1310 replies to this topic

[CountDooku]

Interesting (albeit paywalled) article in the FT about a plan from Liberty to expand the physical events linked to an F1 weekend.

The article also says that F1 has seriously neglected marketing, digital and data and that the firm will look to drag F1 into the 21st century and find new fans. It also mentions that they recognise PayTV has been partially behind the collapse of viewership so perhaps they recognise Sky's held may not have been the best idea. Lastly, they are considering hosting races in the big US markets like NYC, LA, Miami and Vegas.

It would be interesting to see what they come up with (virtual reality was also mentioned) without dumbing down the sport so much. I firmly believe sport snobbery is a big draw for F1 fans!

What would you change about current F1 events in terms of viewing options, accompanying shows, marketing and fan interactions to make the sport great again?

https://www.ft.com/c...4f-20dcb35cede2

[Christbiscuit]

All this fluff worries me. If the racing is crap, who honestly cares? Let's get a financially sustainable series with multiple strong teams and drivers not made mute by corporate leashes. Let's see some personality and emotion. If the action is interesting you won't need to pay a clown like Bieber to mime, the crowds will come. Racing fans are drawn to racing.

Edited by Christbiscuit, 29 December 2016 - 08:55.

[Ricciardo2014]

Well I can't read the article, but F1 has been slowly losing viewer numbers the last year or two, obviously down to the pay per view deal.

I'm ok with that, because my Brother is a rich bastard who has the Foxtel, Premium, Platinum, Suck It Up You Owe me $140 a Month Package.

So I can watch everything I want live, and the replays they show every few days as well, because I'm crashing at his place at the moment 

 

What I really think they can do media wise, is engage us more with free stuff though.

I know they want to be the "elite" when it comes to motorsport, but putting every single thing off limits to the fans with not much cash is a bad move as far as I'm concerned.

 

Even if it was to go as far as letting fans post their F1 vids on YouTube, without them being ruthlessly hunted down and deleted.

That would have to help create more interest in the sport if new people could watch wouldn't it ?

I know they don't want "official" vids stolen, but that is seriously one of my bugbears 

[superden]

Super Bowl

No thanks. Anything even remotely in that direction and good luck to them, but I'm not interested.

[wj_gibson]

Considering races in LA, Vegas and New York? That sounds familiar...

[TazioRaikkonen]

No thanks. Anything even remotely in that direction and good luck to them, but I'm not interested.

F1 needs pure racing. Not hyperactive nonsense like the Super Bowl.

[johnmhinds]

Nothing in that article sounds like Liberty has any new ideas for the sport that will appeal to racing fans.

They're just talking about tacking on other events and doing things like selling off the naming rights for the races to make a bit more money.

They are just focusing on making more profit per weekend.

Edited by johnmhinds, 29 December 2016 - 11:55.

[PayasYouRace]

I'm not subscribing to the Financial Times to read that article.

[johnmhinds]

I'm not subscribing to the Financial Times to read that article.

Can search fo the headline on Google News and it will let you click through and read it, but it isn't really worth reading.

[JHSingo]

All this fluff worries me. If the racing is crap, who honestly cares? Let's get a financially sustainable series with multiple strong teams and drivers not made mute by corporate leashes. Let's see some personality and emotion. If the action is interesting you won't need to pay a clown like Bieber to mime, the crowds will come. Racing fans are drawn to racing.

 

/thread

 

It's why I still don't understand the rationale behind the regulations for next year. The whole focus (incorrectly, I'd say) is on speed and making the cars look nicer, which is a good idea until you remember it'll likely make the quality of the racing (which was already poor) even worse. Equally, Liberty seem to be concerned about everything except the racing, which is a bit bizarre. If you make the product exciting and accessible again, the current trend of poor crowds at tracks and declining viewing figures will surely reverse.

 

Nobody cares about having concerts at races or any other of that complete rubbish. Please focus on the main issues - the lack of competition, and the dull racing.

