23 replies to this topic

[humphries]

A series of races were held at the Continental Divides raceway titled the "Colorado Grand Prix". The last three of the series, 1967 ( multi-formula ),1968 and 1969 ( both Formula A ) are all well documented. See Allen Brown's site.

The first Colorado Grand Prix was held on 16 May 1965 and was won by Texan Hap Sharp in his Cooper T53-Climax 2.5, a little long in the tooth but capable of holding off Earl Jones in a newer Brabham with the 1.6 Ford twin-cam engine. Jones did the fastest lap in 2' 05.1. In third place came Bud Morley in a cropped Elva 7 - BMW 2.0 followed by Lothar Motschenbacher in a Lotus 22-Ford 1.6, Bruce Eglinton in a 750cc Cheetah and Karl Knapp in his Formula Junior Lotus 20 or 22; a motley crew.

But of the 1966 race I know nothing. Possibly the race was held on 15 May 1966. Does anyboby have any details? Can anybody add to the 1965 entry?

John H

[Buford]

My brother used to be public relations & promotions director for CDR but the track no longer exists and I don't know where their records went. I imagine to SCCA if they were not thrown out.

[humphries]

The 1965 Colorado GP was co-organised by the SCCA and the Formula Racing Association. The latter organisation was interested in promoting formula racing as opposed to sports car racing which was the main concern of the aptly named SCCA. Later, of course, the SCCA did involved itself with professional formula racing and one assumes the FRA was abandoned or incorporated into the SCCA.

I should think that the 1966 II Colorado GP was again a joint SCCA/FRA promotion but did not receive the same publicity from "Sports Car Graphic" as in the previous year. In 1965 there was a $3000 purse for the 13 starters to share after the 100 mile race.

Early F5000-type cars were beginning to emerge. Paul Wigton's FJ Cooper was lengthened by seven inches and a Chevy four cylinder motor inserted and Harry McIntosh put a Corvair engine into an Elva 300 but neither started after problems in practice.

JH

[humphries]

Having just unearthed the relevant " Sports Car Graphic " ( What a good magazine this was! ) I read that the 1965 Colorado GP had 23 starters, Danny Collins was to race Wigton's Cooper-Chevy II and Earl Jones's Brabham had been bought from Hap Sharp. It is claimed that Sharp's Cooper T53 was Brabham's 1960 World Championship winning car.

Other entries included Hank Candler and Mason O'Kief in 1600cc Lotus 27s and Ron Herrera in a Lotus 22 with similar engine.

Apparently the out-of-state entries received substantial tow money and the Formula programme, featuring adverts, was free, yet it was the first SCCA race at CDR where the management finished in the black.

JH

[Don Capps]

The best place to check the record in the popular enthusiast press for the Colorado GPs would be Competition Press. I don't happen to have the issues which would cover the 1965 & 1966 events at hand, but if there is some sort of report on the event, it would be in CP.

I had hoped that I might have something in my folders which covered the 1966 event, but all I could figure out was that there was a SCCA regional schedule for CDR on 14 May 1966.

[Jim Thurman]

Originally posted by Don Capps
The best place to check the record in the popular enthusiast press for the Colorado GPs would be Competition Press. I don't happen to have the issues which would cover the 1965 & 1966 events at hand, but if there is some sort of report on the event, it would be in CP.

I might have the issue in question. I've got a pretty busy schedule over the next few days, but I'll try and check on it ASAP.

[humphries]

Don, Jim.

Thanks. The first Colorado GP was run in conjunction with a SCCA regional meeting.

There was no report in the SCCA's "SportsCar" but sometimes reports and results appeared in the SCCCA's newsletter, a copy of which I have never located. On a number of occasions a race report was in "SportsCar" but the official results in the newsletter. Has anybody got any of these? Most regions also had their own club publication but they again are difficult to find. It appears that back in the 50's and 60's the SCCA lived for the day and never envisaged the huge interest there would be in the cars and races of those decades and so archive material is surprisingly hard to find because as Buford implied, many records were simply filed in the bin.

JH

[Buford]

My brother was also Director of Communications for SCCA for awhile. Part of what he did for about a year was look at tons of movies they had that nobody had ever looked at, and categorize them and compile all the boxes of random records they had into some order. I assume they are still doing that but even if they are not, they should have the era you are talking about in some form of order. So if you do not find what you are looking for, contact the SCCA office. Theoretically, that is what they were keeping those records for. In case somebody asks.

[humphries]

I wrote to the SCCA archivist a few years back and his reply was very pessimistic about providing race stats other than those for the well-known professional series. He stated that finding and centralising information concerning regional and divisional racing was proving very difficult. He provided a few photocopies from "SportsCar" that I was missing but at a price that I decided to explore other avenues. TNF appears to be as good an avenue as any other, probably more promising than most.

Buford, it is a pity your brother didn't take the records home for safe keeping!

JH

[Allen Brown]

I almost missed this one.

