251 replies to this topic

[Pete Stanley]

I'm constantly trying to learn more about the history of racing. I came to the sport fairly recently.

I've done some reading, etc. on James Hunt, at it appears to me that he is underrated. He did some fantastic things with the M23 and M26 during the seventies. His best performances were always on the most challenging courses. Yet there seems to be little mention of him nowadays. On some of these "best" lists, which I do not put much stock in anyway, Nigel Mansell is listed ahead of Hunt.

Is there anyone out there who could explain to me why Hunt is NOT regarded as a great driver? Someone who actually lived through that time? (I was born in '79.)

[Don Capps]

Another one of the reasons that we have the Time Machine here.

Personally, I still think that the days of the Hesketh Racing alone (Bubble Horesley (sp) as team manager...) was enough to put Hunt the Shunt in the Hall fo Fame. He put up some really super performances in their March and had a great win at Zandvoort in 1975 with the Hesketh 308.

One of the great mysteries of life. Today everyone loves you and down the road it is "James who? Oh, wasn't he on the telly with Murray? Did he ever drive in F1?" Be prepared for "Nigel who?" soon.

Hunt did a very good job in a year that was just one unending mess after another, 1976. On his day, Hunt was very good. In some ways he was like Hawthorn having "merely" good days and then Great days. But, when the chips were down he was tougher than people realized.

One reason he probably isn't given his due is that he was definitely a loveable Flake (tee shirt & jeans to formal dinners ), but rubbed The Establishment the wrong way more than a few times. Plus, when he decided it was time to quit, he blinking just quit. Bye! See 'ya!

I always liked him. He was definitely not your average racer.

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Yr fthfl & hmbl srvnt,

Don Capps



[This message has been edited by Don Capps (edited 11-15-1999).]

[Jonathan]

Hunt was a brillant driver at times. Very exciting. However he had virtually no interest in car set up or development. When driving for Mclaren Teddy Mayer would ask him to try out a number of different settings to experiment and come up with an "Optimal" set-up. James was notorious for saying "Lets just put on last years setup & go out & boot it". This worked quite well when they were using the old M-23 and had several years of setup data.
When they brought out the newer M-26 the team struggled badly in my opinion because Hunt was either un-willing or un-able to develope the car properly... I think it took half the season before they had the car competitive.

[Dennis David]

Yes he hated to practice. I think I read that he was actually afraid to practice feeling that you had only so many miles before you would have a big accident. He did not want to tempt fate.

I remember going to a race at Brands Hatch during his championship year, His birthday I think where there was a crash right at the beginning which caused his car to fly through the air (I have a picture of it). They restarted the race and he won but I think that the results were later reversed. It was also his birthday. I picked up my JPS Jacket that day. Doesn't fit anymore, must have shrunked!

I'll see if I can get a bio from Motorsport where Jochen Mass rated him very highly. He did have a great nickname though. Before Irv the Swerve there was Hunt the Shunt!


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Regards,

Dennis David
Yahoo = dennis_a_david

Life is racing, the rest is waiting

Grand Prix History
www.ddavid.com/formula1/

[Don Capps]

McLaren suffered a great deal from drivers who would or could just drive around a problem, Denny "the Bear" Hulme being another one of the Hunt mode that could finish in the points with a car the was virtually undriveable, even to other racers.

Hunt also had the advantage at Hesketh of having Harvey Postlewaite as the engineer. His ability to figure out what worked for Hunt was remarkable since Hunt was generally clueless as to how to give feedback.

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Yr fthfl & hmbl srvnt,

Don Capps

[Jonathan]

Denis David -

Brands Hatch 1976... Hmmm... Thats was a while ago, Yeah I recall Clay Regazzoni got a shade too sideways, tapped Niki slightly and caused a massive 'traffic jam' going into the first corner as everyone tried to slow up. They stopped the race almost immediatly (1st lap). Hunt had managed to get his McLaren up on two wheels. While still driveable he didn't complete the first lap and instead drove directly to pit lane to have some slightly bent suspension components repaired. Because of this he was initially considered "out of the race", until a near-riot situation broke out, then cooler heads prevaled and he was allowed to restart.

