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2019 F1 Media Driver Ratings


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#1301 shure

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Posted 03 September 2019 - 20:25

Heyli, on 03 Sept 2019 - 20:20, said:

The first 1 obviously is valuable. But how much value do you get from comparing which 1st win is better...?

 

As I said, I know a lot of comparissons we make on the forum are not very valuable, but stilll :).

well I specifically said you can't make those kind of comparisons beyond the fact that they are both first wins.  Circumstances surrounding those wins won't be identical but they both carry higher pressures than other wins would.  Trying to categorise which one is better is futile IMO



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#1302 statman

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:06

here we go again

 

PlanetF1:
 
Leclerc: 9
Ricciardo: 9
Perez: 9
Bottas: 8
Hamilton: 8
Verstappen: 7
Russell: 7
Kvyat: 7
Gasly: 7
Hulkenberg: 7
Giovinazzi: 7
Sainz: 7
Albon: 6
Magnussen: 5
Raikkonen: 4
Grosjean: 4
Kubica: 4
Stroll: 3
Vettel: 2


#1303 Tomerell

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:12

Is the 4 for Räikkönen or for the team which puts wrong tires on the car at the start...

 

Others are more or less on the spot except maybe (close) 10 for the race winner...



#1304 statman

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:33

Tomerell, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:12, said:

Is the 4 for Räikkönen or for the team which puts wrong tires on the car at the start...

 

Others are more or less on the spot except maybe (close) 10 for the race winner...

 

I think it's more about the not so good weekend overall including the crash



#1305 Retrofly

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:34

Did Max get punted at the start or did he just casually drive into the back of someone and destroy his front wing?



#1306 Ivanhoe

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:37

Retrofly, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:34, said:

Did Max get punted at the start or did he just casually drive into the back of someone and destroy his front wing?

He hit Perez’ left rear trying to avoid him, when the pack before him practically came to a halt. Driver mistake.

There’s a video in this link, but it’s possibly geoblocked.

https://www.gids.tv/...el-bij-de-start

Edited by Ivanhoe, 09 September 2019 - 07:44.


#1307 dissident

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:37

Retrofly, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:34, said:

Did Max get punted at the start or did he just casually drive into the back of someone and destroy his front wing?

 

The latter.



#1308 JeePee

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 07:41

Retrofly, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:34, said:

Did Max get punted at the start or did he just casually drive into the back of someone and destroy his front wing?

Max had a strange one. He was the first to brake, took it extremely easy and had no intention to overtake anyone in T1, but was suprised when Perez in front of him almost came to a halt. 
 
A 4 for Kimi is oke I think... he had a horrible weekend. Crash in FP, running wide at Lesmo in Q2, crashing again in Q3 and having not so great pace in the race.


#1309 kernel

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:02

Tomerell, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:12, said:

Is the 4 for Räikkönen or for the team which puts wrong tires on the car at the start...

 

Others are more or less on the spot except maybe (close) 10 for the race winner...

 

4 for crashing in qualifying...



#1310 SenorSjon

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:10

kernel, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:02, said:

4 for crashing in qualifying...

 

It set in motion the pitlane start.



#1311 Retrofly

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:14

Not sure how Max makes a pretty basic blunder and still gets a 7. Albon got shoved off track and gets a 6. I guess maybe you could justify it due to qualy position but the Renaults were rapid. Still dont think Max deserved a better score.



