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Winter Testing 2007-2008 Thread


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#1 dutra

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 21:45

According to Felipe Massa the tests will start next month with 2007 cars and with 2008 regulations, naturally.
Anyone has the schedules of these initial tests?

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#2 AFCA

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 21:50

Originally posted by AFCA
Luca Filippi will get a test with Honda in the wintermonths. When and where it will take place is yet unknown.

Filippi is said still to be to Ferrari's interest but his first F1 experience will be with another team. Honda might well be looking for new testdrivers too. They've lost Rossiter during the year to Super Aguri and Klien has already stated not to be willing to be a testdriver for another year.

------------

Just post it here...here's the testschedule from the coming test till the end of next year:

13-15 November: Barcelona
4-6 December: Jerez
14-16 January: Jerez
22-24 January: Valencia
1-3 February: Barcelona
12-14 February: Jerez
25-27 February: Barcelona
14-16 April Barcelona
14-16 May: Paul Ricard
11-13 June: Barcelona
25-27 June: Silverstone
9-11 July: Hockenheimring
23-25 July: Jerez
27-29 August: Monza
17-19 September: Barcelona
18-20 November: Barcelona
9-11 December: Jerez
15-17 December: Jerez

There will be five tests before the season.

During the season there will be 8 tests that commence on Wednesday and end on Friday. For the Grand Prix drivers there's some more time between a Grand Prix and a testsession (compared with this years' Tuesday - Thursday schedule).

There will be three tests after the season.

On top of that there will be four one day tests for rookies (the definition of a rookie here is a driver that hasn't been in the car for more than four days in the past 24 months, regardless of whether this was during a test or GP-weekend). The maximum amount of testing kilometres is again 30.000 but these four days will not count for that. There is a special maximum of 350 km for this per day.

Furthermore, as far as I'm aware, the testrules, agreed upon by the teams themselves, have remained unchanged.

It turns out btw that Dennis wanted to do away with all the big tests during the inseason. For obvious reasons: up till now McLaren has the best simulator of all the teams and a testban during the season would harm McLaren little in comparison with the others.


Originally posted by AFCA
It is not unthinkable there will be some changes made to the testschedule posted above (it's also noticable Bahrain isn't included in the list, I wouldn't be surprised if Ferrari would go there again anyway). This winter a new circuit will be added to the list of Spanish testtracks. Circuito Monteblanco is a completely new circuit in the vicinity of Huelva (in the south of Spain near the Portugese border) and its lay-out has resemblance to that of Bahrain.

http://www.circuitom.../obra/127_1.JPG

Various teams have already requested to test here. Before they will be allowed to, the track needs to acquire a FIA T1-status, the indication that the circuit is safe enough for Formula 1 cars to drive on it.

Director of the circuit Michel Ligonnet explains: ''At the moment we're very busy carrying out a number of modifications that the FIA demanded in order for us to obtain the T1-status. The work that's being carried out now is for the safety of the drivers. We expect to round up the work around the middle of December. As soon as we're done, the FIA will come over to inspect the circuit and, if everything turns out to be fine, will give its approval. From that moment it would only take a couple of days to obtain the T1-status.''

''We expect to have received the T1-status at the end of the year, so we will be able to organise Formula 1 tests from that moment on. I think tests will be held here looking at the requests from the teams we're receiving now. A majority of the teams have requested testdays during the winterperiod for the preperation for the 2008 season.''

Apperantly all constructor teams have shown their interesm to test at the circuit during the last week of January or the first week of February.

--------

Meanwhile, it is announced that Van der Garde will test for Force India at Barcelona in November and the Dutchman said there's another testday, at Jerez a month after, reserved for him as well.



#3 AFCA

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 21:54

To add to what is written in my post above.

Here are the main (cost reducing) points of the testagreement the teams agreed on early October 2006, which I believe has remained unchanged:

* No more than 300 sets of tyres are allowed to be used within the 30.000 km limit.

* At each test during the in-season it is not allowed to test with more than one car.

* During the in-season there will be eight three-days tests. Between the end of the season and the end of the year, there will be two more three-days tests.

* In case a team decides not to take part in on of these official tests, they can still test on their pre-chosen 'home-circuit'. But then they have to work without Bridgestone's people and the support of the tyre company. (Two teams testing at a track is enough to get the support).

* Before the start of the season every team is allowed to do three days of private testing, for instance to present the car to the press, or for filming activities. Bridgestone will supply tyres for pr-work and demonstrations but the specification of the tyre will not be a current or new one.

