1955, and Ken Miles had also used them in the US, but the SAR 5 engine doesn't appear to have been one of these.

. 

[69seven]

 

2’45” to 2’47” looks like a circuit on an ex-airfield.

2’47” to 2'58" - Any ideas - car has been towed by Colin's Morris Minor. AC (?) saloon also seen at Oulton Park at 2’03”, with the Morris and the Lotus VI

I think this is all Snetterton. See course markers:

https://library.revs...etterton/406009

RGDS RLT

 

Rupert, that seems like the most likely location. The saloon car I thought was possibly an AC is probably a Healey (Elliot?), as there is a reference in Peter Ross' book to 'Adam (Currie) and I came up (to Oulton) with Jill (Adam's girlfriend) in her father's Healey' so they presumably all went on to Snetterton after the Oulton meeting.

[Rupertlt1]

Thanks to Stephen we now know that 'Hardy' in a Lotus does not appear in the Ibsley programme.

(Neither does #27 Reg Hunt in the Cooper.)

There is no sign of him in George Phillips photographs at Revs.

So what connects Dick Hardy to this event?

There must be a report somewhere?

RGDS RLT

[Rupertlt1]

B.A.R.C. Goodwood, 13th Members' Meeting, 25th July 1953

Event 6 — Five lap handicap (B)

1st—R. Watling-Greenwood (R.W.G.) Speed 69.90 m.p.h.

2nd—E. W. Cuff Miller (Riley)

3rd—A. C. B. Chapman (Dvr. A. J. Currie) (Lotus)

4th—H. Lester (Lester M.G.)

Fastest lap—R. Watling-Greenwood (R.W.G.) 1 min 59.6 sec, 72.24 m.p.h.

Lotus was 1,098 c.c.

Is this the car Chapman raced at Thruxton in August?

RGDS RLT 

Edited by Rupertlt1, 07 November 2024 - 06:39.

[dgs]

BARC Goodwood, 13th Members' Meeting, 25th, July 1953

Event 6, Handicap Race (B)

No 1  Adam Currie,  Lotus Ford-1098cc  MK V1 (6/9 1611H) , SG:  0.52" handicap, 3rd, 5 laps, 11'32.2"

 

Also at BARC Goodwood, 14th Members Meeting, 12th September 1953

Event 9, Handicap Race (D)

No 15 Colin Chapman, Lotus Ford 1098cc MK V1 (6/9 1611H), SG: 0.59" handicap, 5th, 11'27.0"

 

Information:  Second Edition - 'A Record of Motor Racing at Goodwood, Volume 1, Robert Barker 

[dgs]

BARC, Goodwood,  13th Members Meeting 25th July 1953

Event 2, Scratch Race (A) up to 1100cc non s/c

No 1 Colin Chapman, Lotus Ford 1098cc MK V1 (6/9 1611H), Result:  1st, 5 laps, 10'19'8", 69.93mph

Fastest lap:  2'00.4"  71.76mph

 

Information: Second Edition - 'A Record of Motor Racing at Goodwood, Volume 1', Robert Barker

[68targa]

According to Graham Capel's book on the Lotus VI, Dick Hardy took delivery in 1953 of his MkVI (Chassis # 6 one of the first batch) however, he didn't assemble it until March 1954 and he first raced it at B'ol d'Or at the end of May.  It is plausible that he took the opportunity to join in the Snetterton test on 11 April to sort out the car with Chapman in attendance. Indeed he may have gone to the Oulton meeting as a spectator and tagged along.  He claims to have assembled 458AMD  in 17 days which Chapman said was a record.  The car may well have required some sorting out if Anthony Blight's VI (VYK523) is anything to go by.  Blight purchased his car later in 1956 and after assembly he could not get the radius rods to fit correctly. He drove it to Castle Combe with the wheels at an alarming angle, where Chapman was racing,  and threatened him with legal action (Blight was lawyer), Chapman admitted that something was wrong saying "the jig must have slipped". and eventually replaced the parts.

(source: The History of the Lotus VI - Graham Capel 2015)

 

Hardy sold his car sometime in 1954 or early 1955 to J.Z. Huie who raced it in 1955.

[Rupertlt1]

There is a photograph of Chapman, at the 14th Members' Meeting Goodwood, at Revs, but it cannot be linked due to the dreaded apostrophe.

The car has no visible registration, lights behind the grille.

Still no Hardy at Ibsley?

Chapman at Thruxton?

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 08 November 2024 - 07:42.

[GazChed]

You may already know this Rupert, but according to racingsportscars Colin Chapman took part in the combined 1500cc and 1200cc sports car race at Thruxton on 3/8/53 in a Lotus Mk VI Ford, winning the 1200cc class.

[Rupertlt1]

Prescott, 8 September 1956: Dick Hardy's Hardy Annual (nee Sumner-J.A.P.)

RGDS RLT

 

R. E. Hardy also entered at Stapleford Hill Climb, Sunday 14th October 1956, in the #114 Hardy Annual 996 supercharged.

RGDS RLT