#1312 CountDooku

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:25

Wow. So you make the most schoolboy of errors (crash into the back of someone because you can't judge closing speed) and get a 7????? Did these people not watch the race? But I guess golden child Max can do no wrong despite crashing out two races in a row!  :lol:

 

PS: The only time that happened to me was when I crashed my dad's car when I was seventeen. I was driving in stop go traffic, and was checking out someone walking on the road beside me. Wasn't paying attention that the traffic had stopped in front of me... :rotfl:  :rotfl:  :cry:



#1313 kernel

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:28

statman, on 09 Sept 2019 - 07:06, said:

 

here we go again

 

PlanetF1:
 
Leclerc: 9
Ricciardo: 9
Perez: 9
Bottas: 8
Hamilton: 8
Verstappen: 7
Russell: 7
Kvyat: 7
Gasly: 7
Hulkenberg: 7
Giovinazzi: 7
Sainz: 7
Albon: 6
Magnussen: 5
Raikkonen: 4
Grosjean: 4
Kubica: 4
Stroll: 3
Vettel: 2

 

 

Verstappen getting a 7 is ridiculous... yet again being bailed out by journos.



#1314 Laster

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 08:29

It’s PlanetF1, they’re not really journalists now are they.

#1315 DS27

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:20

Why a 2 point difference between Dan and Hulk?  Other than VSC pit-stop they would have only been a few seconds apart?



#1316 v@sh

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:31

DS27, on 09 Sept 2019 - 09:20, said:

Why a 2 point difference between Dan and Hulk?  Other than VSC pit-stop they would have only been a few seconds apart?

 

Dan had the better qualifying and took out about a 6 second lead after the first stint once he got past Hulk. VSC made the gap go out to around 18 seconds ahead of Hulk (also mention that Hulk was pitted first which strategy favoured toward the undercut but this was more likely to cover Albon who Hulk was racing against as Ricciardo already built his buffer anyway to be ahead of both if he did pit the next lap) which Hulk brought back down to around 11 seconds at the end but this was because Ricciardo was cruising after his stop due partly to the VSC (Prost also confirmed that Dan was cruising to the end and could have easily gone faster) while Hulk still had to push to ensure Albon didn't get the chance to overtake at the end of the race.

 

Hulk had a really solid race but Dan easily had him beat both in the qualifying/race. So the 2 point gap sounds about right, both drivers maximized the car performance though 7 for Hulk is a bit harsh. Extra points to Ricciardo for winning both qualifying and the race despite Hulk getting ahead at the start.


Edited by v@sh, 09 September 2019 - 09:34.


#1317 Requiem84

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:32

CountDooku, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:25, said:

Wow. So you make the most schoolboy of errors (crash into the back of someone because you can't judge closing speed) and get a 7????? Did these people not watch the race? But I guess golden child Max can do no wrong despite crashing out two races in a row! :lol:

PS: The only time that happened to me was when I crashed my dad's car when I was seventeen. I was driving in stop go traffic, and was checking out someone walking on the road beside me. Wasn't paying attention that the traffic had stopped in front of me... :rotfl: :rotfl: :cry:


You’re a native speaker right?

What does crashing out mean in English? :-)

#1318 TomNokoe

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:37

Didn't know PlanetF1 was still taken seriously!  ;)



#1319 statman

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:39

GPToday:
 
Leclerc: 9
Ricciardo: 9
Russell: 8
Perez: 8
Giovinazzi: 8
Norris: 8
Verstappen: 7
Hulkenberg: 7
Gasly: 7
Bottas: 7
Hamilton: 6
Albon: 6
Stroll: 6
Sainz: 6
Kvyat: 5
Raikkonen: 5
Kubica: 5
Magnussen: 3
Grosjean: 3
Vettel: 2
 
Adam Newton with some "interesting marks". Especially Kvyat doesn't make much sense:
 
"was running pretty well inside the top ten and had just made his pit stop when an oil lead forced him to retire from a strong position. Since Albon's promotion, Kvyat has been in good form and hopefully for him that can continue" 
 
euh ok.... then why the 5?  :confused:
 
and before you ask regarding Hamilton:
 
"A rather uncharacteristic mistake from Hamilton cost him the chance to claim a victory and it also lost him P2. Pitting for fresh tyres and setting the fastest lap limited the dent Bottas was able to make into his championship lead to just two points, so it wasn't a great day for Hamilton, but not a disastrous one either."