Ultimatly he was disqualified at Brands, however his disqualification in Spain was overturned, (or do I have that backwards ?). At any rate I guess it was a "wash".

[FlagMan]

Brands Hatch '76 was my first GP - as a fire marshal on the exit of Surtees - Its funny but I can remember much more about that GP than any of the 20+ that I have attended since.

It is the only time I have heard the crowd at a race meeting in the UK chanting to get a driver re-instated - even at the height of 'Mansell Mania' they never got that worked up.

Other strong memories are the sound of the Matra engine - it was just reaching peak revs in an intermediate gear as it passed within 6 feet of where I was standing, and the sight of Arturo Metzario getting rather annoyed at Bob Evans for holding him up thru Surtees during practice, and gesticulating with both hands - unfortunatly, as he hadn't finished exiting the corner at the time the only result was a very long trip down the grass beneath my feet and a ruined set of tyres.

That was also the year of the Durex sponsored Surtees, which resulted in the BBC refusing to televise the race - how times change!

As I recall, 'Hunt the Shunt', was only the polite version of young 'Mr James' nickname.

The original was either a reference to one of James's favourite hobbies, or was coined after a notorious accident at Crystal Palace in F3 which resulted in a rather annoyed James 'remonstating' with another driver - all captured on TV. When will drivers learn that it is fairly pointless trying to throw a punch at a fellow driver while he is still wearing his helmet?

[Dennis David]

Actually the whole car left the ground. I have a slide somewhere. I also remember Emmo riding through the crowd on a motorcycle. He had either gone off or his car quit.

Flag - Wow you're right! I was one of those people chanting. That was a lovely course. I was really shocked the first time I went to Silverstone. It seemed a desert in comparison. I have a Halburton case and on it is a big sticker from the 1976 British Grand Prix.

------------------
Regards,

Dennis David
Yahoo = dennis_a_david

Life is racing, the rest is waiting

Grand Prix History
www.ddavid.com/formula1/

[Statesidefan]

I have a video of the 76 British GP and Hunt is wonderfully politically incorrect at the end. He is on the podium and looks out to the throng of reporters and says "can I have a bit of that cigarette? Yes, Yes. Can I get a smoke off of you?" Can yu imagine anyone doing that nowadays?

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"The strategy of a Formula One race is very simple. It's flat out from the minute the flag drops." Mario Andretti 1976

[Dennis David]

I just got back from Sears Point and they're selling the same JPS Jacket I have for $269.00! Their's looks like its never been worn, what a dolt!

------------------
Regards,

Dennis David
Yahoo = dennis_a_david

Life is racing, the rest is waiting

Grand Prix History
www.ddavid.com/formula1/

[Robbie]

When I was a (biggish) boy James Hunt was all the rage. I know now that he was considered a tad lucky to become WDC. But for style as a person he was unequalled in the sport. (Perhaps Graham Hill was of his like.) His 'public' school polish, and complete opionated self-assurance were pretty winning characteritics.

What was he like to watch as a driver: smooth, aggressive, or what?

[mark f1]

I purchased Gerald Donaldson's biography on James last week and am about 1/3 of the way through.

The book really tells the story of a driver who should never really have ever made it to F1. It was only through his sheer determination to make it and never give up attitude plus lucking into his relationship with Hesketh that he made it.

Couple funny stories in the book:

- he had a monumental crash in F3, landing upside down on the barrier, before coming to rest right way up. Apparently the first people to the car found him pressing the start button, yelling ' F%$^&** thing won't start'. It was only when it was pointed out that his engine was across the other side of the track that he gave up!!!!

- early in his F3 career he found out that he would inherit some money from his grandmother when she died. He talked his team manager (I think it was the TM) into speaking to his parents to advance the money that he would get when his Grandma died, even though she was alive and well. They turned him down!

[Chris Bloom]

I was a bit too young to see James racing, though I knew his name when I started following F1 when I was 11. He was commentating by that time and I suppose my memories of him are partnering Murray Walker in the commentary box.

He always seemed to have something to say about Rene Arnoux, usually detrimental like when Murray explained during a Monaco GP in the late eighties that Arnoux was complaining that he wasn't used to the normally aspirated cars after driving turbos for so long and this was the reason why he was so slow. To this James replied with one word "BULLSHIT!"

