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Mika Salo leaking stewarding decisions to Finnish media?


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#1 Topsu

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:26

Long story short, Mika Salo keeps leaking stewarding decisions to the Finnish broadcaster CMore, most probably straight to the commentator Niki Juusela who Salo has been working with as a commentator himself on many occasions. Today in Sochi, Salo was the driver steward, and right as the cars got on the warm up lap, Juusela started talking about "breaking news" how Hamilton was going to get 2 x 5 second penalties, and that it would be announced "shortly". Officially these penalties were not announced until over 20 minutes later on lap 7. Juusela was also saying that Hamilton had been given 2+2 penalty points, and was pretty much confirming that he would be getting a race ban for Germany. Seemingly these were reduced to 1+1 later, which means that Salo is texting him in the middle of an ongoing negotiation, not even giving confirmed information.

 

This is not the first time this has happened, as most of the times when Salo is a driver steward, CMore seems to be very well informed on potential penalties well ahead of them being announced. Today was the most egregious example of this happening however, as Juusela almost couldn't contain his excitement upon getting this secret text message (I assume it's text messages). If I remember correctly, he even mentioned that he is getting information "direct from Sochi".

 

In my opinion this is a terrible thing for the integrity of the stewarding, and should be investigated. However, as this stuff happens in the Finnish language broadcast, probably nothing is going to happen about it. To me it is a bit scandalous, but I could be overreacting. In theory I could clip the Finnish broadcast and add subtitles, if that would be any help.

 

Mika Salo today with his phone on the table:

 

L3T8lOD.jpg

 

Not damning evidence in any way, but I wonder if the other stewards are wondering who he keeps messaging...

 

edit.

 

Revised timeline for the CMore video clips (Sochi times):

 

14:43

 

https://streamable.com/1p8vyp

 

-The investigation into Hamilton's practice starts was broadcasted on television at 14:42, and CMore immediately announce that according to their "information from Sochi", Hamilton is about to get a penalty. They speculate that the penalty could range from 5 seconds to a drive-through. There is no mention of there being 2 separate infractions by Hamilton. What's curious about this first clip is how the presenter Mervi Kallio reacts to the announcement of Hamilton's investigation. What she says there is "Ossi, there we got some fresh information about Hamilton's situation". What situation? You cannot tell for sure, but to me it sounds like they could have already been aware about Hamilton's investigation before this moment. After the official announcement, they can now talk about it.

 

 

14:52

 

*no video clip*

 

-It is mentioned on CMore that according to "information from Russia", the latest "educated guess" is that Hamilton might get away with a monetary sanction, and no penalty will be given for the race. There is still no mention of there being 2 separate infractions by Hamilton, and the situation is not mentioned or speculated on until the next clip at 15:08.

 

 

15:08

 

https://streamable.com/m8k0aw

 

-As the cars are readying for the formation lap, a graphic is again shown that says Hamilton is under investigation. This most likely prompts Juusela into saying that CMore has obtained information about Hamilton getting a 2 x 5 second penalty, and that his penalty points will be filled. He claims that an official confirmation will be coming "shortly", but it won't come until 20 minutes later on lap 7, after the first SC period is over. Neither Juusela or Oikarinen seem to question why there are two penalties. They only ever mention one practice start, and seem to assume that both penalties come from the same incident, or at least they don't speculate on the reasoning of the double penalty. In fact possible penalties are not talked about at all after Oikarinen's initial predictions at 14:43. No specific rules or previous cases have been mentioned.

 

 

15:24

 

https://streamable.com/g1181u

 

-During the SC period, after the initial replays are done, Juusela returns to the topic of Hamilton's penalty and says they are still waiting for the "official confirmation", but they are still "assuming" that a 2 x 5 second penalty is coming, with penalty points possibly causing a race ban for Nürburging. Again, there is still no mention of there being 2 separate infractions by Hamilton, yet they are expecting a 2 x 5 second penalty.

 

 

15:30

 

https://streamable.com/1dbf02

 

-As the penalty is announced, Juusela is clearly expecting the 2 x 5 second penalty, and is initially confused when only the first 5 second penalty is announced. He is possibly heard clicking the FIA website on his computer as he seeks confirmation for the second penalty, which is then given. This is also the first time they mention there being two infractions.

 

 

15:32 and 16:17

 

https://streamable.com/iybf1k

 

-A few minutes later, for some reason Juusela claims that the stewards are confirming the 4 penalty points, and he seems convinced that Hamilton is going to get banned from the next race, as if the "source" just confirmed it. He then happens to mention how Mika Salo is a steward for the weekend. From this point on until lap 36, they are convinced about Hamilton getting the race ban. Then at 16:17 on lap 36, Juusela seemingly gets the official announcement of Hamilton getting 1+1 penalty points. I assume this is around the moment the penalty points were officially released? After that, Juusela mentions how they have been getting their information from "quite close to the stewards" during the course of the race, and this information is now getting confirmed.