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#1320 stenovitz

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:40

PlanetF1 is yet on another planet.



#1321 Retrofly

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:41

These scores are triggering me so hard. :lol:


Edited by Retrofly, 09 September 2019 - 09:42.


#1322 shurajan

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:45

statman, on 09 Sept 2019 - 09:39, said:

GPToday:

Leclerc: 9
Ricciardo: 9
Russell: 8
Perez: 8
Giovinazzi: 8
Norris: 8
Verstappen: 7
Hulkenberg: 7
Gasly: 7
Bottas: 7
Hamilton: 6
Albon: 6
Stroll: 6
Sainz: 6
Kvyat: 5
Raikkonen: 5
Kubica: 5
Magnussen: 3
Grosjean: 3
Vettel: 2

Adam Newton with some "interesting marks". Especially Kvyat doesn't make much sense:

"was running pretty well inside the top ten and had just made his pit stop when an oil lead forced him to retire from a strong position. Since Albon's promotion, Kvyat has been in good form and hopefully for him that can continue"

euh ok.... then why the 5? :confused:

and before you ask regarding Hamilton:

"A rather uncharacteristic mistake from Hamilton cost him the chance to claim a victory and it also lost him P2. Pitting for fresh tyres and setting the fastest lap limited the dent Bottas was able to make into his championship lead to just two points, so it wasn't a great day for Hamilton, but not a disastrous one either."

What??? Kvyat - 5??? If not for the engine he would have been ahead of RB in the race...

Edited by shurajan, 09 September 2019 - 09:47.


#1323 JeePee

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:46

statman, on 09 Sept 2019 - 09:39, said:

 

GPToday:
 
Verstappen: 7
Hamilton: 6

 

Kernel right now:

 



#1324 kernel

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:51

JeePee, on 09 Sept 2019 - 09:46, said:

Kernel right now:

 

 

Not really. I don't even know what GPToday is... but based on the explanation that "journo" gave for the rating, it sounds to me like he was watching a different race than the rest of us.



#1325 shure

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:56

kernel, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:28, said:

Verstappen getting a 7 is ridiculous... yet again being bailed out by journos.

You have to wonder what some of these base their ratings on.  Ricciardo basically cruised around the track all day and the gap between him and his team mate was helped in no small way by the safety car, while Hulk managed to gain a place on Vettel at the start, before losing it to the Ferrari's superior power, and gets rated two below.  And Ricciardo gets the same rating as Leclerc and one higher than Hamilton.  What challenge did he have to overcome, exactly?  Leclerc had to overcome the pressure of a hard-charging Hamilton pretty much the entire race, while Hamilton drove his nuts off keeping within a second of the Ferrari and throwing everything but the kitchen sink at Leclerc.  How that's seen as less impressive than Ricciardo circling around on his own is beyond me.  And Bottas the same as Hamilton?  Don't get that, either.  He was never a threat



#1326 JeePee

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 09:58

GPToday was formerly F1Today and is your everyday average F1 website. But it is one of the best during winter testing, with live updates right from the track with more info (tyres and stuff) than here at Autosport.



#1327 Ultraviolet

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:07

statman, on 09 Sept 2019 - 09:39, said:

[Edited by me]

 

GPToday:
 

Bottas: 7
Hamilton: 6

Adam Newton with some "interesting marks".
 
and before you ask regarding Hamilton:
 
"A rather uncharacteristic mistake from Hamilton cost him the chance to claim a victory and it also lost him P2. Pitting for fresh tyres and setting the fastest lap limited the dent Bottas was able to make into his championship lead to just two points, so it wasn't a great day for Hamilton, but not a disastrous one either."

 

 

I think it is right that Bottas should be rated above Hamilton for this race. He played it canny and saved his tyres, ready to attack at the end. Hamilton couldn't make the pass, and used up his tyres.