James however did stand up for Arnoux when he was ordered to let Prost by when he was leading in the Renault at Paul Ricard in 1982. He quite rightly questioned the decision to make a driver give up a win in his home Grand Prix. We could do with a bit of this sanity in todays F1 scene.

Chris

[LittleChris]

One of my favourite bits of the Donaldson book is the incident on a plane where James allegedly dropped a tab of acid and pissed on Esther Rantzens lap ( Esther Rantzen, for non UK people, being a well known and very annoying TV presenter ).

Chris

[BRG]

I had the chance to talk to Hunt once, at Brands Hatch. Somehow, I got involved in a casual conservation with him and Ronnie Peterson. It was in the paddock between qualifying and the race, probably at one of the non-championship races in the early 1970s, I don't recall which. They were both bare-chested in the sunshine, with their overalls rolled down to the the waist (steady, girls!). You will be uninterested to know that I was fully clothed.

James was funny and easy-going, with no airs and graces at all (as was Ronnie too). What struck me was how bad his physique and posture was. He was roundshouldered and a bit flabby - not at all the picture of the well-honed athlete that we expect of top drivers nowadays. I believe that he was actually physically unable to lock his arms when lifting weights over his head.

As a driver, he was very wild in his younger days. I remember him at Crystal Palace in F3 colliding with someone (Dave Morgan, was it
?) and ending up in a wheel-less chassis in the middle of the track.This may be the incident that mark f1 referred to? But there were severla - not for nothing was he called "Hunt the Shunt" . But he was quick and under the unconventional exterior, he was a very serious racing driver. By rights, he probably shouldn't have got inot F1, but he did, perhaps by good luck. But having done so, to go on to achieve what he did with the Hesketh team was astonishing. For a new F1 driver in a new F1 team to start wining races and challenging stars like Fittipaldi and Lauda was an exceptional performance.

I admired Hunt's retirement. After a lacklustre few races with Wolf, he realised that he no longer had the motivation and had the courage to give up driving immediately, thereby providing Rosberg with a golden opportunity to get into a good F1 seat, which we all know he used very well. It is a pity that Damon Hill did not do the same when he ran out of steam, and perhaps Mika likewise...

[Robbie]

All of the replies above are very interesting. Thanks, more welcome.

[mark f1]

BRG, It was a different incident. According to the book, the one you are referring to is when Dave Morgan took Hunt off at the last corner at Crystal Palace in F3 in late 1970 trying to take 3rd place off him, "James jumped out of his car, ran over to Morgan and flattened him with a single blow".

It doesn't say whether Morgan still had his helmet on.

Apparently this race was televised and so didn't do Hunt's reputation well at all. It eventually went to an RAC tribunal hearing, Hunt got off and Morgan got a one year's suspension of his licence. A few months later he appealed and got his licence back.

[SennasCat]

Without a doubt, the most entertaining F1 commentator ever. None of this glossy good news week bullshit that Murray Walker is always sprouting. He just didn't give a stuff and called it like he saw it. (Patrese bias notwithstanding)

[BRG]

Originally posted by mark f1
It doesn't say whether Morgan still had his helmet on.

Open-faced helmets back then, of course, so you could still get a decent punch in!

[MOTORSPORT RESORT]

Hunt the Shunt..as they called him, but when not racing he had a great night club (disco) down here in Marbella, called "Oscars" after he loved shepard..
I have heard some unreal stories of the crazy times, at the "club" that would make his racing experiences seem tame...

He is still a legend, with the Marbella Jetset, and won't be forgotten for a long time......

Peter
speedy@f1power.com

[Robbie]

I recall one incident where in his frustration at a shunt which took him off he punched the marshall who was trying to help him. I always think of that when I see drivers being 'consoled' or whatever it is marshalls do today.

James immediately regretted his punch and apologized to the marshall. I don't remember the race (it was a GP).

[rdrcr]

Long Before Eddie Irvine was gallivanting around the circuit, James Hunt was The Ladies man in the '70s... He was fast on and off the track.