[goingthedistance]

I'm keeping an open mind. I do agree with them that there is untapped potential in the sport in terms of technological engagement. This is a sport that attracts a very tech savvy audience and yet for so long the coverage of the sport lagged far behind other sports in this regard that had less reason to integrate technology. I still can't believe how long it took Bernie to start broadcasting the sport in HD. I think we need a better online platform. I would pay for the ability to switch between 20 high resolution onboards throughout the race, for example, with a full radio and telemetry feed. There is potential with VR too, though it remains to be seen if VR will ever properly take root with the masses. 

 

The race weekend format does need to change to attract a younger audience IMO. There will be the inevitable resistance to this from older fans, but the sport will die if it does not evolve. 

[BlackCat]

SuperBowl is big because there is just one SB a year, not 16 or even more. In SB there are Conference winners only, no also-runs. So, i'd go with the idea, if:

1) There were about 4 divisions: European, Asian, American + something combined with, say, 6-8 races per year in each division.

 

2) Cars were cheaper to make, so that it would be possible for a manufacturer - if they want - to form francise teams to participate in each division with 2 cars. Older cars allowed, GP2 cars allowed, more kinds of internal combustion engines allowed (and hybrids banned) - whatever it takes to have 16-20-24 cars in each division.

 

3) Limited - and guaranteed - funds for every team. Sponsorship money goes to one big (divisional?)pot.

 

4) "SuperRace" for the best 4 or 5 or 6 from every division, winner is the world champ.

More good ideas from NFL: even if you signed a 5 year, 72 million deal - if you do something stupid or are not on the level required, you are benched and another guy gets your car.

[LeClerc]

Super Bowel?

[noikeee]

Will they stop all the cars midway through the race to show a bunch of overpriced adverts and for Janet Jackson to show a boob?

 

I dunno, I think I'll keep an open mind too. I'm not too sure of what this means yet. If it's adding further gimmicks to the racing whilst only concentrating on off-track issues, essentially polishing a turd, I'm not onboard. But improving the events doesn't necessarily detract from the race itself. If F1 is run as a serious sport but the whole package around is better marketed, and introduces the sport to more people, well, why not?

[johnmhinds]

I'm keeping an open mind. I do agree with them that there is untapped potential in the sport in terms of technological engagement. This is a sport that attracts a very tech savvy audience and yet for so long the coverage of the sport lagged far behind other sports in this regard that had less reason to integrate technology. I still can't believe how long it took Bernie to start broadcasting the sport in HD. I think we need a better online platform. I would pay for the ability to switch between 20 high resolution onboards throughout the race, for example, with a full radio and telemetry feed. There is potential with VR too, though it remains to be seen if VR will ever properly take root with the masses.

The race weekend format does need to change to attract a younger audience IMO. There will be the inevitable resistance to this from older fans, but the sport will die if it does not evolve.

How can you watch a race in the way you describe.

Both the BBC and Sky have already broadcasted multi channel content with onboard views, and they've found that nobody watches the other views because you can't follow a race from a single onboard feed.

What you're describing is just useless gimmicks that people watch once before they go back to the main commentary feed.

[f1paul]

[Ruusperi]

I don't watch Super Bowl, but comparing baseball to F1 is like comparing ski jumping to rugby.

 

...I mean American football to F1.

[hlz15]

They WANT to cause international viewing figures to plummet to the levels of the Superbowl for a sport that will never have a natural affinity for the US audience?

[PayasYouRace]

Or maybe they're going to stop and restart the race after every lap.

[Lord Snooty]

No thanks. Anything even remotely in that direction and good luck to them, but I'm not interested.

Time for me to return to ELMS & WRC if we start having 'half time entertainment spectacles'... :-(

[CountDooku]

Or maybe they're going to stop and restart the race after every lap.

We will have that with the standing starts after the safety car. Life imitating parody.

[LORDBYRON]

He's right. F1 is like the NFL and Super Bowls. Attendance and viewership for the Superbowls, and the NFL is also down, just as it is in NASCAR, NBA, MLB, Soccer Leagues, NASCAR, Indy Car, etc... etc... All pro sports are experiencing a market decline.  The other indicators of a changing world are the drop in sales of Muscle cars like the Camaro and Challenger. We all have more choices today than ever, and more hungry marketers after our spending dollars. It is what it is, and is not going to change any time soon. F1 would be better served finding its way to profitability with lower attendance, fewer countries, and less hype - becoming a purer to itself and its loyalists, than it is by lamenting what is lost, and wistfully hoping to be what it will never be.