 

But 7 and 6 looks harsh. The Merc was not the best car out there, and Charles kept Hamilton behind by one foul move that got a "yellow card" and by cutting a corner, which would normally have been penalised, especially after the first incident. 8 and 7 would seem more reasonable for getting both cars on the podium against a faster car whose driver overstepped the limits of legality; the 7 for Hamilton acknowledging how close he came to beating a faster car, but also his mistake.

 

And just for clarity, I think the black and white flag for the first incident was absolutely right. It's a good way to mark someone's card without spoiling the racing. But they then went and ruined it by not penalising him for the corner cut. That should have been worth a 5 second penalty. The black and white flag will only work if subsequent infringements ARE dealt with.



#1328 TheFish

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:14

Following the chat on the previous page, I only come to this thread for Marklar's table.



#1329 geralt

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:14

Bottas and Hamilton should get the same rating, Hamilton outqualified him and would have finished ahead if not for getting the short end of the stick with the strategy.

#1330 NixxxoN

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:16

Ultraviolet, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:07, said:

I think it is right that Bottas should be rated above Hamilton for this race. He played it canny and saved his tyres, ready to attack at the end. Hamilton couldn't make the pass, and used up his tyres.

 

No way in hell. Bottas was useless. He nursed the tires all the time by staying behind, pitted later, had fresher tires than both the other two, and yet he could not make a decent attack attempt at all, can't get the car close in dirty air. He's one of those "drivers and not racers"



#1331 JBJ

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:16

CountDooku, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:25, said:

Wow. So you make the most schoolboy of errors (crash into the back of someone because you can't judge closing speed) and get a 7????? Did these people not watch the race? But I guess golden child Max can do no wrong despite crashing out two races in a row!  :lol:

 

PS: The only time that happened to me was when I crashed my dad's car when I was seventeen. I was driving in stop go traffic, and was checking out someone walking on the road beside me. Wasn't paying attention that the traffic had stopped in front of me... :rotfl:  :rotfl:  :cry:

Unbelievable, and Hamilton an 8 while crashing out of the race !



#1332 selespeed

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:17

Bottas is a disgrace...when he was told on the radio it was his race...don't think even his mom belived it

#1333 DeKnyff

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:18

Laster, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:29, said:

It’s PlanetF1, they’re not really journalists now are they.

Actually, ratings don't seem so wrong.



#1334 DeKnyff

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:22

JBJ, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:16, said:

Unbelievable, and Hamilton an 8 while crashing out of the race !

He didn't crash out of the race and at least half of the field went off-track at some moment. Including Leclerc.



#1335 statman

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:37

CountDooku, on 09 Sept 2019 - 08:25, said:

Wow. So you make the most schoolboy of errors (crash into the back of someone because you can't judge closing speed) and get a 7????? Did these people not watch the race? But I guess golden child Max can do no wrong despite crashing out two races in a row!  :lol:

 

PS: The only time that happened to me was when I crashed my dad's car when I was seventeen. I was driving in stop go traffic, and was checking out someone walking on the road beside me. Wasn't paying attention that the traffic had stopped in front of me... :rotfl:  :rotfl:  :cry:

 

pro-hamilton, anti-verstappen poster says it's only happened to him when he was 17, but how about the times his hero has done it?

 

 

golden child can do no wrong!!!

 

:drunk:



#1336 JeePee

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:49

They were even accelerating there, weren't they? #offtopic

 


Edited by JeePee, 09 September 2019 - 10:50.


#1337 Marklar

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:56

AMuS
 

  • Charles Leclerc: 10/10
  • Valtteri Bottas: 8/10
  • Lewis Hamilton: 9/10
  • Daniel Ricciardo: 10/10
  • Nico Hülkenberg: 8/10
  • Alexander Albon: 7/10
  • Sergio Pérez: 9/10
  • Max Verstappen: 7/10
  • Antonio Giovinazzi: 8/10
  • Lando Norris: 8/10
  • Pierre Gasly: 6/10
  • Lance Stroll: 7/10
  • Sebastian Vettel: 3/10
  • George Russell: 9/10
  • Kimi Räikkönen: 3/10
  • Romain Grosjean: 5/10
  • Robert Kubica: 5/10
  • Kevin Magnussen: 6/10
  • Daniil Kvyat: 6/10
  • Carlos Sainz: 7/10


#1338 JBJ

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:57

DeKnyff, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:22, said:

He didn't crash out of the race and at least half of the field went off-track at some moment. Including Leclerc.