I recall seeing him race at the Glen from '75 thru '79 and in Long Beach and Canada from '76 thru '79. The crowd at the Glen loved his performance in the Hesketh and then in the McLaren on his way to the Championship in '76. He drove for March early in his F1 career (I think) and ended with a drive in one of Walter Wolf's Ford powered cars. His career faded with poor performances at the end like so many. He had charisma by the mile and a brashness that only Irvine could appreciate. He was a pretty good racer although not what would call gifted or an amazing talent, yet he was there and competitive when it counted. He was a top 10 competitor in a day that was packed with excellent drivers. However, Lauda's misfortune in '76 was the only reason that he achieved his crown in many opinions.

I remember last seeing him by pure chance in '92 in Las Vegas. Sitting at one of the bars on the casino floor at Caesar's... He was accompanied by two showgirl types, tall and gorgeous. He was smashed and wearing illuminated earrings in each ear and having the time of his life... Good thing too, because it was just a year later, he was dead of a heart attack... One could only speculate as to the real reason that his ticker gave out.

He was the epitome of the handsome Brit in the worlds most glamorous racing cars... He enjoyed it as much as we enjoyed watch him.

[ehagar]

Originally posted by Robbie
I recall one incident where in his frustration at a shunt which took him off he punched the marshall who was trying to help him. I always think of that when I see drivers being 'consoled' or whatever it is marshalls do today.

James immediately regretted his punch and apologized to the marshall. I don't remember the race (it was a GP).

Was it at Mosport? My uncle seems to have a big hate on Hunt for that. I just laughed at it. If I were the marshal, I would pocket that so I had a little story of how I got punched by a world champion!

[LittleChris]

eHagar,

Yep it was Mosport in 1977. Hunt was fighting with Andretti for the lead when they came upon Mass ( Hunt's team-mate ) at turn 2. Unfortunately the hapless Jochen confused James who ran off the road into the barrier. Bloody good punch it was too if I remember rightly from the TV.

Chris

[David M. Kane]

For what it is worth James was apparently a very promising junior
tennis player. So I would imagine he had extremely good hand-eye
coordination which is extremely important in driving a F1 car. Hand-eye coordination didn't seem to hurt Jackie Stewart either.

The people who raced against him seem to rate him a lot higher than you guys do.

[LittleChris]

David,

I think he also played squash at county level.

I'd recommend Gerald Donaldson's book to anyone who hasn't got it. It's better than his tome on Gilles Villeneuve in my opinion.

Chris

[deangelis86]

Brundle and Murray may well be a great double act, but they couldn't hold a candle to the "Hunt and Walker".

The differening opinions of Hunt always ensured that both sides of any given story was represented. They brought to the commentary box a unique blend of experience, Murray with his Paddock gossip and speculation, Hunt with his technical and personal experience of F1.

The ensuing discussions in the commentary box always had me roaring with laughter, as Hunt delivered some damming verdicts with the touch of a rapist.

The only other person that I can recall having the ability to call a spade a spade in F1 other than Mr Hunt was Keke.

Here's two classic quotes I can recall from James.

"Look at that idiot!!" - on De Cesaris during the 1990 San Marino
"I know nothing about him" - on Tarquini in the BBC GP' 88 book

RIP, old boy...

[mark f1]

I just read that Hunt came down to Oz to race in an end of year F5000 event at Winton in 1978. He won. Does anyone know the background to this trip? Which car did he drive?

[Rainer Nyberg]

He raced an Elfin in the Australian F5000 event.

[SennasCat]

Note that the words in this post are my recollection of James Hunts, not my spin on it!

I remeber a pretty average British Grand Prix when, from memory the Williamses lapped the field, Piquest in Honda Lotus was one lap down and Piquet lapped Nakajima. Onboard of Nakajima was shown, with Hunt grumbling something about 'Nakajima's pathetic attempts to drive the Lotus'
He also in 1982 said 'the new Ferrari was much better than last year's abortion of a chassis'
and also really paid out on a TV director, i think in the Old Osterreichring, saying things like here is an interesting study of an empty track, and we hope to come back next year, after the director has seen his first motor race.