* Each team is allowed to do 12 days of aerodynamic straight-line testing (50 km maximm for each day).

* Each team is allowed to carry out a shakedown (50 km maximum) before a Grand Prix.

#4 dutra

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 22:14

Thanks for the info.

#5 Wout

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 23:06

So, can we safely assume that all cars from now on will use the standard ECU in testing?

#6 dutra

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 23:48

Ferrari, at least, yes. Their tests already begins with the 2008 package (new ECU, without TC and the other smaller changes).
Probably everybody will do the same right from the start too.

#7 Atreiu

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Posted 29 October 2007 - 23:49

That track looks okay for testing.




I wonder what would be the effects of a radical proposal: exchange testing sessions for non GP events with a very wide open set of rules. I'll start a thread when I have some more patience.

:)

#8 512 TR

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 00:15

Thanks AFCA! As always. :up:

#9 nissan_gtp

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 00:28

13-15 November: Barcelona
4-6 December: Jerez
14-16 January: Jerez
22-24 January: Valencia
1-3 February: Barcelona
12-14 February: Jerez
25-27 February: Barcelona
14-16 April Barcelona
14-16 May: Paul Ricard
11-13 June: Barcelona
25-27 June: Silverstone
9-11 July: Hockenheimring
23-25 July: Jerez
27-29 August: Monza
17-19 September: Barcelona
18-20 November: Barcelona
9-11 December: Jerez
15-17 December: Jerez



....and Max can't think of how to reduce costs, other than emasculating the technology

#10 Atreiu

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 01:27

Originally posted by nissan_gtp


....and Max can't think of how to reduce costs, other than emasculating the technology


Imagine a dozen + cars retiring at Australia because the new and untested statdard ECU decided to show new glitches after a SC deployment. They didn't have the time to iron it all out perfectly because there weren't enough tests...

IMO, testing should be brought closer to the public, not eliminated.

#11 dutra

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 02:08

Originally posted by Atreiu

testing should be brought closer to the public, not eliminated.


It's a good idea, but how exactly do that?

#12 BiH

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 04:00

AFCA :up: :up:

@at dutra think you should change this thread title to Winter Testing 07-08.....every season there is winter testing thread....

#13 polymath

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 12:06

Originally posted by Atreiu


Imagine a dozen + cars retiring at Australia because the new and untested statdard ECU decided to show new glitches after a SC deployment. They didn't have the time to iron it all out perfectly because there weren't enough tests...

IMO, testing should be brought closer to the public, not eliminated.


I would love to go to tests, I have been looking at the Paul Ricard HTTT web site and they have a package for the test session. Does any one know if the other tracks have any thing similar? Has anyone been to the testing at Paul Ricard?

#14 dutra

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 12:14

Originally posted by BiH
AFCA :up: :up:

@at dutra think you should change this thread title to Winter Testing 07-08.....every season there is winter testing thread....


I agree.

But the change has to be made by a moderator, right?

Could one of you guys make the change please?

#15 Buttoneer

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 12:43

Originally posted by Atreiu


Imagine a dozen + cars retiring at Australia because the new and untested statdard ECU decided to show new glitches after a SC deployment. They didn't have the time to iron it all out perfectly because there weren't enough tests...

IMO, testing should be brought closer to the public, not eliminated.

OK so eliminate testing in-season and doube the amount of pre-season testing. If that serves to reduce the amount of changes amde to cars during the season this isn't far from introducing homologation which Max thinks is desirable anyway.

The cost cutting excuse is a big fat lie because the better funded teams will get round it either way.

AFCA, one point that I'm not sure of for next year; it was my understanding that Ferrari got agreement from other teams that it could test on it's own circuits 1.5 days for every 1 day of testing at other designated circuits they forego. Is this agreement still in place as far as you are aware?

#16 AFCA

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 13:25

Originally posted by nissan_gtp


....and Max can't think of how to reduce costs, other than emasculating the technology


The FIA has nothing to say on testagreements, the teams decide on this themselves.

Originally posted by Buttoneer

AFCA, one point that I'm not sure of for next year; it was my understanding that Ferrari got agreement from other teams that it could test on it's own circuits 1.5 days for every 1 day of testing at other designated circuits they forego. Is this agreement still in place as far as you are aware?


Every team got to choose a home circuit on which they could test for 1.5 day while it would only count for 1 day.

But I haven't heard anything about this for a long time and I think that with the 30.000 km limit (as well as all the fixed dates for testing that have been set anyway) this has been done away with.