[TazioRaikkonen]

He's right. F1 is like the NFL and Super Bowls. Attendance and viewership for the Superbowls, and the NFL is also down, just as it is in NASCAR, NBA, MLB, Soccer Leagues, NASCAR, Indy Car, etc... etc... All pro sports are experiencing a market decline.  The other indicators of a changing world are the drop in sales of Muscle cars like the Camaro and Challenger. We all have more choices today than ever, and more hungry marketers after our spending dollars. It is what it is, and is not going to change any time soon. F1 would be better served finding its way to profitability with lower attendance, fewer countries, and less hype - becoming a purer to itself and its loyalists, than it is by lamenting what is lost, and wistfully hoping to be what it will never be

Good stuff. 100% agree. The sport needs to increase competition between teams. Good point about the NFL as well. Viewership is dropping FAST.

Edited by TazioRaikkonen, 29 December 2016 - 14:22.

[jjcale]

Didnt LH call for F1 to be more like the Superbowl a couple of weeks ago ... are they taking advice from him now?

[Marklar]

Or maybe they're going to stop and restart the race after every lap.

That settles then: The standing SC restarts were Liberty Medias idea. The strategy group has been discharged

[pdac]

I suspect nobody here will like the ideas that they might come out with. The point is that they must try to appeal to those who don't follow F1. This means appealing to people who don't care so much about the racing and care more about a spectacle. It'll probably be about the razzmatazz in future. About the celebrities and the entertainers brought in to make the show. The team bosses will probably be encouraged to come on before each race and big up their teams and throw abuse at the other bosses. It's not going to be about what we like anymore.

[markelov74]

I think that's a way to take F1 forward. F1 with cars and technology is more glamorous and a show than a sport like Football or Cricket. Many don't even consider F1 a proper sport. To get F1 more fans we need to really show off the Wow factor in F1 compared to other sports with faster cars and more exposure. One of the biggest markets for sports is America and we need to appeal to them.

[Clatter]

I suspect nobody here will like the ideas that they might come out with. The point is that they must try to appeal to those who don't follow F1. This means appealing to people who don't care so much about the racing and care more about a spectacle. It'll probably be about the razzmatazz in future. About the celebrities and the entertainers brought in to make the show. The team bosses will probably be encouraged to come on before each race and big up their teams and throw abuse at the other bosses. It's not going to be about what we like anymore.

But how does any of that attract a new audience, especially if they have to pay for the privilege?

[goingthedistance]

How can you watch a race in the way you describe.

Both the BBC and Sky have already broadcasted multi channel content with onboard views, and they've found that nobody watches the other views because you can't follow a race from a single onboard feed.

What you're describing is just useless gimmicks that people watch once before they go back to the main commentary feed.

 

What is a useless gimmick to you is compulsory viewing for me. I want the choice of 20 onboards so I can stick with one most of the time - only flicking away from my favourite driver to see a key battle at some point. I do use the current onboard feeds, but it's annoying the way they switch the feed constantly between cars because they have limited feeds (3-4 usually). I want to choose who I watch. A few years back at the track you could hire those Kangaroo TVs and they were terrific as they tended to follow your favourite driver via an onboard for the whole race (providing they were in one of the top teams as they too had limited streams). I found that terrific. Live timing, full radio plus a consistent onboard (ideally in proper HD) feed is ideal for me. 

[johnmhinds]

I suspect nobody here will like the ideas that they might come out with. The point is that they must try to appeal to those who don't follow F1. This means appealing to people who don't care so much about the racing and care more about a spectacle. It'll probably be about the razzmatazz in future. About the celebrities and the entertainers brought in to make the show. The team bosses will probably be encouraged to come on before each race and big up their teams and throw abuse at the other bosses. It's not going to be about what we like anymore.

Why would someone who doesn't care about F1 care about what the team bosses are doing or what some random unrelated celeb was doing there? I don't like Football and the last thing that would make me watch a football match is seeing a couple of middle aged managers arguing before the match.