They just don't make them like that anymore:up:

[leegle]

He spent the whole race at Winton being chased by John McCormack's McLaren M23. There was an irony in that because Hunt was in an Elfin while McCormack was in the car Hunt had come to fame in. McCormack had a problem that meant he pitted the first lap and came out right with Hunt and stayed with him. I read somewhere here that he had to relieve himself publicly before the start.

[Johnny Lugnuts]

Originally posted by LittleChris
eHagar,

Yep it was Mosport in 1977. Hunt was fighting with Andretti for the lead when they came upon Mass ( Hunt's team-mate ) at turn 2. Unfortunately the hapless Jochen confused James who ran off the road into the barrier. Bloody good punch it was too if I remember rightly from the TV.

Chris

Your description is accurate Chris, however, allow me to nit-pick. The incident actually occurred at turn 3. The entire thing happened before my own eyes. As an adolescent of only thirteen attending my very first race of any kind, I wondered to myself "Cool! Are all car races like this?"

Thanks for the entertainment, James; I shall never forget it.

Regards,

Johnny Lugnuts

[ehagar]

You know, I find it kind of surprising that there is a Murray Walker quote page, a Martin Brundle page, but as of yet, no James Hunt quote page... If someone could compile a list, you might have something quite hilarious.

I wonder what Murray Walker thought of his late broadcast partner. An 'Ask Murray' question?

[Witt]

ehagar, I just read this little article by Murray Walker, about James' feelings towards Ricardo Patrese (from the Ricardo Patrese site). It's only about James' sentiment towards Ricardo, but it'll give you a little insight about James from Murray.

http://www.geocities...RPArticles.html

And as for a quotes page, that would be great idea! Just listening to some of his golden commentary recently, can't remember anything specifically, but he made me laugh pretty hard a few times!

[man]

Originally posted by LittleChris
One of my favourite bits of the Donaldson book is the incident on a plane where James allegedly dropped a tab of acid and pissed on Esther Rantzens lap ( Esther Rantzen, for non UK people, being a well known and very annoying TV presenter ).

Chris

I'm sure James found that more rewarding than his '76 championship! Brilliant, he has gone up in my estimation tenfold! Esther Rantzen.....

I remember him saying in one of his commentaries that Jarrier deserves a 'knuckle sandwich' after consistantly blocking Tambay's Ferrari.

[f1steveuk]

As regards James' fitness, no he wasn't a regular of the gym, and I know nothing of his inability to lock his arms when lifting weights, but I do remember he was ultra competitive on the BBC "Superstars" programme (years before Noige cheated in the squat thrusts!!), he had no trouble with his chin ups there, and always relaxed after the tests with a cigerette!

[Cirrus]

I remember flying down to Spain on a package holiday in 1980. James Hunt was in the row in front of us, sitting next to a middle-aged lady. He was charm itself, listening to her stories about her family, asking questions, hearing about her son's banger racing exploits, buying her a drink etc.

He went up hugely in my estimation that day, especially as he willingly signed my copy of Grand Prix International!

[f1steveuk]

One of my treasured memories. I won a kart championship, and at the end of the year it was to be presented to me by James Hunt. I hated dressing up, and James turned up, jeans and T shirt, with Oscar by his side! Quick hand shake and the comment, "karts, bugger that, no protection" Later he chatted like an old friend, remebered everyones names and stayed right until the end, brilliant!

[MonzaDriver]

Originally posted by David M. Kane


The people who raced against him seem to rate him a lot higher than you guys do.

I have always this double feeling about James Hunt.

I have seen it racing, I have read his book " Against all odds", I have the dvd "Hunt" by Duke video.
Based on this three things he seems to me an incredible intelligent person, surely he have had problems with depression, but his way to explain racing his fantastic. Inspirational every time I look at dvd or I re-read the book.
Not to mention when he explain that during the closing stages of the mitical Japanese GP 1976,
he was asking to his box, if it was the case to change tyres, but the box replied with a question mark on the pit - board, and to open the arms, with the meaning " what we gonna do???"
I mean have you ever heard an explanation so honest.......???

Then there are a lot of tells that portrait him both intelligent...............or wild !!!

MonzaDriver.

[Rockford]

Originally posted by f1steveuk
he was ultra competitive on the BBC "Superstars" programme (years before Noige cheated in the squat thrusts!!), he had no trouble with his chin ups there, and always relaxed after the tests with a cigerette!