From what I recall btw, last year Ferrari only tested twice at Mugello and only carried out 50 km shakedowns at Fiorano. They hardly ever use their own circuits nowadays...

#17 Buttoneer

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 14:23

Originally posted by AFCA


The FIA has nothing to say on testagreements, the teams decide on this themselves.


Thanks for the home track info.

Regarding the point above, the FIA could, if it wished, include testing limits within the sporting regs so this is not an excuse in itself.

#18 Owen

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 16:15

Countdown starting on how long it takes for someone to say 'it's only testing and doesn't count'.

#19 AFCA

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 17:32

Originally posted by Wout
So, can we safely assume that all cars from now on will use the standard ECU in testing?


Yes and after the many complaints the system has been revised in some areas.

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#20 512 TR

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 17:42

Originally posted by AFCA


Yes and after the many complaints the system has been revised in some areas.


There's much more coming regarding that aspect...take cover.

#21 Paul Prost

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 17:57

Can you guys elaborate? I had heard that after Ferrari and Renault ran the McLaren ECU in anger.. that McLaren were considering re-designing the hardware to make it less susceptible to external electro-magnetic interference.

#22 dutra

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 18:24

Originally posted by Owen
Countdown starting on how long it takes for someone to say 'it's only testing and doesn't count'.


Probably will happen just after the first test result without Ferrari in the first place. :lol:

#23 wingwalker

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Posted 30 October 2007 - 18:33

Thanks AFCA.

I have a question regarding testing in Bahrain and on the track above: it would make sense to open the entire circuit (with all the variations) and let the teams decide where they drive so they can adjust setup for various requirement, although that would create safety issues at (rare) times when the track is crowded. So does it happen, or all the teams use one variation of the track?

#24 dutra

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Posted 01 November 2007 - 16:53

Last season did someone got close to the 30.000 Km limit?

#25 Hacklerf

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Posted 01 November 2007 - 17:13

Originally posted by wingwalker
Thanks AFCA.

I have a question regarding testing in Bahrain and on the track above: it would make sense to open the entire circuit (with all the variations) and let the teams decide where they drive so they can adjust setup for various requirement, although that would create safety issues at (rare) times when the track is crowded. So does it happen, or all the teams use one variation of the track?


I understand they use 1 track layout per day, changing the configurations for the following days practice

#26 Buttoneer

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Posted 01 November 2007 - 18:40

Originally posted by Paul Prost
Can you guys elaborate? I had heard that after Ferrari and Renault ran the McLaren ECU in anger.. that McLaren were considering re-designing the hardware to make it less susceptible to external electro-magnetic interference.

I wonder which team will be the first to run an EMP bomb in its exhaust fairing?

#27 gerry nassar

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Posted 01 November 2007 - 21:06

Please keep all winter testing related discussion to this thread. Thanks.

#28 AFCA

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Posted 01 November 2007 - 21:39

Originally posted by wingwalker
Thanks AFCA.

I have a question regarding testing in Bahrain and on the track above: it would make sense to open the entire circuit (with all the variations) and let the teams decide where they drive so they can adjust setup for various requirement, although that would create safety issues at (rare) times when the track is crowded. So does it happen, or all the teams use one variation of the track?


They never do that, that would indeed cause safety issues I think. They teams commonly decide which lay-out to use.

#29 stalix

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Posted 05 November 2007 - 21:11

The teams could use two cars in winter testing ?

#30 Josta

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Posted 05 November 2007 - 22:19

Originally posted by Owen
Countdown starting on how long it takes for someone to say 'it's only testing and doesn't count'.


That will be perfectly relevant till the new cars get tested. Whilst it is 2007 spec cars, the order will be exactly the same as this year. OK, so we have the MES ECU, but this will have nothing like the fundamental effect on current chassis as the tyre change of this year. IMHO, winter testing times will only have any significance when the 2008 cars are revealed next year. Again, IMHO, I believe McLaren will go backwards, (as they tend to do every other year), and Renault will go massively forward. I also expect Red Bull to take big steps forward, and as much as I don't like it, I think BMW will go backwards. I don't know why, but I think they will do a Toyota 2005 - 2006. Ferrari will, as usual, probably be one of the fastest teams. (I don't know how they seem to simultaniously fight for championships and develop the next years car).

My predictions are that NEXT YEARS winter testing AFTER they reveal the new cars will have Ferrari and Renault as top, with Red Bull being 3rd fastest.

Disclaimer......