 

 

That is all I can provide. To me, this is an obvious case of stewarding decisions being leaked in advance. Juusela denies that his source is Salo, but at the same time he admits there is a "source", which is obvious based on their broadcast and multiple mentions of "information from Sochi/Russia". With the covid protocols, the paddock is currently awfully sparse, so not that many sources can be speculated on. We know that CMore has no people on the paddock, so it must be someone from outside the production. A closeness to the stewarding decisions is heavily implied.


Edited by Topsu, 30 September 2020 - 01:25.


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#2 Ben1980

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:28

I find this very hard to be remotely bothered about.

#3 Marklar

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:28

tbh while this is damn unprofessional, at least it gives you insight into their work (in this case that the FIA likely reduced the penalty points to avoid a ban), I prefer this over everything being kept a secret.



#4 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:29

It's unprofessional but is it actually affecting the stewards decisions?



#5 Muppetmad

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:30

If true, it is an egregious abuse of power, and Salo should not serve as a steward ever again. I hope the FIA will give this the attention it deserves, and reviews stewarding practices going forward to stop things like this happening again.

 

That said, I expect nothing of the sort.


Edited by Muppetmad, 27 September 2020 - 13:31.


#6 68targa

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:30

Decision has been made - not an issue



#7 SophieB

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:31

tbh while this is damn unprofessional, at least it gives you insight into their work (in this case that the FIA likely reduced the penalty points to avoid a ban), I prefer this over everything being kept a secret.

The issue I’d have is from the point of view of the other stewards/ the process as a whole. How would anyone like to be having discussions knowing what they say to him is likely going on Twitter.



#8 ARTGP

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:31

If true, it is an egregious abuse of power, and Salo should not serve as a steward ever again. I hope the FIA will give this the attention it deserves, and reviews stewarding practices going forward to stop things like this happening again.

 

That said, I expect nothing of the sort.

 

How is it a breach of power? It's a public decision.



#9 Topsu

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:32

It's unprofessional but is it actually affecting the stewards decisions?

Who knows, maybe Juusela keeps egging him on to ban Hamilton or something? Why would Salo need to message any outsiders? I don't think any outside feedback is needed in that room.



#10 TomNokoe

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:32

This just tells me the atmosphere in the stewards' room was more centered around drama than actually applying the rules objectively. I'm sure Salo enjoyed the intrigue. Antithesis of sport.

#11 ARTGP

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:32

The issue I’d have is from the point of view of the other stewards/ the process as a whole. How would anyone like to be having discussions knowing what they say to him is likely going on Twitter.

 

Great point. I don't get the impression Mika knows what Twitter is but I don't know about the others in the group.



#12 PayasYouRace

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:34

This just tells me the atmosphere in the stewards' room was more centered around drama than actually applying the rules objectively. I'm sure Salo enjoyed the intrigue. Antithesis of sport.

 

Well it doesn't really. It highlights Salo's attitude to the stewards woom, and not the atmosphere as a whole. They also applied the rules objectively irrespective of Salo's messages.



#13 Muppetmad

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:36

How is it a breach of power? It's a public decision.

Leaking information before it is formally announced is an evident abuse of power. How do we know that Salo didn't also, for example, leak that information to one or a handful of teams to help them inform their strategy early on? One simply cannot tell how such information can be used by competitors to their own advantage. It's why stewards need to be professional: everybody should find out about stewarding decisions at the same time when they are made during a race.



#14 Hezekiah

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:36

Imagine in football a VAR ref texting BT Sport about an incoming decision on a match being shown Sky.

#15 Jellyfishcake

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:36

Whilst it's not great to be leaking info, I think you are blowing this wide out of proportion,



#16 P123

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:38

The easy solution is for him not to be invited back as a steward.  There are official announcements, which the press rely on.  You can't really have uncontrolled information being leaked from inside the stewarding room.  In this instance it turns out they were incorrect re. race ban, but given there was a large time discrepancy between the apparent leak and the official announcement, what is to say there then wasn't some pressure applied/ or discussions were not still ongoing?  So not really a nothing.



#17 Disgrace

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:38

I mean, do we want the stewarding process to be more opaque?



#18 jjcale

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:38

Well, this is the end of Salo as a steward ....  I would be amazed if he was ever invited back.