Wasn't it Jody Scheckter that cheated in the squat thrusts (grease on the soles of his trainers or something) ?

[f1steveuk]

Originally posted by Rockford


Wasn't it Jody Scheckter that cheated in the squat thrusts (grease on the soles of his trainers or something) ?

Yep Scheckter greased his shoes, but Mansell did the thing where he found if you balanced on your arms you could just slide your feet backward and forward! Racing drivers eh!!

[Rockford]

Yeah it's funny how they always look for the smallest advantage in everything they do...

[Rockford]

.... and cheat obviously...

[MrSlow]

Originally posted by Steve Williams

They just don't make them like that anymore:up:

They do, but nowadays those guys never reach the top.
I liked James Hunt, but if any of todays drivers would park their car at the side of the track and fall a sleep (hangover), they would not be in the show for long
(well, the jury is still out on Kimi)

"The history puts a saint in every dream" (Tom Waits)

[Mohican]

Coming back to Mosport in 1977, the way that Hunt had continually referred to his team-mate as "Herman the German" in his Autosport column probably did not endear him to Mass.

All the same, a great character. Must admit that I at the time thought better of Lauda and worse of Hunt. Today it is perhaps the other way round.

Hunt's personal problems that are well known today were not so at the time, certainly not to the world outside the paddock anyway. But the fact that his wife left him for Richard Burton - of all people - and that he publicly referred to her successor as "Hot Loins" tells you something.

Always felt that the one true blot on his record was his life-long anti-Patrese campaign. That was really unacceptable - and Wqalker and the BBC should have made that clear.

[ian senior]

I suppose this gives me a chance to tell a James Hunt story, even though really it's an Andy Sutcliffe story.

Croft in July '71, F3 racing, all the top guys there. I was accompanied at this event by a mate whose enthusiasm for motor racing far outstripped his capacity to employ tact when it was needed. He'd been around the paddock, scrounging autographs, and told me about approaching a blond haired driver with a request to sign. The driver obliged, willingly, and signed his name - James Hunt. My mate looked down and said "oh - I thought you were Andy Sutcliffe". James pointed out very patiently that no, he was in fact James Hunt.

A little while later I was off on my own search of signatures and came across Mr Sutcliffe. He seemed amiable enough, so I told him of the earlier incident. Andy almost wet himself laughing. Later on in the day I bumped into him again. He said "has your mate got my autograph yet - look, there's Hunt over there".

[Mohican]

Remember the patch on Hunt's Hesketh overalls ?

"Sex is a high performance thing."

Could not see any of the drivers wearing that today, or being allowed to. Not even Kimi - although if the text were in Finnish, nobody would understand anyway.

[Twin Window]

Originally posted by Mohican

Remember the patch on Hunt's Hesketh overalls ?

He also wore one which read 'Sex: breakfast of champions'

[Paul Parker]

The earler reference in this thread concerning Hunt's collision with D. Morgan at a Crystal Palace F3 race in 1970 reminds me if memory serves correctly of a published response from his mother.

This was printed in Autosport I seem to recall and in it Mrs. Morgan describes the 'Shunt' as "the beastly boy Hunt". My archive is currently a whole continent away so perhaps one of you worthies could check it out, I'm sure I read it somewhere.

Anyway Hunt's early demise is fairly typical of persons who have smoked regularily and also taken so called recreational drugs. It wears your heart and body out and pics of JH taken post 1969 show him gradually deteriorating visually. Very sad and totally innecessary.

[Paul Rochdale]

This Crystal Palace F3 race was featured in the series '100 Greatest Sporting Moments' (or something like that) which was on our screens about ten years ago. I have it videod somewhere, however I seem to recall Hunt thumping Morgan about the head who was still strapped into his car at the time. There was also a ducumentary about Hunt not that long ago which showed his general decline, and the incident when he drunkenly had an altercation with a doorman of a hotel (?). A strange man who vomitted in his pit before races, and openly urinated in aircraft. Nevertheless a joy to listen to, and watch when in his prime; and a courageous man to admit that F! was beginning to frighten him so got out.