I may be talking absolute shite.

#31 AFCA

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Posted 05 November 2007 - 22:34

Originally posted by stalix
The teams could use two cars in winter testing ?


Yes, they can in the out-season.

#32 Suntrek

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Posted 06 November 2007 - 00:20

Originally posted by dutra
Last season did someone got close to the 30.000 Km limit?


30.000 km test limit counts per year and so far no team is near it.

1. Renault 24.119
2. Honda 23.987
3. McLaren-Mercedes 23.602
4. BMW Sauber F1 Team 23.216
5. Ferrari 22.228
6. Toyota 21.304
7. Williams 20.436
8. Red Bull Racing 17.694
9. Super Aguri 16.788
10. Scuderia Toro Rosso 11.687
11. Spyker F1 11.597

http://www.motorspor...zem=11&zey=2007



Kubica has been the most diligent test driver.

1. Robert Kubica 10.544
2. Kimi Räikkönen 10.020
3. Felipe Massa 9.998
4. Heikki Kovalainen 9.757
5. Jenson Button 9.126
6. Rubens Barrichello 8.737
7. Mark Webber 8.627
8. David Coulthard 8.159
9. Lewis Hamilton 8.142
10. Nick Heidfeld 8.073
11. Pedro de la Rosa 7.910
12. Ralf Schumacher 7.864
13. Jarno Trulli 7.828
14. Nico Rosberg 7.807
15. Fernando Alonso 7.550
16. Giancarlo Fisichella 6.934
17. Alexander Wurz 6.798
18. Nelson Piquet jr. 6.741
19. Anthony Davidson 6.738
20. Takuma Sato 6.040
21. Franck Montagny 5.612
22. Kazuki Nakajima 5.594
23. Christian Klien 5.096
24. Vitantonio Liuzzi 4.880
25. James Rossiter 4.861
26. Adrian Sutil 4.181
27. Scott Speed 3.931
28. Christijan Albers 3.715
29. Sebastian Vettel 3.541
30. Timo Glock 2.416
31. Luca Badoer 2.210
32. Sébastien Bourdais 1.519
33. Giedo van der Garde 1.070
34. Fairuz Fauzy 979
35. Sebastien Buemi 908
36. Ricardo Zonta 686
37. Marco Andretti 602
38. Adrian Valles 585
39. Sakon Yamamoto 417
40. Narain Karthikeyan 236
41. Markus Winkelhock 226

http://www.motorspor...zem=11&zey=2007

#33 Bumper

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Posted 07 November 2007 - 11:59

Thanks AFCA for all the info. Winter testing is the most exciting part of the F1 season IMO :love:

Originally posted by polymath
I would love to go to tests, I have been looking at the Paul Ricard HTTT web site and they have a package for the test session. Does any one know if the other tracks have any thing similar?


Barcelona and Valencia are always open to the public for general F1 tests, and I think Monza as well. You basically just turn up, pay the paltry sum of 5 euro entry fee and you're in. Easy to do from anywhere in Europe with so many low-cost flights available. Bring your own drink/food as concession stands will be closed.

Valencia only opens up the pit grandstand, but it also gives you a full overview of the paddock on the other side so you can see the drivers walking around. As the grandstand is on the same side as the pitlane, the cars are only meters away and you can see all the little differences in wings, etc.

Barcelona opens up several grandstands, including the main grandstand opposite the pitlane as well as part of the 'stadium area'. If you are a member of the track you will have paddock access. If you're not a member, find someone who is, make friends and find yourself on the right side of the pitlane ;)

#34 Guinnevvere

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Posted 07 November 2007 - 20:18

BARCELONA 13TH - 15TH NOVEMBER
Day 1 - Pedro and Gary
Day 2 - Pedro and Gary
Day 3 - Pedro and Gary

JEREZ 4TH - 6TH DECEMBER
Day 1 - Pedro and Gary
Day 2 - Lewis and Pedro
Day 3 - Lewis and Pedro

mclaren.com

#35 Lifew12

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Posted 08 November 2007 - 10:15

Originally posted by Guinnevvere
BARCELONA 13TH - 15TH NOVEMBER
Day 1 - Pedro and Gary
Day 2 - Pedro and Gary
Day 3 - Pedro and Gary

JEREZ 4TH - 6TH DECEMBER
Day 1 - Pedro and Gary
Day 2 - Lewis and Pedro
Day 3 - Lewis and Pedro

mclaren.com


Renault have Kovalainen, only, running all three days next week.