Trying to appeal to people who don't and will probably never care about the sport is so backwards. Those people aren't going to watch it if at the same time you pissed off all the core fans and made them slag off the sport to their families, friends and work colleagues.

[Marklar]

I'm not subscribing to the Financial Times to read that article.

Just in case someone doesnt have/can find access to the article. A few bits
 

Liberty intends to turn each international Grand Prix into a week of events to engage spectators and attract new sponsors, according to a senior executive involved with Formula One. It is also exploring expanding the contest’s US presence with the launch of new Grand Prix in big media markets. New York, Los Angeles, Las Vegas and Miami are under consideration.[...]

Liberty plans to do more to promote the rivalries between teams and drivers, building a marketing department and new digital platforms. “There’s no marketing, no research, no data, no digital platforms,” the F1 executive said. “This sport has unique global content and hasn’t done enough to take advantage of that. We need to build the rivalries and enable people to understand the technology that goes into the sport.”[...]

After completing the purchase, Liberty believes Formula One has considerable potential, the executive said. “There’s probably no sport more associated with technology and yet we don’t have a technology sponsor.” He added that there were untapped opportunities in merchandising as well as virtual reality, which would bring the F1 experience closer to fans.[...]

Liberty, which has stakes in SiriusXM and Live Nation Entertainment, also wants to beef up Formula One’s presence in western Europe — “it feels like it did 15 years ago,” he added — and then explore the launch of more US races in coming years. It operates a Grand Prix in Austin, Texas, but is keen to have races in larger media markets. “We want to create destination events, not just a race, that people feel they have to be at.”

Edited by Marklar, 29 December 2016 - 15:23.

[LeClerc]

Promote rivalries?  Punch-up at the weigh-in?

[Marklar]

Promote rivalries?  Punch-up at the weigh-in?

I'm glad that Nico is gone. Imagine his and Hamiltons rivalry being "promoted" 

 

 

Didnt LH call for F1 to be more like the Superbowl a couple of weeks ago ... are they taking advice from him now?

He did

 

 

"The way Formula One is run is not good enough at the moment," Hamilton told Time magazine. "The Super Bowl, the events Americans do, the show they put on is so much, so much better.

"So if you were to mix in a little bit of that template through there, I think we’d be more inviting to the fans."

 

But so did the new McLaren boss

 

 

"We need to take a look at the weekend format and how we engage with the consumers in the grandstands, and how close can we get them to our team and drivers," said Brown.

"We go to these cities and [it should be] a big event leading up to it.

"I think the Super Bowl does an excellent job, with their level of fan engagement, they come into town a week before and they take over the cities, the hotels and the airports.

[Slackbladder]

Promote rivalries?  Punch-up at the weigh-in?

 

Sounds Ominiously like the kind of 'Sports Entertainment' aspect.

 

God Forbid we get any kind of 'kayfabe' stuff!

[Nonesuch]

All this fluff worries me. If the racing is crap, who honestly cares? Let's get a financially sustainable series with multiple strong teams and drivers not made mute by corporate leashes.

 

On the other hand, we frequently hear that other racing series are (more) financially sustainable and have more interesting championship battles than F1. Yet 'who honestly cares'? Where are their viewers?

 

A lot of what supposedly makes F1 different from other series is precisely that; fluff. I don't think that's a bad thing. If anything it's convenient: the stories and myths add to the experience of the viewers, and they attract the attention of larger sponsors in search of an audience. Let them create those stories, build those myths. It'd be nothing new.

[InSearchOfThe]

Don't fight it folks, Liberty (an American based company) is going to take control of your precious Formula1.

If you don't dig the NFL or the Super Bowl don't have a closed mind and dismiss it as a gimmick.

The winds of F1's future are blowing in this direction.

You guys do nothing but complain about how this series is ran. Let's see what they propose before condemning the concept.

If the European owners (CVC) had any clue it wouldn't be in the state it is today.

Let's have a little faith that 'The Show' will improve.........

Edited by InSearchOfThe, 29 December 2016 - 16:36.