You're missing the point



#1339 Heyli

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 10:58

Marklar, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:56, said:

 

AMuS
 

  • Charles Leclerc: 10/10
  • Valtteri Bottas: 8/10
  • Lewis Hamilton: 9/10
  • Daniel Ricciardo: 10/10
  • Nico Hülkenberg: 8/10
  • Alexander Albon: 7/10
  • Sergio Pérez: 9/10
  • Max Verstappen: 7/10
  • Antonio Giovinazzi: 8/10
  • Lando Norris: 8/10
  • Pierre Gasly: 6/10
  • Lance Stroll: 7/10
  • Sebastian Vettel: 3/10
  • George Russell: 9/10
  • Kimi Räikkönen: 3/10
  • Romain Grosjean: 5/10
  • Robert Kubica: 5/10
  • Kevin Magnussen: 6/10
  • Daniil Kvyat: 6/10
  • Carlos Sainz: 7/10

 

A 10 for Charles and Daniel seems a bit too much...

 

As does the 9 for Hamilton.

 

I also wonder on what basis they are rating Russell, but that is an honest question as I simply have no idea how to rate him... :)



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#1340 Kvothe

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:00

The point isn't that Lewis made those mistakes, I don't think any Lewis fan would consider them more than rudimentary, although for Hamilton he at least had the excuse he made them in only his second season. I think the point is that a self inflicted error that ruined his comparative race, was still rewarded with a 7. Yes Max had a great drive afterwards, but to make his race comparable to Bottas or Hulkenberg who had strong if not impressive drives and didn't make a race destroying mistake is head scratching. 



#1341 statman

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:09

Crash.net:
 
Leclerc: 10
Ricciardo: 10
Hamilton: 9
Russell: 8
Giovinazzi: 8
Perez: 8
Hulkenberg: 8
Bottas: 8
Verstappen: 7
Sainz: 7
Norris: 7
Kvyat: 7
Albon: 6
Magnussen: 6
Gasly: 6
Stroll: 6
Grosjean: 5
Raikkonen: 5
Kubica: 5
Vettel: 3


#1342 Marklar

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:10

Autosport

Ricciardo - 10

Leclerc, Hamilton, Giovanazzi, Kvyat - 9

Perez, Bottas, Hulkenberg, Stroll, Russel- 8

Magnussen, Norris, Sainz , Gasly, Albon, Verstappen - 7

Kubica - 6

Grosjean - 5

Raikkonen, Vettel - 4

(taken from Reddit)



#1343 Heyli

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:16

Marklar, on 09 Sept 2019 - 11:10, said:

Autosport

Ricciardo - 10

Leclerc, Hamilton, Giovanazzi, Kvyat - 9

Perez, Bottas, Hulkenberg, Stroll, Russel- 8

Magnussen, Norris, Sainz , Gasly, Albon, Verstappen - 7

Kubica - 6

Grosjean - 5

Raikkonen, Vettel - 4

(taken from Reddit)

Stroll has quite big deviations in his score across all Media!

 

3 the lowest, 8 the highest I think? 



#1344 CSF

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:20

Struggling to give Lewis above a 7 personally. If the Mercedes drivers had been reversed it would have been "oh bottas cooked his tyres, couldn't pass Sharl and then bottled it." so I struggle to see why its different with Lewis. 