#36 AFCA

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:09

The testschedule for Barcelona:

Ferrari
Tuesday: Michael Schumacher and Luca Badoer
Wednesday: Michael Schumacher and Felipe Massa
Thursday: Felipe Massa and Luca Badoer

McLaren
Tuesday: Pedro de la Rosa and Gary Paffett
Wednesday: Pedro de la Rosa and Gary Paffett
Thursday: Pedro de la Rosa and Gary Paffett

BMW-Sauber
Tuesday: Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica
Wednesday: Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica
Thursday: Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica

Renault:
Tuesday: Heikki Kovalainen
Wednesday: Heikki Kovalainen
Thursday: Heikki Kovalainen

Williams
Tuesday: Kazuki Nakajima
Wednesda: Nico Rosberg
Thursday: Nico Rosberg

Red Bull Racing
Tuesday: Karun Chandhok and David Coulthard
Wednesday: Karun Chandhok and David Coulthard
Thursday: Robert Doornbos and David Coulthard

Scuderia Toro Rosso
Dinsdag: Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel
Wednesday: Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel
Thursday: Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel

Honda (on either of these days Andreas Zuber, Mike Conway and Luca Filippi will also be testing)
Tuesday: James Rossiter
Wednesday: Jenson Button
Thursday: Jenson Button

Toyota
Tuesday: Jarno Trulli and Franck Montagny
Wednesday: Jarno Trulli and Franck Montagny
Thursday: Jarno Trulli and Franck Montagny

Super Aguri Racing:
Tuesday: Takuma Sato / Anthony Davidson / James Rossiter ?
Wednesday: Takuma Sato / Anthony Davidson / James Rossiter ?
Thursday: Takuma Sato / Anthony Davidson / James Rossiter ?

Force India
Tuesday: Roldan Rodriguez and Giedo van der Garde
Wednesday: Adrian Sutil, Christian Klien and Vitantonio Liuzzi
Thursday: Adrian Sutil, Christian Klien and Vitantonio Liuzzi

#37 F1Champion

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:14

Return of the King tomorrow. :clap:

#38 noikeee

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:18

I've just read in another forum that "Sebastien Loeb will do 3 days of testing for Renault in December in Paul Ricard".

#39 512 TR

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:23

Any news on this for tomorrow?

http://aplicacions.c...et.asp?Idioma=2

The webcams still work.

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#40 AFCA

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:37

Originally posted by paranoik0
I've just read in another forum that "Sebastien Loeb will do 3 days of testing for Renault in December in Paul Ricard".


It's just one day I think...

Originally posted by AFCA
WRC Citroen drivers Sebastien Loeb and Dani Sordo will test for Renault on the fifth of December at Paul Ricard. Either Kovalainen or Fisichella will be testing the Citroen rally car in turn...


Meanwhile Schumacher stated to Bild that he doesn't necessarily has to drive for a topteam and that it can also be a great challenge to build up something (in a small team)...



#41 AFCA

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:48

McLaren brought two new front wings to Spain, both without the bridge.

Red Bull even brought three new wings.

Force India will be driving in white and bordeaux red (interim livery) whereas Super Aguri and Honda will both drive with completely white cars.

The expectation is that there won't be any rain this week and that the temperature will be around 15 C.

#42 rodlamas

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 18:55

Force India to test with 5 drivers: Sutil, Rodriguez, Van der Garde, Klien and Liuzzi.

Fisichella and Ralf to test with them in December in Jerez.

#43 DLaw

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 19:00

Interesting remarks from Schumi.

I think at this point if he could be an adviser to Force India, may be more of a chellenge for him.

#44 noikeee

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 19:05

You guys are talking about Ralf Schumacher, right?!

#45 AFCA

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 19:08

Obviously... :smoking:

#46 quasi C

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 19:17

We already have some pics:

http://www.f1today.n...lbum&albumID=41

New force india livery too.

#47 shonguiz

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 20:36

Hey AFCA do you confirm that Badoer will test a car with TC and without the MES ?

#48 AFCA

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 20:37

Originally posted by shonguiz
Hey AFCA do you confirm that Badoer will test a car with TC and without the MES ?


It's what I read last week so I assume that's what they're going to do...

#49 shonguiz

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 20:39

Thanks :up:

#50 BiH

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Posted 12 November 2007 - 21:11

I really really hope that teams don't screw us over like last winter tests by hiring private companies to do their timing instead of the circuit timing :mad:


hope this still works

http://aplicacions.c...et.asp?Idioma=2