When trying to document the early days of Formula A and Formula B, I have only managed to find a handful of 'pro' races held before the 'pro' series started in 1968. These include:

1st Colorado GP, CDR 16 May 1965
Ciudad Juarez date unknown 1965 (won by Knapp; other details unknown)
Hanford date unknown 1965 (won by Eglington; other details unknown)
2nd Colorado GP, CDR, 15 May 1966
Las Vegas date unknown 1966 (won by Knapp; other details unknown)
Cruz Blanca Beer International Formula Race, Ciudad Juarez (Mexico), 17 Jul 1966 (won by Marshall)

The 1966 Colorado GP was reported in CP&A (4 Jun 1966 pp1, 2) but only the top ten finishers were given. As best I can extract them from the report, the results were:

1. Lou Sell, 1600cc Le Grand Mk 3-Ford twincam, 35 laps, 1h 14m 48.0s 78.61 mph
2. Gus Hutchison, 1600cc Lotus 31-Ford twincam,
3. Barry Blackmore, 1600cc Lotus 22-Ford twincam
4. Bob Betts, 1600cc Elva 300-Ford pushrod
5. Eugene Bashore, Lotus 18-Ford
6. Fred Goeske, Brabham-Ford
7. Al Hultgren, Cooper-BMC
8. Stuart Wright, Lotus 20-Ford
9. Kim Scott, Lotus 20-Ford
10. Harry Cecil, BMC-Alfa

Qualifying
1. Hutchison 2:04.2
2. Sell 2:04.8
3. Hank Candler, Le Grand, 2:05.4
4. Karl Knapp, FB Le Grand-Alfa, 2:06.0
5. Blackmore
6. Boyd Groberg, 1600cc Lotus 22-Ford twincam
7. Ed Marshall, 1600cc Alexis-Ford twincam (Mauricio Gamboa's brand new car)

Knapp (wiring) and Candler (loose rod bearing) retired.
FL: Blackmore, 2:05.2

The 1966 Ciudad Juarez race was covered in CP&A 6 Aug 1966 pp1,6 but I seem to have lost p6.

Allen

[Buford]

Originally posted by humphries


Buford, it is a pity your brother didn't take the records home for safe keeping!

JH

Well he said they had a room full of movies and boxes of race results and papers nobody had ever looked at. This was in the early 1980s. So he spent a lot of time looking at movies. It wasn't only SCCA stuff. It was stuff from all over the world. He said it was amazing stuff. Incredible crashes he had never heard of or seen. He also said he tried to go through the boxes of papers and get them into some order but that may have been nothing more than trying to get years or even decades seperated into the same box. What he was basically doing was goofing around on company time. Next time I talk to him I'll ask for more details of what they had and what he did. But he has been out of there for about 20 years so wouldn't know what they have done with all this material since then.

[David McKinney]

A few Cuidad Juarez notes:
1965
Date unknown, but somewhere in the August/October area
Circuit: 3 miles
Mason O’Kieff (Lotus 27 twincam) won the Saturday prelim. Karl Knapp (LeGrand-Ford) won Sunday’s 60-mile main race from Clint Calvin (Cooper) and Charlie Adams (Brabham).

1966
17 July
Circuit: 1.4 miles
Knapp (LeGrand) qualified fastest, but Ed Marshall (Alexis twincam) won the 10-lap prelim. Marshall also won the 108-mile final from Hank Candler (Alfa special) with Bruce Eglington three laps down in third place with the works LeGrand-Ford.

[humphries]

Allen

Thanks for the II Colorado GP information.

The FRA Hanford 18/19 September, 1965 meeting was a financial hiccup, well more a burp. The race was won by the works LeGrand Mk 3-Alfa Romeo (Conrero modded) driven by Bruce Eglinton in front of Knapp's similar car equipped with a Cosworth Ford 1100cc unit.

The "El Camino Real" at Juarez 5/6 November was a co-promotion of the Rocky Mountain Section of the FRA ( The boys who ran the Colorado GP ), the Pan-American Region of the SCCA and the Club Automovilistico Del Norte. The 3.0 mile circuit was around the streets of the new Cultural and Scientific Centre. As David states it was a win for Knapp as O'Kieff and Eglinton tangled on the first lap of the final ( 25 laps? ).

JH

[Allen Brown]

Thanks John

So we have:

I Colorado GP, CDR 16 May 1965
FRA Hanford, 18/19 Sep 1965
"El Camino Real", Juarez 5/6 Nov 1965
II Colorado GP, CDR, 15 May 1966
Las Vegas date unknown 1966 (won by Knapp; other details unknown)
"Cruz Blanca Beer International Formula Race", Juarez, 17 Jul 1966

Do you know what other major races were organised during this 1965-1967 period that are worth recording? I'd like to get an introductory section to my Formula A/5000 site but I have so little information at present. A list of races would be something...

Allen

[David McKinney]

The fall Watkins Glen meeting staged races for cars of this type in the years in question, as of course did the annual ARRC. I don't know about much else in 1965 and 1966, but do have details of the 1967 "SCCA Grand Prix Championship" (as I think you do?)

[Allen Brown]

Originally posted by David McKinney
The fall Watkins Glen meeting staged races for cars of this type in the years in question, as of course did the annual ARRC. I don't know about much else in 1965 and 1966, but do have details of the 1967 "SCCA Grand Prix Championship" (as I think you do?)

