69 replies to this topic

[BorderReiver]

Quote

Originally posted by Bernd

Hill identifying the body... As Chapman wasn't there this sounds right.

I thought so too, in fact thinking about it, I'm pretty sure that Hill talks about this in "Life at the Limit" (I have no means of checking this, I leant my copy to a mate and never got it back, don't you just hate that?). Perhaps someone can clear this up?

It is strange, and perhapps fitting, that we have been spared from a blow by blow account of Clark's accident. Perhaps this is due to it occurring in a fairly remote location, at a relativly minor event.

Footage of both Rindt and Bandini's accident's exist, and I think the readily available amount of media material makes probing into these incidents much easier.

Just my thoughts.

[Vitesse2]

Quote

Originally posted by BorderReiver


I thought so too, in fact thinking about it, I'm pretty sure that Hill talks about this in "Life at the Limit" (I have no means of checking this, I leant my copy to a mate and never got it back, don't you just hate that?). Perhaps someone can clear this up?

It's not in Life at the Limit - I just checked that. Graham is quite reticent about the Clark accident and says nothing about the aftermath.

As Bernd says, Graham was on the spot, Colin wasn't. Hill would have been the most senior (and probably the most composed) Lotus representative there, so it certainly makes sense that he would have done the formal identification.

[BorderReiver]

Hmmmm, my mistake then. I wish I could for the life of me remember where I read it now. It was definately in the first person though, Graham describing what he himself did, so it either something he wrote, or maybe a transcript or quote.

I'll have a think and a look though my archive. . . .

[Martyj]

I'm working from memory here...

In the Autocourse Driver's series book on Clark, there is a reminiscence of the day by lotus mechanic Jim E(can't remember the spelling of the last name, but he seemed to always be part of Clark's team)

Clark's body was taken directly to the Heidleberg hospital, and Germans asked someone at Clark's pits to go to the hospital. Jim E. went, knowing Clark was hurt, but not sure how badly. He figured it out when at the hospital they offered him a strong drink before they broke the news. He was the one who made the I.D. He said Jim looked very normal except at the back of the skull. He then made a call to Chapman.

Back at the track, in Jim E.'s abscence, Graham Hill took charge as far as organizing the team members, getting things packed up, and out of Hockenhiem. I think that might be what you are recalling, BorderReiver. I seem to remember reading something by Hill as well.

[dbltop]

Jim Endruit ?

[doc540]

lynmeredith, do you know or did you work with Dick Ralstin? I've come to know and admire him on another forum. I think he retired from Goodyear Racing in 1987 as Manager of Public Relations.

Hell of a man.

Dick Ralstin's Homepage

(sorry to intrude on the Clark thread)

[lynmeredith]

Quote

Originally posted by doc540
lynmeredith, do you know or did you work with Dick Ralstin? I've come to know and admire him on another forum. I think he retired from Goodyear Racing in 1987 as Manager of Public Relations.

Hell of a man.

No doc, I don't remember him. I assume he was with Goodyear USA whereas I worked for Goodyear International Racing Division which had its base in UK. And I was only there in the '60s.

Lyn M

ps, dbltop Jim Endruweit

[JohnH]

I think it's preposterous to make an assumption that Senna made an error. That was an easy corner, just flat out and turn left. Something obviously went wrong with the car because it just goes straight on at Tamburello. Perhaps deflating tire or the steering wheel broke, whatever there is no way it was an error. I've never ever seen it mentioned that it was an error, because that would be the least likely cause.

JH

[masterhit]

Reagrding Senna's accident : we'll never know what caused it. There were all sorts of allegations and rumours (including rumours that Patrick Head shouted "steering power" at the time of the accident) right through to crazy stuff like Senna passing out.

The error thing really took momentum because Schumacher was quoted that Senna had lost control of the car, therefore some chose to misinterpret that comment as Schumacher implying that Senna had made a mistake when the more probable likelihood is that Schumacher simply meant that Senna suddenly lost control of the car he was driving for some unknown reason.

In the world of tabloid news however, this literal interpretation is far less controversial, and therefore, by tabloid logic less 'newsworthy' than publishing the more malicious, ignorant and fictitious interpretations.

We'll never know why the accident happened. There were plenty of potential factors from low tyre pressures, mechanical failure and aerodynamic inbalance, as well as psychological pressures and emotional state.

It could have been a mixture of any, all or none of those things really, but it was certainly a tragic result.

Sorry for going off topic but there are some similarities with regards low tyre pressure and mechanical failure as possible causes.

[Martyj]

Regardless of the cause of Senna and Clarks accidents, I think we can all agree that both drivers were of a skill far beyond simply making a mistake on a high speed, gentle curve.

[Ray Bell]

However unlikely it is, nobody is beyond making any mistake anywhere...

[HistoricMustang]

Been several years since the last post. Just wondering if the topic needs to be explored based on any additional information.

Lost Jim while a senior in high. Miles and Roberts still burned in memory.

Henry

[Seppi_0_917PA]

Hey Henry, this was explored last December to the point of having the thread locked-down!

The Jim Clark crash at Hockenheim

I think the lock-down is temporary...

Quote

Originally posted by Twin Window
I think this thread deserves a breather...

It's now closed (nothing else) for a wee while.

(Is the cooling-off period over yet?)

[scags]

did anyone see the september issue of Sports Car Market? Apparently, Derek Bell was speaking to a visiting group from the mag at the Goodwood Festival of Speed, and brought up the Jim Clark accident. "I spoke with Clark at dinner the night before the race, and asked him how his car was going. He replied'be careful when you come to lap me' I asked him what he meant, and he said' I have a problem with the power cutting in and out. If I don't get it fixed, I wont be good for anything tomorow' "I believe Clark was fully commited into the turn, and that the faulty metering unit caused him to sudenly lose power. that would cause the rear end to swerve. While he was correcting for that . full power came on, shooting the car off the track before Clark could corect. and that was the end." Anyone hear this before?

[Andretti Fan]

That certainly makes sence. Do any of the regular members like Mr. Nye or Mr. Boor have a way to contact Derek Bell to ask him to clarify his remarks?

[LOTI]

The reason Colin Chapman was not there, as I understand it, is that plan A was for Jim to drive the Ford at Brands. Since the car was run by Ford and entered by Alan Mann, it was not Colin's problem and so he took a quick holiday.The tyre sponsorship thing I think was just a smoke screen as Jim tested the car and found it [as has been said before] "as slippery as a wet rat". Both Jack Brabham and John Surtees had a test in it and all declined to drive.
So Plan B was hastily put in place because those guys just loved to race, even a not perfect Lotus.
Loti

[LittleChris]

Derek Bells comments have been widely published in various magazines as far as I remember. For what it's worth, I still think Jacky Ickx running into the back of him at Montjuich in the previous race had a lot to do with the virtually undoubted mechanical failure that cost Jimmy his life.

[scheivlak]

Quote

Originally posted by LittleChris
Derek Bells comments have been widely published in various magazines as far as I remember. For what it's worth, I still think Jacky Ickx running into the back of him at Montjuich in the previous race had a lot to do with the virtually undoubted mechanical failure that cost Jimmy his life.

That's a strange wording. I guess you mean: Lotus not properly checking and repairing the resulting damage before the next race?

[LittleChris]

Sorry, wasn't trying to be oblique (!), but I believe there was a minimum Lotus presence at Montjuich that weekend and there is only so much that a few people can do . Definitely not trying apportion blame

[Catalina Park]

So the blowout marks on the rear rim were nothing to do with it then?

I have heard about five different theories but I have only seen evidence of one (tyre failure).