#1345 NixxxoN

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:25

CSF, on 09 Sept 2019 - 11:20, said:

Struggling to give Lewis above a 7 personally. If the Mercedes drivers had been reversed it would have been "oh bottas cooked his tyres, couldn't pass Sharl and then bottled it." so I struggle to see why its different with Lewis. 

 

Lewis was at Leclerc's gearbox for many laps, bottas couldn't even get close for more than 1 lap without making a mistake, he struggles badly in dirty air.

Leclerc was almost impossible to pass because the straightline speed and acceleration was so damn good, the Mercs didnt even seem to catch up even with DRS open, they were only gaining on corners



#1346 CSF

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:29

NixxxoN, on 09 Sept 2019 - 11:25, said:

Lewis was at Leclerc's gearbox for many laps, bottas couldn't even get close for more than 1 lap without making a mistake, he struggles badly in dirty air.

Leclerc was almost impossible to pass because the straightline speed and acceleration was so damn good, the Mercs didnt even seem to catch up even with DRS open, they were only gaining on corners

 

That doesn't make Hamilton's race a 9 though, nor does it disprove my thoughts that had the Merc's been the other way around the reaction would have been different. 



#1347 geralt

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:32

CSF, on 09 Sept 2019 - 11:29, said:

That doesn't make Hamilton's race a 9 though, nor does it disprove my thoughts that had the Merc's been the other way around the reaction would have been different.

If Hamilton had been given the better strategy and then literally made three mistakes in a row when it was time to attack Leclerc in the latter stages of the races, people would be slating him for not doing anything and being lucky to finish 2nd.

Hell, Hamilton gets points knocked out of his rating for any small lock-ups even when he wins.


A 9 is too much, though, that I agree with but I think it's hard to argue that Hamilton was worse than Bottas at monza

Edited by geralt, 09 September 2019 - 11:34.


#1348 Tsarwash

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:32

DeKnyff, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:18, said:

Actually, ratings don't seem so wrong.

I'm not a fan of Stroll, and didn't follow him too closely in the race, but when he was collected by Vettel, he was running 7th, while his teammate was recovering from a bad qualifying but I think was seven places behind him. He did cause a car to take evasive action, when righting himself, but I'm not sure how much of that was his own fault. So, PlanetF1 gave Perez a 9 and Stroll a 3. That doesn't seem to fair to me. Until he was collected in an incident that was not his fault, he was running far ahead of his teammate. 

Edit, forgot to post this chart. 

https://www.statsf1....r-par-tour.aspx


Edited by Tsarwash, 09 September 2019 - 11:35.


#1349 v@sh

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:34

Heyli, on 09 Sept 2019 - 10:58, said:

A 10 for Charles and Daniel seems a bit too much...

 

As does the 9 for Hamilton.

 

I also wonder on what basis they are rating Russell, but that is an honest question as I simply have no idea how to rate him... :)

 

Why would it be a bit too much?

 

Leclerc got pole and won the race, sure his racing was hard but he withstood pressure from both Hamilton/Bottas for a well deserved win and maximized the result for Ferrari.

 

Same with Dan, put the Renault in a good qualy position and scored the maximum points given what happened to Vettel/Verstappen. Both drivers beat their team-mates in both qualifying/race. I don't know what you expect for a 10 but both pretty much had a clean weekend with no issues.



#1350 CSF

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 11:35

geralt, on 09 Sept 2019 - 11:32, said:

If Hamilton had been given the better strategy and then literally made three mistakes in a row when it was time to attack Leclerc in the latter stages of the races, people would be slating him for not doing anything and being lucky to finish 2nd.

Hell, Hamilton gets points knocked out of his rating for any small lock-ups even when he wins

 

I mean he really doesn't.  :lol:

 

The strategy call is subjective, as if Bottas got the call to pit first and Hamilton was undercut there would be complaints. If Lewis had got past Sharl in the early stages he would have been pulling away, so its not Black and White to say one got the better strategy. Hamilton got the only strategy that made sense at the time, especially when Ferrari went onto Hards.