Yes, of course. Complete brain fade there - I meant 1965-66 not 1965-67.

Could you tell me more about those fall Watkins Glen races?

Thanks

Allen

[humphries]

Allen

I have no knowledge of the Las Vegas race or the second Juarez event. In 1965/1966 the SCCA, having shown some interest in Formula Junior in the early Sixties, decided to promote Formula Vee (Good grief!). Formula racing became a bit of a hotch-potch. Also there was a big change in the structure of the SCCA's activities. Because the SCCA finally committed itself to professional racing the non-professional races lost a lot of their big names and became races for the "amateur".

Of these amateur races the only formula races that are fairly easy to record are the ARRC races at Daytona, Riverside and in 1967, Daytona again. Some Divisional races had reasonable entries but at the ARRC nearly all the top amateur drivers appeared. I think you already include the later Formula A and B ARRC races in your records.

Even a BRM appeared in 1967.


JH

[Don Capps]

Isn't it amazing that while we can usually find not only the results but the story behind some totally obscure formula event in Europe and we can't really develop squat on the F/SCCA and other similar events in the USA (& Mexico) for the period under discussion....

[David McKinney]

SCCA Watkins Glen races

22/8/1965
1 Candido DeMota (Lotus 20B)
2 Gus Andrey (Lotus-Alfa)
3 Jordan King (Lotus-Ford)
4 Mark Donohue (Lotus 20B)
5 Larry Skeels (Cooper)

21/8/1966
1 Don Morin (Brabham)
2 Fred Opert (Lotus)
3 Fred Stevenson (Lotus)
5 William Blankenship (Cooper)
6 Roger Barr (Cooper-BMC)

[Allen Brown]

Some very familiar names there. David - could you tell me your source for those please?

Allen

[David McKinney]

Was hoping you'd have given me more time for that
I took the results from my own records. I'm fairly sure the source for those would have been a Watkins Glen book, whose title and author I don't recall and didn't get a chance to check, never mind confirming the details.
Will try and find time to do so tonight

[Allen Brown]

Originally posted by humphries
Allen

I have no knowledge of the Las Vegas race or the second Juarez event. In 1965/1966 the SCCA, having shown some interest in Formula Junior in the early Sixties, decided to promote Formula Vee (Good grief!). Formula racing became a bit of a hotch-potch. Also there was a big change in the structure of the SCCA's activities. Because the SCCA finally committed itself to professional racing the non-professional races lost a lot of their big names and became races for the "amateur".

Of these amateur races the only formula races that are fairly easy to record are the ARRC races at Daytona, Riverside and in 1967, Daytona again. Some Divisional races had reasonable entries but at the ARRC nearly all the top amateur drivers appeared...

I agree with all you say but the races I'm trying to track were the professional races held before the actual series began in 1967. The CDR and Mexican races were described by CP&A as 'pro' races even though they weren't part of an organised championship. Lou Sell in particular appears to have been a cheque hunter in those days.

Allen

[Don Capps]

I agree with all you say but the races I'm trying to track were the professional races held before the actual series began in 1967. The CDR and Mexican races were described by CP&A as 'pro' races even though they weren't part of an organised championship. Lou Sell in particular appears to have been a cheque hunter in those days.

Allen,

The problem that you are facing is one that has been kicked around before. A big part of the key to this is tracking down the activities of the FRA from the days when it was the 500 CC Racing Club to about 1967 when its activities get pretty blurry -- just after SCG dropped it from the magazine and the SCCA finally began to get serious about F/SCCA.

The key is the activities of the FRA. Between Comp Press and SCG you can get a general idea as to the overall picture of what was going on. After SCG dropped the monthly column, the story of the FRA gets rather vague. I think that you have to delve a bit further back than 1965/1966 to get a better appreciation as to why the SCCA finally broke down and created Formula SCCA at the end of 1964.

Comp Press and MotoRacing help fill in some of the gaps prior to then. I am not sure as to whether RRR had much of a dog in the formula scene in SoCal since I never really gave a thought until now, but it seems that the major concentration for pro formula road racing events was in that area.

I am not sure as to the extent of this story, but I am sure that it is an interesting one just from the limited research that I have conducted. Indeed, the story of American formula road racing -- pro and amateur -- until the mid-1960s when it appeared as if from nowhere, is still waiting to be told.

[David McKinney]

The annual Seneca Cup race at the August Glen meeting switched from FJ to its original libre (plus FJ) in 1963, when Walt Hansgen in a Lotus 18/21 won from Doug Revson (Cooper) and Ed Ferriss (Elva).
Placings in the 1964 Seneca Cup race were David Dours (Cooper) 1, Brooks Frybarger (Lotus 20) 2, Mike Taylor (Cooper) 3, McLane Tilton Jr (Lotus-Alfa) 4 and Bruce Klussmann (Elva) 5.
1965 and 1966 Seneca Cup races as reported above

Source: Watkins Glen by J J O’Malley and Bill Green, publisher unknown, no ISBN