#19 Topsu

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:38

Whilst it's not great to be leaking info, I think you are blowing this wide out of proportion,

I just decided to put the information out there, make of it what you will. I did also report this in the race thread, and a few laps later BAM, there is was, 2 x 5 second penalty. Not how things should work IMO.



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#20 MasterOfCoin

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:38

What about the fact he could be getting influenced from an outside source....

#21 SophieB

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:39

It's unprofessional but is it actually affecting the stewards decisions?

telling the media what sporting penalty you are thinking of applying creates the distinct impression you have one eye on how your decision is going to be received by the media and that shouldn’t really come into it, in my view. 



#22 Whatisvalis

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:39

How is it a breach of power? It's a public decision.


It's not a public decision - just look at the mess DOTD is! And the investigation was not complete if Salo is leaking 2+2 penalty points to the media and then 1+1 is announced.

The steward system has forever been rotten in F1.

#23 jjcale

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:39

Also - that there are folks here defending this or brushing it off as unimportant is staggering to me....



#24 P123

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:40

Well it doesn't really. It highlights Salo's attitude to the stewards woom, and not the atmosphere as a whole. They also applied the rules objectively irrespective of Salo's messages.

 

It could indicate that Salo was so excited by it that he couldn't wait to do his mate a favour by giving him a sensational scoop.  He himself may therefore have been swayed either way by the ultimate potential outcome of the multiple penalties applied.



#25 SonGoku

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:40

F1 is a joke sport, the Ferrari engine decision, this, it's just a cowboy sport with ''rules'' when they like them.

#26 klyster

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:41

Definitely a huge breach of code of ethics imo...



#27 Marklar

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:41

Leaking information before it is formally announced is an evident abuse of power. How do we know that Salo didn't also, for example, leak that information to one or a handful of teams to help them inform their strategy early on? One simply cannot tell how such information can be used by competitors to their own advantage. It's why stewards need to be professional: everybody should find out about stewarding decisions at the same time when they are made during a race.

while I agree with this I think that's a bit unrealistic to expect. Journalists and team members have so many sources within teams and the FIA nowadays that it's almost impossible to ensure that.



#28 1Devil1

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:42

Whilst it's not great to be leaking info, I think you are blowing this wide out of proportion,

 

What about potential influence on betting. People could pull out their money on a Lewis win before sites like Bwin know that. There is a reason for official decisions



#29 FLB

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:42

It's not a public decision - just look at the mess DOTD is! And the investigation was not complete if Salo is leaking 2+2 penalty points to the media and then 1+1 is announced.

The steward system has forever been rotten in F1.

It reminded of 2007, when Autosport had a headline that McLaren would be banned for two years... before the second Spygate hearing was over.


Edited by FLB, 27 September 2020 - 13:43.


#30 Topsu

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:43

What about potential influence on betting. People could pull out their money on a Lewis win before sites like Bwin know that. There is a reason for official decisions

Goddamnit. I should have gone all-in on a Bottas win when Juusela started blabbering! :rotfl:



#31 jjcale

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:43

And just in case there are people here who dont get it ... when you are in a position of power, particularly when you sit in judgement of others, you have to be seen to be above reproach .... even small infractions on your part are fatal to your position. 

 

I know the FIA is a joke .... but it is not a complete joke.... Salo is done.  



#32 Whatisvalis

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:44

F1 is a joke sport, the Ferrari engine decision, this, it's just a cowboy sport with ''rules'' when they like them.


I think a lot of folks don't release how incestuous the F1 paddock is and the bias this can create - it's why we need a set of stewards that can apply the rules in a consistent and safe manner.

#33 MinardiCrashDummy

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:44

What about potential influence on betting. People could pull out their money on a Lewis win before sites like Bwin know that. There is a reason for official decisions

 

You have point there, salo has his phone could have put a cheeky bet on bottas to win.



#34 Marklar

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:46

Goddamnit. I should have gone all-in on a Bottas win when Juusela started blabbering! :rotfl:

Yesterday evening he was 8/1 I think, missed opportunites, etc.



#35 Clrnc

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:46

Not ethical but nothing issue here



#36 Timantti

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:48

I mean Mika Salo is as far from objective as possible. He always mocks Grosjean for being a whiny little prat. So it never surprises me that Grosjean always gets penalized when he is one of the stewards  :D


Edited by Timantti, 27 September 2020 - 13:48.


#37 Jvr

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:53

I am more concerned about the Stewards changing their penalty points decision once they realised it would cause a race ban for Lewis in Germany.



#38 Pimpwerx

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 13:58

This was my main complaint about the penalty, the fact that a steward was leaking the results to media. IMO, it brings into question their objectivity, as I think professionalism is a core component in trustworthiness. 