[pdac]

But how does any of that attract a new audience, especially if they have to pay for the privilege?

 

Why would someone who doesn't care about F1 care about what the team bosses are doing or what some random unrelated celeb was doing there? I don't like Football and the last thing that would make me watch a football match is seeing a couple of middle aged managers arguing before the match.

Trying to appeal to people who don't and will probably never care about the sport is so backwards. Those people aren't going to watch it if at the same time you pissed off all the core fans and made them slag off the sport to their families, friends and work colleagues.

 

I'm not saying that's what I'd do. I'm suggesting that this is what might happen. What I'm suggesting is that they might throw away the F1 race as the primary attraction and include many attractions which are already proven to bring in (paying) audiences.

[pdac]

Promote rivalries?  Punch-up at the weigh-in?

 

This is the kind of thing that I was alluding to when I mentioned bringing on the team bosses before each race to big up their own team and talk down the opposition (sort of like they do with boxing events).

[ANF]

Interesting (albeit paywalled) article in the FT

I think that same article was published here: http://www.irishtime...evamp-1.2920146

[chunder27]

Personally, I can't see any problem with trying to combine other events and F1.

F1 is very specialised and not fan friendly, so why not?

But, it hardly struggles to attract a crowd now so I can't see the problem

[Clatter]

I'm not saying that's what I'd do. I'm suggesting that this is what might happen. What I'm suggesting is that they might throw away the F1 race as the primary attraction and include many attractions which are already proven to bring in (paying) audiences.

 

You could be right, but it seems a very strange way to proceed. They could do a lot of the other stuff without even having the sporting event and they would likely get a large audience turning up. I fully agree with comments about the teams and the sport not engaging with the spectators. Certainly at the BGP the spectators are largely ignored by the teams. The only one that I feel ever gave something back was BMW with their Pit lane experience.

[LORDBYRON]

Didnt LH call for F1 to be more like the Superbowl a couple of weeks ago ... are they taking advice from him now?

They need to start having Monday races withing the same track at a lower price rate for fans and always be on Free to view tv like a Daytona 500 style event using say last years car  where the top 3 gets some sort of prize like a free engine or a free gearbox plus a little wad of cash  or something of this nature 

Edited by LORDBYRON, 29 December 2016 - 17:49.

[jonpollak]

oh the horror...

 

Jp

[Lotus53B]

Let's not dwell on the negatives - 10 teams of cheerleaders (at least) at each race.

[TazioRaikkonen]

Don't fight it folks, Liberty (an American based company) is going to take control of your precious Formula1.

If you don't dig the NFL or the Super Bowl don't have a closed mind and dismiss it as a gimmick.

The winds of F1's future are blowing in this direction.

You guys do nothing but complain about how this series is ran. Let's see what they propose before condemning the concept.

If the European owners (CVC) had any clue it wouldn't be in the state it is today.

Let's have a little faith that 'The Show' will improve.........

Put Raikkonen, Verstappen, Ricciardo, Alonso and Hamilton in V10's with slicks and DRS in separate teams with a budget cap. The show will not be lacking. Not silly gimmicks.

[johnmhinds]

Put Raikkonen, Verstappen, Ricciardo, Alonso and Hamilton in V10's with slicks and DRS in separate teams with a budget cap. The show will not be lacking. Not silly gimmicks.

Your entire post is one giant nostalgic gimmick.

[InSearchOfThe]

Put Raikkonen, Verstappen, Ricciardo, Alonso and Hamilton in V10's with slicks and DRS in separate teams with a budget cap. The show will not be lacking. Not silly gimmicks.

It's almost 2017.

Get out of the past.

V10's are history.

Embrace the future.

There's no turning back.

[maximilian]

Probably much more like THIS bowl:

 

[Neno]

 

i'll delete it if this too much, but I feel that way. 

[TazioRaikkonen]

Your entire post is one giant nostalgic gimmick.

Probably. I mean I don't think F1 should be road relevant. Formula E has that space. F1 should go back to being just extreme. No point in being road friendly.

 

Budget Cap is not nostalgic though. That was forward looking.

Edited by TazioRaikkonen, 29 December 2016 - 20:40.