 

The penalty itself was justified. I blame Lewis and the team for that. I'm relieved that the points did not result in a race ban, but I can't get over Salo leaking info out. If he's that eager to get news to his friends in the media, what does that say about his ability to make reasonable decisions about the incidents he's investigating? Is he going to decide in favor of entertainment value for his media friends, or will he be judging strictly based on the regulations? 

 

In the end, I can't separate my own bias in this matter, as it might be clouding my judgement. However, I think it's fair to say that stewards should not be communicating with the media before they relay information to race control, and race control then relays that information via the official broadcast. There shouldn't be any impression of impropriety when it comes to regulation of a sport. Like a VAR judge texting a national broadcast about a decision that impacts the result of a game, before the international broadcast gets it. It's not a good look.


Edited by Pimpwerx, 27 September 2020 - 13:59.


#39 ajcrean

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:00

Is there any actual evidence against Salo, apart from the OP's accusations?  The fact that Hamilton was under investigation for two separate infringements was posted by Race Control just before the formation lap got underway.  Furthermore it was stated they were for practice starts made outside the designated zone.  You don't need a Steward to tell you that a driver is very likely to get a time penalty of some sort for that infringement.

 

We should be careful of trashing someone's reputation unless we actually have some real evidence...



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#40 ARTGP

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:01

This was my main complaint about the penalty, the fact that a steward was leaking the results to media. IMO, it brings into question their objectivity, as I think professionalism is a core component in trustworthiness. 

 

But this isn't the straw the breaks the camel's back now is it?

 

We've drawn the stewards into question long long before this for issues that didn't involve Hamilton...


Edited by ARTGP, 27 September 2020 - 14:01.


#41 Jazza

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:03

Why does anyone care that he has his phone on the table? He’s using a tablet in that very photo! 😂

#42 Pimpwerx

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:03

But this isn't the straw the breaks the camel's back now is it?

 

We've drawn the stewards into question long long before this for issues that didn't involve Hamilton...

Oh, you're 100% correct on this. This is just the latest issue to raise my blood pressure. Yes, there's been beef with stewarding for years now.



#43 Topsu

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:08

Is there any actual evidence against Salo, apart from the OP's accusations?  The fact that Hamilton was under investigation for two separate infringements was posted by Race Control just before the formation lap got underway.  Furthermore it was stated they were for practice starts made outside the designated zone.  You don't need a Steward to tell you that a driver is very likely to get a time penalty of some sort for that infringement.

 

We should be careful of trashing someone's reputation unless we actually have some real evidence...

Good point. I will make a video where the Finnish broadcast broke the news, on the warm-up lap. To me it's evident beyond reasonable that at that moment Salo messaged them, as it has already happened before.



#44 Baddoer

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:09

If it wasn't Hamilton or say Verstappen i'm sure nobody would ever care.



#45 Shambolic

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:11

F1 fans: The stewards are too shady, we demand transparency

 

Also F1 fans: Unless it's about a penalty for The Ham



#46 Nobody

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:13

I'm still astounded betting agencies allow bets on this sport

#47 Marklar

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:13

I am more concerned about the Stewards changing their penalty points decision once they realised it would cause a race ban for Lewis in Germany.

I picture the poor dude who is doing the protocol writting up the verdict with "(2 penalty points imposed, total of 12 points in the 12-month period, banned for the next Event)" and being all like "wait wait guys guys, we have a problem here"  :lol: 
 



#48 ExFlagMan

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:13

I was under the impression that a stewards decision is only valid once it has been officially posted

 

In the one or two stewards meetings I have been 'invited' too attend (only as a witness :) ), we were always warned before hand not to discuss anything about what went on until the decision had been officially posted.



#49 Jordan44

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:17

This just tells me the atmosphere in the stewards' room was more centered around drama than actually applying the rules objectively. I'm sure Salo enjoyed the intrigue. Antithesis of sport.


Exactly. Sato texting his mates what's happening is the equivalent of us running to Twitter or the forum to be the first to share it when something big happens because we're excited by it.

He is clearly not taking the role seriously.

#50 ajcrean

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Posted 27 September 2020 - 14:17

Good point. I will make a video where the Finnish broadcast broke the news, on the warm-up lap. To me it's evident beyond reasonable that at that moment Salo messaged them, as it has already happened before.

 

Ah: have just checked the Race Control feed and the infringements were noted at 11:48 local; F1.com tweeted about them at 11:51: a full 19 minutes before the formation lap even started:

 

(EDIT: can't work out how to paste the Twitter feed)

 

So I think the "case" against Mika Salo just took a little knock to its credibility...

 

PS: the Sky UK commentators also seemed to catch on just as the formation lap got underway.


Edited by ajcrean, 27 September 2020 - 14:21.